VP Fuels "SEF" cost

[tomd999]

Hiya,

If anyone is using the VP fuel "SEF" (Small Engine Fuel) can you tell me what your paying for it in the 5 gallon pail? I was quoted $72 bucks, which is $14.40 per gallon, a bit steep considering I pay roughly $7/gal for 100LL av-gas.

Tom

 

[Leo Rabon]

Tom:
I do use the equivalent "Tru Fuel" 50-1 Mix for my leaf blower and weed eater. Only about 2 gallons per year so the cost versus the very good benefits is minimal. I really like the fuel as it keeps me out of the repair shops for the "cheaper" engines for carb repairs. I considered using the the 100% Gas "Tru Fuel" for my Cub GT 2000 (20 HP Kohler)but the purchase of 30 gallons per year was (for me) cost prohibitive. I can't remember the cost of the fuel but it was very expensive in the 5 gal and 30 gal drums. Fortunately for me, I can still purchase 100% gasoline at 2 stores nearby, they sell 93 octane at about $.80 per gallon premium over ethanol. Living near the coast with all of the boats and other watercraft allows the station to sell quite a bit of the 100% gasoline, so I am getting, pretty much, fresh fuel each time I make a purchase. I think the makers of the "SEF" and "Tru Fuel" could sell a lot more of their product if they adjusted the price somewhat on the 100% Gas side of their product. I do understand their increased cost based on packaging and shipping but their price is to steep for me. How is the 100 LL AV Gas working out for you? I considered going that route but after doing some research, I found that some small engines like it and others just don't do well on it becasue of the lead build up. Something about the low compression small engines (not being able to disburse the lead buildup out of the cylinder) versus the high compression aircraft engine. I have read a few threads on this tractor site where some use the 100 LL AV gas with good results. I just hate to take a chance with an engine that costs $1,800.00 to replace.
Good Luck

 

[buickanddeere]

About the same for 110LL in Ontario , $6.70 last May .
Low, Lead is just that, a minimum amount of lead to protect the valve seats on aircooled aircraft engines. Some folk claim mixing 100LL with 94 octane pump gas 50/50 still protects the seats.and lead deposits are negligible. Probably deposits could be reduced just by shopping around for a lower ash two stroke oil.
100LL is supposed to rate about 95-96 pump octane.
Use 100LL in all small seasonal engines here. The lawn tractor gets a tank load too before winter storage.

 

[tomd999]

Hiya,

Just to clarify, I use 100LL in aircraft, I used to use it in some muscle cars that ran high CR's of 11-1 and up. I wouldn't use it in lawn equipment as low lead is a misnomer, it's got lots of TEL in it for the radials in the C-47/DC-3's still in license.

Tom

 

[Diamondpilot]

Tom:
I do use the equivalent "Tru Fuel" 50-1 Mix for my leaf blower and weed eater. Only about 2 gallons per year so the cost versus the very good benefits is minimal. I really like the fuel as it keeps me out of the repair shops for the "cheaper" engines for carb repairs. I considered using the the 100% Gas "Tru Fuel" for my Cub GT 2000 (20 HP Kohler)but the purchase of 30 gallons per year was (for me) cost prohibitive. I can't remember the cost of the fuel but it was very expensive in the 5 gal and 30 gal drums. Fortunately for me, I can still purchase 100% gasoline at 2 stores nearby, they sell 93 octane at about $.80 per gallon premium over ethanol. Living near the coast with all of the boats and other watercraft allows the station to sell quite a bit of the 100% gasoline, so I am getting, pretty much, fresh fuel each time I make a purchase. I think the makers of the "SEF" and "Tru Fuel" could sell a lot more of their product if they adjusted the price somewhat on the 100% Gas side of their product. I do understand their increased cost based on packaging and shipping but their price is to steep for me. How is the 100 LL AV Gas working out for you? I considered going that route but after doing some research, I found that some small engines like it and others just don't do well on it becasue of the lead build up. Something about the low compression small engines (not being able to disburse the lead buildup out of the cylinder) versus the high compression aircraft engine. I have read a few threads on this tractor site where some use the 100 LL AV gas with good results. I just hate to take a chance with an engine that costs $1,800.00 to replace.
Good Luck

High compression aircraft engines? Ha, ha, that is funny. I have been a pilot for 25 years and do it for a living and I can tell you that most aircraft piston engines are in the 5 to 1 or 7 to 1 compression range. Very very low.

