Oil Filter Comparison

[daugen]

The reason you never hear of a defective oil filter is because most people are not away that is what happened to their engine. Alot of people say I have never had any problem with a Fram but there is a good chance they could have. If you can get a 150,000 mile out of a engine with a Fram how long would it have lasted with a quality filter like a Wix.

ah, like all those little abrasive micron somethings that are getting through, again and again. Quietly abrading away the rings, injectors, bearings, etc.
That's a really good point.

 

[Soundguy]

are people really getting less than 150k-m out of engines these days?

can't remember the last vehicle I have had that I did not sell, running, and head near 200k.

I know my 98 dodge ram i sold to work( still running every day ) is over 200k.. and it got a steady diet of walmart 10w30 and fram filters.. unless something was cheaper.. and if it was cheaper.. it got that. ( supertech filter or purolater are sometimes cheaper then fram at walmart ).

This isn't the 50's where 50k menat a rebuild.. or the 70's where 100k meant it was worn out if still running.

 

[mikehaugen]

are people really getting less than 150k-m out of engines these days?

can't remember the last vehicle I have had that I did not sell, running, and head near 200k.

I know my 98 dodge ram i sold to work( still running every day ) is over 200k.. and it got a steady diet of walmart 10w30 and fram filters.. unless something was cheaper.. and if it was cheaper.. it got that. ( supertech filter or purolater are sometimes cheaper then fram at walmart ).

This isn't the 50's where 50k menat a rebuild.. or the 70's where 100k meant it was worn out if still running.

that's funny, my dad's '98 ram (with 5.9 gas) had a broken speedo for a few years and he drives a lot of miles. He estimates around 350k with only pennzoil dino oil and basic fram filters. No engine work, but had trans rebuilt around 250k and some other drivetrain work.

 

[PoorMansCat]

If you ever DO see a "filter test" online, by all means post a link to it. Absolutely NONE of the cut-'em-open-and-peek-inside filter comparison websites have done anything that remotely resembles testing.

What other product do we allow someone else, (without experience, expertise, or testing equipment), to "evaluate" for us so we can base our purchasing decisions upon their say-so....when an entity WITH experience, expertise, and lots of testing equipment has stamped their seal of approval on said product already?

yeah.. everything ive ever seen was simply construction and surface area comparisons... no media testing. I use micron ratings efficiency and performance history to determine what filter to use, hence the Motorcraft, Donaldson, and Cat filters..

 

[brokenot]

SAE, etc sets specs, but I have very little faith that the dealership's "house filter" is set to any spec

The SAE doesn't "set" the specs, engine manufacturers do. The SAE tests filters to see whether those specs set by engine manufacturers are met.

As for a dealership's "house filter", we're a dealer for several lines of equipment....and a lot of it is expensive stuff. There is no way we would intentionally install a cheap filter in the hope that it would generate some engine work revenue later on. I seriously doubt that goes on anywhere. A lot of people read these posts, and the simple fact that that was even mentioned means that somebody is going to repeat it, and whoever they repeat it to...will tell someone else. Before long, it will have gained a similar amount of credibility as the "oil filter comparison sites" seem to enjoy.

If anyone would like to see whether that theory has any merit, they could most certainly visit any dealership they'd like and ASK to have the "house filter" installed on their vehicle or equipment, or they could buy one at the parts counter and carry it out the door. It will have a brand name/part number/etc. on it that makes it identifiable. I don't think it would be too hard to do a little research and see if it received a pass or fail from the SAE.

I'm betting comfortably on "pass".

 

[crazyal]

Unless you know the first piece of basic information everything else is useless. How much filtering must a filter do over it's life? It's like buying a propane tank full of fuel and then replace it after an hour of use. As long as the tank doesn't run out of fuel then it has done it's job. If buying a tank with twice the fuel but gets changed in the same amount of time makes you feel better then so be it.

