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  1. #1
    Epic Contributor Soundguy's Avatar
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    ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC

    Default 1630 with broke block/loader

    we brought in a 1630 into our shop.. has a loader and a broken block now.. loader mounts to a group of 4 holes on either side of the front of the block.. the holes have a small raised area where the bolts go it.. maybee 1/4" raised area. loader was dealer installed

    here's the deal.. looks like this happened because the dealer used TOO SHORT of bolts.. in fact.. there are 4 bolts oneach side.. looks like the dealer used 3 short bolts and 1 long bolt. the long bolt was used in the forward lower hole, and the 3 shorter bolts were used inthe back lower, and both upper holes.

    This is what happened.. the 3 short bolts were just barely into the block.. the 3 bolts on each side broke out a 'ring' oc block material... that raised lip I told you about.. that came off with each bolt.. plus maybee another single thread onthe block.. IE.. the bolt was only in about 2-3 threads.. the holes were plenty deep.. looks like another 1.5" - 2" of bolt could have gone in there.. just like the lower forward holes where a long bolt was used... here, the bolt broke out the bottom of the block in a pie wedge shape at each of the 2 bolts, with the top of the bolt hole as the center point of the pie wedge.

    The other 3 holes on each side did not breach the block, and that lower forward hole that was damaged is not into a water or an oil area of the block, we are going to clean it up, and braze that wedge back in on each side and then polish it so the oil pan will mate up.. and the laoder is going on another identical tractor that has no loader.

    Nothing else uses these holes.. so we figure it should be fine. no water has shown up in the oil.. or oil in the water since the damage occured.. though oil does dribble out the cracked areas when running.

    Anyone see a problem with brazing her up and making a new oil pan surface and buttoning her back up?

    good job dealership mechanics! you saved 1 $ buy buying 6 short bolts instead of 6 longer botls.. and cost a loader tractor!

    soundguy

  2. #2
    Elite Member JC-jetro's Avatar
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    Kansas
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    Ford 1700, Kubota MX-4700

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Howdy,

    Since it appears that block did not develop a hairline crack or something to cause mixing of the fluid (water and oil) probably will be okay. I think this work is more of cosmetic if you are not planning to put the loader back in. Can you grind the raised surface in a manner to accept big flat washer. Probably I would not braze it, thinking I might change the temper. I would just fill the bolt holes up with right size bolt (long enough) along with some flat washer to close things up. I probably use some blue RTV type liq gasket to make sure it is sealed tight, I may cover up all with paint when I'm done.

    JC,

    PS. I re read your post soundguy mentioning some oil leakage. If the oil is coming out of the bolt hole, I suppose bolt smeared with RTV will stop a small leak, More than than and outside the bolt hole I think brazing/welding might be a cure. Is the leakage a 'workable dribble"?
    Ford 1700, 2wd.
    Kubota MX-4700DT, Gear transmission with LA 884 loader, Q/A and HD bucket.
    60" Woods Rotary Cutter, home made (3-pt boom and a Row Hipper) ,King Kutter( 5 ft Tiller,Middle Buster,Single Row Cultivator,Carry-all, 5 ft blade, 6 ft Landscaping Rake ,30" Dirt Scoop and a 4'x4' Drag Harrow)

  3. #3
    Epic Contributor Soundguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    The lower bolt holes are about 3/8 of n inch from the bottom of the block/oil pan gasket area.. A bad design IMHO.. not enough meat there.. since the forward bolt on each side broke out, down, there is about a 2.5" long x 1/4" piece of block missing where the oil pan would have ridden... that is the area we are going to braze up.. IE.. bring the block back to flat for the oil pan to seal.. no oil out the bolt holes themselves.

    soundguy

  4. #4
    Elite Member JC-jetro's Avatar
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    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Quote Originally Posted by Soundguy
    The lower bolt holes are about 3/8 of n inch from the bottom of the block/oil pan gasket area.. A bad design IMHO.. not enough meat there.. since the forward bolt on each side broke out, down, there is about a 2.5" long x 1/4" piece of block missing where the oil pan would have ridden... that is the area we are going to braze up.. IE.. bring the block back to flat for the oil pan to seal.. no oil out the bolt holes themselves.

    soundguy
    Oh ... Okay, so there purpose of the weld is to close the gap between block and the pan. Is there enough lip between block and the pan that a guy could drop the pan some and add some flat thick piece of neoprene as gasketing medium to stop the leak?

    JC,
    Ford 1700, 2wd.
    Kubota MX-4700DT, Gear transmission with LA 884 loader, Q/A and HD bucket.
    60" Woods Rotary Cutter, home made (3-pt boom and a Row Hipper) ,King Kutter( 5 ft Tiller,Middle Buster,Single Row Cultivator,Carry-all, 5 ft blade, 6 ft Landscaping Rake ,30" Dirt Scoop and a 4'x4' Drag Harrow)

  5. #5
    Super Member JerryG's Avatar
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    MF 1440-4 PowerShuttle

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Chris,
    Do you have any pictures of the damage?

  6. #6
    Epic Contributor Soundguy's Avatar
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    ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Quote Originally Posted by JC-jetro
    Oh ... Okay, so there purpose of the weld is to close the gap between block and the pan. Is there enough lip between block and the pan that a guy could drop the pan some and add some flat thick piece of neoprene as gasketing medium to stop the leak?

    JC,
    No lip at all, there is a 1/4" gap a tthe high point of the break where you could stick a screwdriver into the oil pan thru the missing part of the block.

    Soundguy

  7. #7
    Epic Contributor Soundguy's Avatar
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    ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Quote Originally Posted by JerryG
    Chris,
    Do you have any pictures of the damage?
    Didn't have my camera at work today.. but you can bet i will take it on tuesday!

    soundguy

  8. #8
    Bronze Member chumly2071's Avatar
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    Lexington, IL

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    just a general rule of thumb, but typically for thread engagement, you want 1.5x the thread diameter for depth of thread engagement, plus additional clearance at the bottom for the transition to the non tapped portion of the drilled bore.

  9. #9
    Epic Contributor Soundguy's Avatar
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    ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Yep.. dealer really flubbed this one. I'm surprised the single bolt in each side plus the 1-3 threads onthe other 6 bolts held the laoder on so long.. this thing has been used pretty good.

    soundguy

  10. #10
    Super Member RickB's Avatar
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    Eastern NY
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    Case 885, JD 730D, Ford 4000

    Default Re: 1630 with broke block/loader

    Waht kind of loader? New Holland loaders mount to the bellhousing and front frame.

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