Yes, the lead build up will foul some plugs but its cheaper than the last carb I replaced ($85). No rebuild kit for the go-cart motor. I have ran 100 LL in my stuff for years with no issues.

Chris

 

[teampryor]

For what it is worth my son rides motocross, and for this application pump gas of any sort is just not reliable or safe. We run 2 stroke bikes that are indeed high compression unlike aircraft piston engines. We use leaded race gas VP c12 110 octane ($65 for 5 gallon pale) for high humidity conditions and VP u4.4 oxygenated 104 octane ($78 for 5 gallon pale) for lower humidity conditions. I also run these same fuels in my Stihl chainsaws with no problems whatsoever just because I have it on hand. Though I must say that 89 octane marine gasoline with no ethanol is absolutely fine for small engine use. Though a fuel stabilizer is highly reccomended. A word from experience aviation fuels are intended for just that, and has many additives that are detrimental to a small engine. So unless your life depends upon it just run marine grade gasoline.

 

[buickanddeere]

100LL is low with 1.2 to 2.0 grams per US gallon.
In the old days of 100/130 lead content of 4.0grams per US gallon and up were the norm. Lets not even discuss how loaded 115/145 purple used to be.
Check the lead content of today's leaded race fuel from CamII etc. There is the stuff that fouls plugs and leaves sludge and deposits inside the engine.
Want high octane unleaded? Blend 90% xylene or toulene with 10% 94 octane unleaded pump gas.
Can't recall however which one safer.

 

[huskerhayman]

I used to work for a FBO and aerial ag chemical applicator when I was in high school. We ran everything on 100LL. Cars, trucks, mowers, chemical pumps, chainsaws, weed eaters, everything. We never had any problems with any of them and 100LL stays good A LOT longer than pump gas. For what it is worth we had an old diesel tractor we ran off Jet A fuel. I was told it want the best thing for it but I can't remember why but it did run on it.

 

[Leo Rabon]

High compression aircraft engines? Ha, ha, that is funny. I have been a pilot for 25 years and do it for a living and I can tell you that most aircraft piston engines are in the 5 to 1 or 7 to 1 compression range. Very very low.

Yes, the lead build up will foul some plugs but its cheaper than the last carb I replaced ($85). No rebuild kit for the go-cart motor. I have ran 100 LL in my stuff for years with no issues.

Chris

Chris:
Thanks for the update, as you should know. I considered using 100 LL in my Kohler V-Twin but I found a supply of 100% gas. No telling when that supply will disappear. I hate using E-10 in small engines. The small engine repair shops just love it for the $$$$$ they make on carbs and cleaning. When 100% gas disappears, I probably will give 100 LL a try. My information came from research on the "NET". I also read newspapers and learned not to believe that horse****, so I don't know why I believed what I read.
Thanks Again
Leo

 

[tomd999]

Hiya,

Wow, I ask about small engine fuel prices and we get a discussion of aircraft and 2 stroke engines, sweet.

I found a local club airfield that sells no ethanol mogas for $4.80/Gal.

Just a few comments on the other posts on the 100LL, aircraft engines and compression ratios since we are on the subject

Yes, "most" aircraft engines run in the 6 or 7-1 CR area however, most of them that mandate 100LL are also turbo/supercharged which significantly increases cylinder pressures and thus octane requirements requiring 100LL. The naturally aspirated engines (lycoming for example) run about 7 to 8.5-1 which allows them to use mogas.

100LL does have a bunch of TEL, about 3 or 4 times what leaded mogas had back in the '70's however, it is less than the 110/130, and far less than 115/145 but that was used mainly in the 40's and 50's for warbirds and I don't ever remember seeing it on commercial fields even when I was flying with my Dad in the late 70's. My uncle told me stories of having to change all 56 plugs on a Wasp Major because they would foul from the lead.

To the poster running 2 stroke bikes, I used to run a mix of 100LL with 75% unleaded pump gas super and Amsoil 100-1 in all my MX bikes for years, never had an issue with detonation or plug fouling and they made plenty of horsepower, but then again, that was a long time ago when the government wasn't playing fuel games.

Tom