LS Room for improvement.

[I have no memory]

I'm a small farmer looking for a tractor that I can do my planting, some tillage, hay mowing, etc. with. I have to have a cab and at least 70 hp for my disc mower. I've looked into LS and spotted them at the National Farm Show last year and got a price on one that I think is not very competitive. Still, if it were here are my relatively newbie thoughts on LS.

It seems LS came out a few years ago and said they want to be in the top four or five in US by 2012. A few weeks ago an article was posted where they cut their incentive agreement with the city, where they distribute their tractors from, because they aren't going to meet employment goals. Granted they came in during rough economic times but I think their not growing as fast as they thought. The US is saturated with compact tractor makers and their are less margins on the smaller tractors than the big ones, (that's why their all made overseas).

From the looks of it LS makes a good tractor but I think they need to improve. They have very few dealers and while they come with a lot of features, their transmissions leave something to be desired. Hydraulic shuttle with synchronized transmission is good, and I think is standard on the 70XX models for 2011, but not awesome. When you just put in a synchronized mechanical reverser transmission on, (not hydraulic), you open up a whole can of worms including used models of other brands going back to the 90's.

LS is backed by LG which is good in that they should be able to weather some tough economic times but is bad because they are a corporation who answers to stock holders. That means that eventually they will want to please them more than the end users.

LS makes and now markets their own branded tractor. I think that is good and I think Kubota is the only other real player in the US that does that for their size of tractors. Unlike Kubota, LS gets their engines from other manufacturers. I like Mitsubishi, (I have essentially a Mitsubishi excavator with Mitsubishi engine in it and it is fantastic.), but am not a big fan of Iveco engines. I'm sure their OK but I would not put an Iveco above a Kubota but I would say the Mitsubishi is as good or better than Kubota, again IMO.

LS needs to offer hydraulic shuttle in their utility line and as far as I know they don't.

I'd love to trade in my CUT and get an LS CUT, buy an Ls utility with loader and the larger LS w/o loader and I'd be set but with their price point and features I can't see that happening right now. I can see the CUT happening sooner than the others because it does look like the LS CUT can compete with any of the other guys.

Just my rant and opinion.

 

[rocknrod]

... I've looked into LS and spotted them at the National Farm Show last year and got a price on one that I think is not very competitive. ...

Sure would like you to find one with more competitive price and standard features.

... I think their not growing as fast as they thought. The US is saturated with compact tractor makers and their are less margins on the smaller tractors than the big ones, (that's why their all made overseas).

Thats probably why they have such a competitive price on them.

LS is backed by LG which is good in that they should be able to weather some tough economic times but is bad because they are a corporation who answers to stock holders. That means that eventually they will want to please them more than the end users.

So what tractor corporation doesnt? John Deere? Guess again.

LS makes and now markets their own branded tractor.... the Mitsubishi is as good or better than Kubota, again IMO.
...

Exactly.

 

[rocknrod]

I read another post of yours, where you got your prices from tractorhouse.
I think I see where your coming from.
If your getting your prices from Tractorhouse your getting some really outrageously priced tractors.
Try a dealer, shop around. Get educated!

 

[I have no memory]

The price for the 7030C w/o loader at $37,390 is from a dealer.

There are the CNH Farmal tractors that are similar that I can get with a few program hours on them for the low to mide $30's, (from a dealer). I would rather have an LS than a CNH Farmal for the tractor but the CNH dealer network, and therefore parts availability, is alot better in my area.

As far as competative price and standard features in my book the two main features on a tractor are transmission and engine. On the larger LS models those two items do not stand out. When you look at other features I'm not sure what would stand out but most of the standard features on the LS are standard on the other manufacturers tractors or frufru. I'm not sure but when I was asked what I wanted on my LS tractor he asked if I wanted air conditioning. I said isn't that standard and he said sometimes not. Now he also was a dealer for Deutz so he may have been referring to that. Like I said before I think that LS is making the hydraulic shuttle standard in the larger models. While all other manufacturers have hydraulic shuttle shift if LS can make that standard and keep their price below others hydraulic that would be good. And, like I said, the Ivecoe does not stand out IMO. It's a sleevless design engine from a new joint venture company with CNH. While parts for it will be available from CNH if LS went out of town I still would prefer a Mitsubishi. So, I gues that's my point, make a hydraulic shuttle tractor with sized right Mitsubishi engine in it and you will stand out IMO. Put a mechanical shuttle with an Iveco engine on it and your not going to.

