Question about trailering a LS R4041

[BigMoB]

A 4041 with loader, and bucket is over 5,000, plus you have a canopy....probably 5,300 minimum, then another 1,500+ for the trailer. So, you were only about a ton over the listed max....brakes, or not.

You did it, but that doesn't really make it safe. Judging from the squat on the rear of the Ridgeline, it's pretty obviously overloaded.

Oh I agree that I was pushing the safety margin just a little bit.... That's why I kept my speed low and gave myself plenty of space for braking during the trip. However, the photo is kind of misleading in that it looks like the rear of the truck was squatting significantly...it really wasn't more than a couple inches lower than normal. I've seen it squat more with the 8 bags of 80lb concrete I carried a couple of weeks ago.

Also, I wouldn't have attempted it if it had been raining, but the pavement was dry and cool for this time of year in central Texas.

 

[Gary Fowler]

The maximum towing limit for the Ridgeline is 5000 lbs, but since I had brakes on the trailer it had no trouble stopping the load. I figured that I was prettly close to 5000 lbs with the loader and tractor combined. It would have been easier with a 3/4 ton pickup, but I got the job done anyway.
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Legal Towing capacity aside, you would have been better to back the tractor up a bit to relieve some of the tongue weight. I am sure your Honda has no more tongue weight capacity than a 1/2 ton Chevy or Ford so 500-800 lbs on the hitch would be max and that is still plenty to keep the trailer from wagging the truck so to speak. Just because the trailer has a front stop doesn't mean that you have to put the tractor on the trailer front rail. Next time you load it up, watch the truck as it starts to squat from the load and just put enough on it to squat it 2-4 inches. You can check the amount of weight required to squat the truck to 500 or what ever the load limit is by just getting 3 of your 200 pound friends to set on the tail gate and measure the amount of bumper drop that you get then load your tractor in the position on the trailer so it matches that amount approximately.

 

[Gary Fowler]

Oh I agree that I was pushing the safety margin just a little bit.... That's why I kept my speed low and gave myself plenty of space for braking during the trip. However, the photo is kind of misleading in that it looks like the rear of the truck was squatting significantly...it really wasn't more than a couple inches lower than normal. I've seen it squat more with the 8 bags of 80lb concrete I carried a couple of weeks ago.

Also, I wouldn't have attempted it if it had been raining, but the pavement was dry and cool for this time of year in central Texas.

I just checked the weights of tractor and FEL (1100-bucket weight so maybe 400 for bucket at most) so I think you were likely only over by the weight of the trailer. At least you have brakes so you were likely lots safer that those pulling loaded utility within the weight classification but without any brakes. As I said in previous post, I would have backed up the tractor a bit to decrease the tongue load a bit but as you said the springs may be a bit weaker on that vehicle than a normal PU truck so you may not have had as much tongue weight as it seemed from the photos.

 

[TSO]

As I understand it, as a general rule the "tongue weight" will be roughly 10% of your trailered weight. Knowing that the r4041 with loader weighs in right around 5k lbs, and guessing that your trailer weighs around 2k lbs... that combo LOADED PROPERLY would put 700lbs of tongue weight on your truck. As Gary mentioned, you should probably center the weight over the trailer axles if possible, with it leaning just a bit forward of the axles for a touch more weight on the truck.

The way you have it, I'm guessing you're pushing 1000 lbs of tongue weight if not more.

Something people forget, or haven't heard... is that "payload" ratings of our vehicles DO NOT include occupants of the vehicle and your stuff you put inside. So, don't forget to subtract your body & interior cargo weight before figuring your actual payload capacity.

 

[Guesseral]

I know my truck is a 3/4 ton but what I usually do is drive up till the chains hit the ground and then back up till they are an 1" or more off of the ground. Not very scientific I know but it seems to work, and I have a friend that got pulled over because his chains were dragging on the ground and in Pa at least that is a know no!
You know I worry about this kind of stuff and many on TBN do, but have you ever really looked at some of the campers that are being pulled down the interstate and the vehicles that are towing them. There are a whole lot of them that you know are just so far overloaded, at least to the letter of the law!

 

[Short Game]

...what I usually do is drive up till the chains hit the ground and then back up till they are an 1" or more off of the ground. Not very scientific I know but it seems to work...

Depending on how high off the ground they are with no trailer load, figured in with the empty trailer's tongue weight, I would be inclined to think your system might be a pretty good one. With it, you know you have increased your tongue weight and can be fairly sure of the balance being in the right direction, with the vehicle and the trailer sharing the load at the hitch.

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An addendum to my little story of too much trailer and not enough van; making things worse in that instance, my trailer brakes were of the surge variety, which don't work in reverse. So, once I was unable to pull the hill, the trailer had no brakes. The whole event was a bunch of worse case scenarios, except that it all turned out okay, and only good luck could have made it so.

 

[GManBart]

I just checked the weights of tractor and FEL (1100-bucket weight so maybe 400 for bucket at most) so I think you were likely only over by the weight of the trailer. At least you have brakes so you were likely lots safer that those pulling loaded utility within the weight classification but without any brakes. As I said in previous post, I would have backed up the tractor a bit to decrease the tongue load a bit but as you said the springs may be a bit weaker on that vehicle than a normal PU truck so you may not have had as much tongue weight as it seemed from the photos.

I think the math I used before was pretty close. Listed weight for the R4041H is 3813, loader at 1100, then 400 for the bucket. That's 5,300lbs and the trailer has to weigh at least 1500, if not 2000. At the very least, it's 1800lbs over the book maximum....or 36%.

I can't see anyone suggesting that's even in the ballpark of being safe....regardless of things like good weather, driving slower, etc. Towing limits are designed around overall safety, not if things all happen to just work out okay....one thing wrong, and this would be a sad tale, indeed. Pick up a nail, roll a tire, etc, etc....

 

[rocknrod]

I blew my wife's trans front seal on her F150 trailering once.
Use my Duramax since then. And Gary is right on moving the load on the trailer to adjust for tongue weight. The pull weight you can't change. But tongue weight . . .

 

[bsentryrich]

I just bought and pulled a new 2013 4041 on one of those "rail trailers" which as is mentioned above, is not the "appropriate" type hauler...In other words, I should have had a "car hauler" type (without rail around it). Though mine is a tandem w/3500# axles, it has electric brakes. I could have picked up the car hauler trailer for an extra $500 from the dealer when I bought my tractor which was bought in a package deal.

I pulled the tractor, FEL, and 6' bush hog ~100 miles from the dealership down windy roads at 55mph w/my '09 GMC Yukon XL Denali. It has the 6.2L so I had no concerns about the power, but rather the braking. I basically took it slow and didn't tailgate----basically the advice the ole timer gave me that loaded the tractor and had been farming for 40years or more.

 

[bsentryrich]

Hey BigMoB-----Perhaps you could enlighten us where you got that canopy for your 4041? I started a new thread addressing this....have looked online and not much there, thanks!