I've heard countless "my next door neighbor's cousin's daughter's hairdresser's uncle" had an engine fail because of a bad filter. Yet none of them have any details. I love the people who make a website giving personal opinions about what they see. The part I love the best is when they say "Fram uses cardboard". I have yet to hear a single person come up with factual evidence or scientific fact why cardboard designed to be immersed in oil will not work for the life of the filter. Sure metal may last longer but what good is using something that will lasts say 8 times longer than the life of the oil over a lower cost part that will only last 4 times longer?

 

[94BULLITT]

If Fram filters are so good why don't the OE's use them?

 

[crazyal]

I couldn't answer that. Why does Toyota use Denso? Why does Ford use Motorcraft? Etc. There use to be a time when new cars would require the oil to be changed after 1000 or 1500 miles, the break in period. Now they seam to be fine with 3000. I would assume that the MFGS would want a filter that would catch any filings that didn't get cleaned out when the engine was made or during the initial break in period. Or it could be that Fram wasn't the low bidder. Maybe Fram doesn't want to deal with OEMs. Who knows.

 

[daugen]

The SAE doesn't "set" the specs, engine manufacturers do. The SAE tests filters to see whether those specs set by engine manufacturers are met.

As for a dealership's "house filter", we're a dealer for several lines of equipment....and a lot of it is expensive stuff. There is no way we would intentionally install a cheap filter in the hope that it would generate some engine work revenue later on. I seriously doubt that goes on anywhere. A lot of people read these posts, and the simple fact that that was even mentioned means that somebody is going to repeat it, and whoever they repeat it to...will tell someone else. Before long, it will have gained a similar amount of credibility as the "oil filter comparison sites" seem to enjoy.

If anyone would like to see whether that theory has any merit, they could most certainly visit any dealership they'd like and ASK to have the "house filter" installed on their vehicle or equipment, or they could buy one at the parts counter and carry it out the door. It will have a brand name/part number/etc. on it that makes it identifiable. I don't think it would be too hard to do a little research and see if it received a pass or fail from the SAE.

I'm betting comfortably on "pass".

Ok, perhaps I overstated, and you are right, things get repeated without vetting. It is my experience that auto dealers do NOT use "name brand" filters at times. I have pulled filters off my cars without any markings on them at all, real
no names. Now my Kubota dealer wouldn't put a non OEM filter on my tractor to save himself. So who makes Kubota filters? Some of them are wildly expensive, so does that imply/guarantee they are better quality, protect the engine better?

I'd be interested to see what Mercedes, BMW and Audi spec for their filters; the Germans seem to be ultra serious about their engines, even if a Camry four cylinder is likely to outlast them.

So, lesson learned. ASK the brand name of the filter going to be used before it goes on. Pretty simple. I often bring my own so I don't worry about it, though I'm sure the dealer is annoyed that I won't buy their 212 point inspection
program for $200 instead of a $50 oil change with synthetic.

 

[Soundguy]

I couldn't answer that. Why does Toyota use Denso? Why does Ford use Motorcraft? Etc. There use to be a time when new cars would require the oil to be changed after 1000 or 1500 miles, the break in period. Now they seam to be fine with 3000. I would assume that the MFGS would want a filter that would catch any filings that didn't get cleaned out when the engine was made or during the initial break in period. Or it could be that Fram wasn't the low bidder. Maybe Fram doesn't want to deal with OEMs. Who knows.

speaking of filter oem brands.. etc.

I was picking up an oil filter for my yukon.. pf61 is the ac delco OE filter. it was 40 cents cheaper than the purolater and the fram filter setting next to it on the shelf.

Looking at the filter.. feeling it.. weight..e tc. I'd BET the fram extra guard ( which was the most expensive of the 3 ) was a better filter. but heck.. i figure you can't go wrong with the ac delco filter in the book for your truck.. etc.

On ford. look at the fl1a motorcraft filter. it crosses to ph8a fram, st8a supertech.. napa 1515 auto application, 1452 other appl..e tc.

the fl1a can be had for 2.99$ in some places.... that's cheaper than any of it's cross reference.