Need some suggestions

[Kernopelli]

My son put the tractor (Mitsubishi MTE2000D) on the trailer this A.M. and shut it off to chain it down. When he tried to restart it to pull some chains tight the starter engaged fine but nothing, the engine WILL NOT turn over.....as in appears locked up. When the starter engages the flywheel it appears strong and attempting to spin the engine hard. I took the glow plugs out to minimize compression.....nothing. Put a ratchet and 3' cheater bar on the crank pulley nut and tried to turn it over by hand and she won't budge. I moved all the hydraulic valves around to take any pressure off the hydraulic system just to make sure there wasn't some kind of issue going on there (don't know what that would be but it occurred to me at the time). I am baffled. The tractor started easily w/o using the glow plugs this A.M. despite cool temps, no unusual noises, it has been running perfectly, everything in order on fluids, etc. How can it go from running perfectly to appearing locked up between shutting it off and trying to restart it shortly after? Ideas? Really don't want to drop the oil pan first thing but realize I may have to get to that pretty quick. At this point, just getting it off the trailer, taking the loader and subframe off then moving the tractor back into the dry to work on it is going to be a pretty good chore. What are your ideas on this?

 

[duwem]

Parking brake on and clutch stuck engaged with trans in gear?

 

[Kernopelli]

Parking brake on and clutch stuck engaged with trans in gear?

Unfortunately already checked and that was a no. I had a back up (new in box) starter that I just put on in case I was wrong about the old one. No good there either. I can tell it just barely will move the crank pulley. In the morning I'm going to try to turn it by hand again (by using ratchet or wrench on crank pulley nut). I'll take the glow plugs out again to take compression out of the equation when I try.....just how hard should it be to turn over that way?

 

[duwem]

With no glow plugs it should turn over VERY easily. Try pushing the clutch in if it doesnt.

 

[284 International]

With no glow plugs it should turn over VERY easily. Try pushing the clutch in if it doesnt.

What he said. If you can't move it, glow plugs or not, with a 3 foot breaker bar, there's something jamming things VERY tightly. Start simple, and work toward hard.

Make sure the transmission is free, first. If you have to, jack the rear end up, put it in 2wd, lock the differential, and step on the clutch while spinning a tire. If you can't move it, the trouble is in your transmission. I've had a tractor lock up on me when I broke a shift fork, which effectively put the tractor in 2 gears at the same time, and locked it up solidly. If your clutch is also binding or stuck, then your starter won't be able to move the crankshaft. Make sure the PTO is in neutral, too.

You should be able to turn it with a regular socket wrench, albeit slowly. With the glow plugs out, it should move fairly easily, even by hand on the harmonic balancer.

As you said, it didn't all of a sudden gall the pistons to the sleeves.

Good luck! It's worrisome to have sudden, unexplainable trouble.

 

[Kernopelli]

Well, got it unchained and the FEL bucket off the trailer floor so I could move the tractor around. Yesterday I had checked about a million times that the trans was in neutral and today was able to roll it a foot or so back and forth on the trailer and this confirms it is....put it in gear and can't roll it. The PTO turns freely when in neutral and I engaged the PTO and tried turning it ( and thus the engine) with a large pipe wrench (with tractor trans in neutral) and it won't budge. Turning crankshaft by hand was a no go again as well.

I think it's safe to assume at this point that I can eliminate transmission issues. Clutch feels good, but when I get the tractor off the trailer, I'll put it in gear and try pushing the clutch in and make sure there is nothing binding there and engagement/disengagement is right when we tow it to the garage.

I've really just had a few minutes to mess with it today. To drop the oil pan, I have to take the loader and subframe off. I assume a look at the bottom end is going to be my next move unless someone has a better plan of action. Back to work tomorrow (25th) and having worked double shifts nearly every day this month......probably won't be any different this coming week and it'll be late next week before I even take it off the trailer. Open to any and all ideas.

 

[duwem]

Starter isnt stuck engaged or something? That would make it hard to turn over....

 

[Kernopelli]

Starter isnt stuck engaged or something? That would make it hard to turn over....

No, I had a relatively new solenoid on the starter and it's working correctly. I had run across a very good price on a new factory starter a while back so I bought it to have on hand and I put it on yesterday just to make certain it wasn't a starter issue and it didn't help the issue. Definitely not a starter issue.

I still can't imagine the "coincidence" of an apparently well running engine locking up at the precise moment it is being shut off but at this point in time I just don't have another explanation for the symptoms.

 

[284 International]

I think your plan of attack is good. Make sure that pushing the clutch pedal in lets the tractor roll freely. There must have been something else occur between shutdown and the attempted restart, because it doesn't seem possible that anything occurred while the engine was off and not operating.

Is there any chance the tractor ran for an extended time at a steep angle (driving up onto the trailer?) and may have starved for oil somehow? Does the oil smell burned?

If the clutch disconnects the flywheel from the transmission, the realistic choices are that either something is jamming the pistons from going up or down, or that something has bound together in the rod or main bearings, or in one of the gear sets at the flywheel or the timing gears. I'm assuming you tried it in both directions, but I'd check with a regular socket wrench both directions of rotation if you haven't-perhaps it's loose one way and not the other.

You might try posting this question in the general parts and repairs section; whatever this issue is will not be Mitsubishi-specific. I really hope you get this figured out. Good luck, and merry Christmas!

 

[Kernopelli]

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Is there any chance the tractor ran for an extended time at a steep angle (driving up onto the trailer?) and may have starved for oil somehow? Does the oil smell burned?



Naw... but my son has been using the tractor for a pretty good size landscape job for the local school district and during the cold weather we were having, I told him to just let the tractor idle and stay warm rather than shutting it off and sitting then potentially having starting issues. So during the coarse of a day it may have idled for half an hour then be used to move material for a while.....idle for for 45 mins, move material etc. I don't think the tractor has spent any extended time running on an extreme angle but it has spent recent extended time idling repeatedly. Only "unusual"event I can think of.





If the clutch disconnects the flywheel from the transmission, the realistic choices are that either something is jamming the pistons from going up or down, or that something has bound together in the rod or main bearings, or in one of the gear sets at the flywheel or the timing gears. I'm assuming you tried it in both directions, but I'd check with a regular socket wrench both directions of rotation if you haven't-perhaps it's loose one way and not the other.



Yes, both directions. I agree on the rest...and that's what scares me.





You might try posting this question in the general parts and repairs section; whatever this issue is will not be Mitsubishi-specific. I really hope you get this figured out. Good luck, and merry Christmas!

Probably will post in parts and repairs, wanted to try here first in case my frantic thinking was making me overlook something easy/obvious (not as much exposure here :ashamed: ) Then again, right now I don't even see the need. I'm so disgusted....and certain that I'm going to be tearing the engine down that I'm not sure there's any reason to.

Merry Christmas to you as well and thanks to the respondents for their time and efforts, I'll keep you posted!