I'm sure you mean the "get educated" in the most positive sense possible. How do you suggest I do that more than I've done? When I saw them at the farm show I wasn't even interested or looking for another tractor so only did the cursory look. Prices quoted, (which I can't find), I remember being in the ball park of other manufactorers. I've contacted my local dealer and asked him questions. They don't stock the size tractor I'm looking at so I can't test drive it or look at it. I've searched the web and that's how I found this place. I liked what you guys are saying so I joined. I've combed over LS's website but it's not really that informative or up to date. The LS literature I have is one page back to back for each series of tractor. I've never seen any brochure for a tractor with so little on it.

I don't mean to offend anyone on here. I want to like LS and I do. I'm just saying what isn't overwhelming to me with their product in my size I'm looking at. I think the guy posts on here that has the 7010 has been very informative. The 7030 I was quoted, as far as I know, is the same tractor with the engine maybe turned up or turbo/after cooler added...I haven't gotten that far along in the research. Still, he got his with a loader for about two thousand less than I was quoted for just the tractor. That's a little odd to me.

Now in the CUT area I think the LS is great. I saw a McCormick, before I knew it was LS, and REALLY liked it. In that area their standard features really do stand out like the little tool box, platform setup with joystick location, lower links pull out and I REALLY liked the hydraulic outlets. Even if I don't get the larger LS if things go the way I suspect in my tractor dealings I will try and trade my CUT on the LS model. In my cursory inspection of those machines I think they can compete and probably out perform all other models I've seen. As mentioned, I really like that they have Mitsubishi engines and I believe I read somewhere their transmission was from Dyna? Anyway, it was a major transmission manufacturer and I liked that too.

LS may have to overcome the Kubota perception in the larger tractors where Kubota has had a rough time competing and has had some lemons in the past.

Thanks for replying.

 

[I have no memory]

BTW - I like how most on here really do their research and are patient. I'm the same way and can't wait so see LS as some of the farm shows this year.

 

[LittleBlueTractor]

BTW - I like how most on here really do their research and are patient. I'm the same way and can't wait so see LS as some of the farm shows this year.

Welcome to the LS forum. That's all us LS guys are really asking for -- a fair shake based on research and logic. Reputation is important, but it's not the be-all and end-all that is thrown around by many LS detractors. It sounds like you have a lot of experience to share and your opinions are very welcome here. Not even us LS fanboys (and girls if any) think that something as complicated as a tractor (regardless of size) is flawless. Again, welcome!

 

[rocknrod]

I am still looking for a tractor with the same standard features that can match the price of an LS.
First - Do that.
Then - Lets talk.
Making unfounded claims that cannot be backed up is easy.

 

[houstonscott]

My research showed that LS is clearly a great buy at the current prices for CUT. Not going to touch them on price right now. But, if money is no object I really think the new MF 1600's are the Benz of CUT. In the Utility though LS has the market, there is nothing close to a U5030 from anyone. They put it right in sweet spot. I got not only 57hp, and 4600lbs of tractor but a full 3.33L of engine. You have to compare that to a JD 5065M or a Kubota M6040, both those tractors touch 40K and when the extra's are added their well over, while I payed 29.5K and got a HD mower and HD box in the deal. No one can touch that...period.

HS

 

[I have no memory]

I am still looking for a tractor with the same standard features that can match the price of an LS.
First - Do that.
Then - Lets talk.

Your funny. I'll reiterate and put this simply. In the CUT I think LS is fantastic. In the utility I think their Very Good. In the 7000 series, that I'm considering the most, their OK. If they put the Mitsubishi engine in the 7000 series I think they'd be farther ahead IMO. The Iveco engine is sleeveless where the Mitsubishi, (if it's like mine), will have dry sleeves. The transmissions are nothing above the competition. There have been tractors with synchronized mechanical shuttles standard built for 20 years. Their hydraulic shuttle is nice and I think it has a few features, (like not shifting above 7 mph), that is probably above the competition.

Making unfounded claims that cannot be backed up is easy. The left does it all the time.

Couldn't agree more.

I like you rocknrod. I've read your posts before I signed on here and I like your passion. You feel deeply about things and that probably gets you misunderstood and maybe in trouble but I'm that way too.

 

[rocknrod]

Thats cool - So do I :laughing:
ya think?