Pending new tractor purchase, How to negotiate?

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Early in the 1980's when people and banks began to leak the true cost of a new car and people began to show up on lots with the true invoice cost to negotiate with car companies began to hide those true costs. The dealer invoice is not the true cost of the vehicle. There are kickbacks over the year for a whole slue of things, number of vehicles sold during the month, the quarter, the year, in that model. So showing the invoice is not even close to the invoice by the end of the year, that number is closely guarded, and well below the invoice number the dealer will show you. Nice try. Why not be up front. When you see a dealer (right now today) in Houston selling a truck for 12K off sticker, and 2-3K below invoice they are still making a profit, and trying to break some thresholds they need to bring home a kickback over hundreds of cars sold during the year.

HS

It comes down to the fact that it is nobodies business what anyone pays for anything that they wish to sell. If you pay 120K for a house and flip it for 300k, are you going to tell the buyer what you paid? ( I know it may be advertised in the local paper but saying this for the sake of this discussion) What are your variables for establishing your price? Some would think it obscene of the profit you are making and say you are greedy. Others just love the house and think it worth it. What mindset would you cater to? especially if you were selling houses every day? Now add to that any personal variables such as a pending lawsuit, or a family illness or divorce or whatever else. If you are going to stay in business, you need to cover your butt. The reason for that is, there are too many variables to effect the cost either way.Car costs have been advertised and bandied about all over the place from Kelly Blue book to Consumer reports. All theses variables you mention are not written in stone as if quotas are not met, that money is not doled out to the dealership and on the flip side , if the dealer is not sued, then his costs do not go up. If a dealer needs to "give away" a vehicle to meet a quota because more money is to be made in the long run, that does not preclude that all vehicles can be sold for that price. Its as if someone asked you would you cut off your right pinky for $500,000 dollars. You can't cut off all your fingers all the time to make more money. I will agree with you on one point. No one knows what the final cost of a vehicle is; and this includes the dealer. This is why a parameter to have at least something to go by such as dealer invoice, is necessary and not necessarily of "having to be upfront" Maybe you are looking for the dealer to say "look , I don't know what this car is eventually going to cost me but I need some padding in case the worse happens". You'd be no different if you layed out millions of dollars for a product line and support of everything else because you had a chance to make a great living. The greater the risk, perhaps the greater the reward.Cars are not what they cost only because of material and labor. They also cost what they do because of advertising and litigation adding to the fact of "no one knows what a car will cost" Its all comes down to human nature to have their self best interest come to the fore whether you are a seller or purchaser.

 

[sam5570]

Start low you can always add more money to your offer once you make a deal you can't get any back. The best negotiations happen when emotions are not controlling your decision and that is hard to manage with a new toy. You have to be able to walk away from the deal so have a plan "B" Good Luck:thumbsup:

this is so ture well said.

 

[indianaEPH]

Thanks for all the replays. This is turning into a hot topic.

In the past I would have travelled far for a good deal. I would figure in the cost of fuel to get there and back in to the price. These days I also ad $50/hr for my time to see if it is worth traveling to get a piece of equipment.

With a new purchase I am more inclined to purchase locally to get the support I need. Anyway, I hope the new tractor is almost a done deal.

 

[HenryFordPower]

Hope it turns out well for you! Post a photo of your new toy when you get it.

 

[Mounted Madness]

My latest tractor was a 3 dealer search, done without a phone call or face to face and no trade factored into the equation.

Two dealers were close by and were close in price. The 3rd dealer had a somewhat better price, but he was double the distance away and it would have been a pain for warranty work.

When I went to do the face to face, the first dealer tried to jack the price by a $1000, it was clear there was a personality clash between us and the guy just plain ticked me off. This was also the dealer I had bought my first tractor from, that had changed owners and was now run by a larger implement dealer. It was clear there was a significant shift in that dealerships business personality.

The dealer I bought from provided a fair price, and when I introduced a trade into the deal, he offered a fair price on that. This dealer has provided excellent service and that alone was worth effort. All in all a good experience, but then again, being retired allows you the time to do this.

 

[ultrarunner]

Much more competition on good used equipment... at least that is how it is in the car industry.

There were many sources for new... where as used may be far and few between.

That said... if I buy new... I shop.

Sometimes the price variation can be huge...

I find my best approach is to know what I want and what my bottom line is going in... this differentiates me as a buyer vs. potential buyer.

I will never fault anyone for not meeting my price... they don't have to sell to me unless it is in their interest.

Growing up and around the car business... no one every came in with a check book and paid the window price... ever.

Some cars had more room than others...

If a particular item is sold before it arrives... it is a seller's market... if not, the buyer has more leeway.

 

[yelbike]

Much more competition on good used equipment... at least that is how it is in the car industry.

There were many sources for new... where as used may be far and few between.

That said... if I buy new... I shop.

Sometimes the price variation can be huge...

I find my best approach is to know what I want and what my bottom line is going in... this differentiates me as a buyer vs. potential buyer.

I will never fault anyone for not meeting my price... they don't have to sell to me unless it is in their interest.

Growing up and around the car business... no one every came in with a check book and paid the window price... ever.

Some cars had more room than others...

If a particular item is sold before it arrives... it is a seller's market... if not, the buyer has more leeway.

This may be a dumb a question but here it goes anyway. Why do they post WINDOW prices if they never sell for that. Why not post the price a what they need to make ( fair market price) and thats it. No dickering.

 

[ultrarunner]

This may be a dumb a question but here it goes anyway. Why do they post WINDOW prices if they never sell for that. Why not post the price a what they need to make ( fair market price) and thats it. No dickering.

The FTC regulates Window Stickers... every new vehicle is required by law.

The reasoning as explained to me is to level the playing field... by establishing a bench mark.

At one time the destination fees varied a lot... now, maybe all, have a flat fee for an entire region...

Remember Moms only new car that was delivered one mile from the NUMMI plant in Fremont to Fremont Toyota... still had the $400 destination fee...

Saturn made a big deal about offering the no dicker price... many liked it... but not all and now Saturn is history.

 

[indianaEPH]

Well this OP has an update on my purchaing process. I expected to close the deal yesterday. At least that was the original plan. However, over the weekend I saw a very good deal on a Kubota M59 with less than 50hours. I bought the M59.

I contacted the dealer I was working with and let him know, and thanked him for his time. He was very nice about the whole thing. Anyway, on to new things and ready to start building the homestead with the new M59.

 

[wedge40]

Well this OP has an update on my purchaing process. I expected to close the deal yesterday. At least that was the original plan. However, over the weekend I saw a very good deal on a Kubota M59 with less than 50hours. I bought the M59.

I contacted the dealer I was working with and let him know, and thanked him for his time. He was very nice about the whole thing. Anyway, on to new things and ready to start building the homestead with the new M59.

Just so you know around here it ain't real till you post photos.

Wedge