Ethanol in Gasoline - Fuel Additives Gasoline - Truth

[Monster5601]

Read the Handout - 90% of what you think you know may surprise you - and Manufacturers of Engines DO NOT have Lubricant or Chemical Engineers on staff - this Information is a [sic]culumation of information from Automotive Engineering, the EPA, Virginia Dept. Agriculture's Weight & Measurements, as well as Common Sense..

Having 30 plus years as a powertrain engineer for GM and working with chemist to develop software algorithms for engine control to meet CARB and many other requirements I can tell you this, the PDF you posted, for the most part, is full of half-truths and opinions resulting from undefined contexts.

Every conclusion in that PDF can be proven false with just a little bit of research from creditable organizations.

It looks to me that this PDF, in part, was created to support a sales claim for some TV infomercial product.

Just to set the record straight, powertrain divisions, at least in automotive, employ departments well staffed with chemical specialist in all facets of chemical engineering.

It seems you are robustly defending this document and I am curious as to why? May I ask the source of the document?

 

[Skyco]

That linked PDF is full of factual errors-

"Products that call themselves
Octane boosters or even Sea Foam are mostly
more ethanol, Methanol-Butane Ester, K-1 Kerosene
(Naptha) or a combination of all."

Seafoam contains no ethanol, it does contain isopropanol. Why is (Naptha) after K-1 Kerosene implying they are the same, they are not.


"Federal Law requires that ALL gasoline sold to
consumers must contain at least 10 % Ethanol."

That statement is false.


Don't get me wrong I don't like ethanol laden gas....but the linked document is a joke...why does it push Stihl products? Surely a reputable company like Stihl didn't authorize this.
Hmmmm..

 

[EMB5530]

I have a 03 nissan frontier w/ a 3.3 supercharge and it HATES etho-fuel but everything else we have will run it but I am the same way Avoid that crap when I can but it is getting harder and harder.
As for my 2-stroke toys and tools the only thing I would ever run in them is 110 leaded race fuel. No more fuel then they use its worth the extra $ and they run much longer on a tank of gas.
(when I have a little too much/sits for more than 6 months I pour what I have left in my old Ford Powermaster boy does she love it)

But I totally agree that gas nowadays is crap and thats why we have to run catalytic converters b/c (and this is just unintelligent speculation)they put trash and byproducts they want to get rid of in our fuel and we burn/destroy it for them.

And thats my Conspiracy Theory of the day:confused2:

 

[Bedford24]

Bird - first of all Use only Premium or High Test Gasolines in your engine - The Octane rating on the sticker at the pump is a listing before the Oil Company have added their additives such as Benzene, Toulene, Acetone, Naptha (known as Kerosene, and Ethanol) these additive reduce the gasoline's true octane rating when you are pumping it = Using a lower rated octane increases the chance of flodding and hard starts and the higher octane reduces the amount of the ethanol that is combusted therefore reducing engine operating temperatures= now = purchase only enough fuel to use in thirty days so that your fuel supply is always fresh = when placing a piece of equipment in storage for more than 30 days run it out of fuel, if it has a float bowl return later and perform cold (Choked starts) to reduce the amount of fuel in the bowl - on two cylces some manufacturer's have authorization from the EPA to produce 'PURE' gas mix in a can that has a 5 year shelf life unopened and 2 year shelf life opened. Unfortunately, because ethanol based gas is cheaper and the EPA has restricted this to quart size only it is expensive - so one can can service up to 4 units - run this through your two cycle units before storage but complete the fuel run out. On the HEad Gaskets Common Knowledge around here it is in Virginia and in or around the engine business... Also, since Ethanol burns at 100 degrees or more once combustion is achieved your engine is already operating at above manufacturer's engineered operating temperature - Automotive Manufacturer's use 'PURE' gasoline for their studies and efficiency reports. by using a lower degree thermastat you are offsetting this effect... and if you ever raced cars you would know what an 'ICE BOX' is and that cold Fuel and Intake Temperatures INCREASE the HP from combustion efficiency being increased from improved atomization... And by the way Ethanol in a Laboratory is called "Formic Acid" with a PH of 5-7...

 

[Bird]

Well, I do use 89 octane fuel instead of the 87 in my two cycle engines and in my 4 cycle mower. And I do use Stabil in it also. In years past, I did run all the gas out of my 2 cycle machines, but not anymore. I never run them dry anymore. Of course, my Mantis tiller might not be used for more than 2 months, but the mower and string trimmer are never left longer than 2 months without being used.

 

[Bedford24]

Nice to meet you Bird- seems like you keep your equipment running most the time with fresh fuel... you should have no problem. The one piece I see all the time that customers have issue with is hedge trimmers. They might get out once every two years or once a year and they left full tanks of fuel in them. Since Ethanol breaks down older plastics and rubber made before ethanol was introduced to our fuel supply I see some issues with people's equipment not throttling up and with an inspection find the fuel lines softened up so much that it is closing up on full throttle shutting off fuel... Glad to see some like you Bird on on here to de-ride people... I like to help others....

 

[tsteahr]

- on two cylces some manufacturer's have authorization from the EPA to produce 'PURE' gas mix in a can that has a 5 year shelf life unopened and 2 year shelf life opened. Unfortunately, because ethanol based gas is cheaper and the EPA has restricted this to quart size only it is expensive -

So the EPA only allows ethanol free small engine fuel to be sold in quart cans, no larger? Hmm, How was I able to buy a 5 gallon pail a few weeks ago of VPRacing SEF 94 at my local power tool dealer? In fact, SEF 94 is sold in sizes up to 55 gallon drums:

Small Engine Fuel (SEF?) From VP Racing Fuels

BTW, cooling the intake charge has the potential to increase HP because of the increased density of colder air, not because of "improved atomization". That is the purpose of intercoolers on forced induction engines. Colder air is more dense, more oxygen, hence more fuel needed to maintain mixture ratio, more power.

Ethanol free fuel is great stuff, but I'm not drinking your cool aid.

 

[fuseboxer]

Interesting reading but I do not plan to fight the system. I wish in a free society that we had a choice but believe it is not legally necessary to post on the gas pump that the fuel containes alcohol. Was a time pumps posted the notice. I would pump some in the cold winter but stay away in the summer. I believe 15% mix is borderline max without corrosion of the fuel lines and system. !0% was bad enough but 15% is pushing to the max.

 

[Bedford24]

Well SEF94 is "FOR SMALL ENGINES ONLY" with mix oil in it and the EPA exemption was granted to these Manufacturer's as you see on their site used "Fire/Rescue' and other government agencies as a method to get the exemptions to manufacturer this - before you go there - I will rebut you ahead of time - As government agencies must submit for bid to support small businesses and buy from local such businesses I would question based on seminars I have sat in on presented by Industry Leaders, being able to buy in bulk 55 gallons being legal to Joe Blow Citizen - and the only true source of Race Fuel Ethanol Free Gasoline is direct tank fill at a race track.. Funny when I asked that Sunoco guy at the track how to get it for personal use he said good luck outside of being NASCAR licensed and approved to race that day.... we have had alot of customers come in claiming they buy ethanol free gasoline and welcome them to bring us their samples as we test it in front of them and watch the smiles get turned upside down... oh yeah manufacturer's have gotten and are getting to that point where they are requesting Dealers to test fuel and offer fuel test kits... or you can buy your own. Race and FFA (Aviation) is exempted besides if you got paid full price by a gas station owner plus $4000 per tanker load tax free from uncle Sam wouldn't you follow the law???? Do the Math Greed feeds the Ethanol Monster that delivers to a station near your - 8,800 gallon tanker times $0.45= $3,960 of our tax dollars???? That is why Ethanol Free Gas is approved and must have mix already in it so you are not tempted to use it in your car - if you can afford $5.99 and up per Quart???? $24.00 per gallon and that is not even Stihl/Husqvarana pre-mix prices??

 

[zzvyb6]

You all realize don't you that all these claims and charges and suggested alterations are violations of the Federal Clean Air Act, right? And carbureteor bowls in modern cars? It just aint so. And a cold box isn't used for what you say it is used for. If you had any real experience with racing, you would be able to state what the actual purpose is. So I won't bother to wait for it.

Automotive Engineering? That's a magazine published monthly.

The rest is just snake oil in my view. And I have 40 years in the Big 3 Automotive Engineering and Development process including Emissions, Coast Down, and Fuel Economy sectors, right here in Michigan. In fact I have college degrees in these fields.

So what's growing in the field that you are smoking, Bro ?