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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    Gasoline is just like everything else. The market will determine what we pay and what vehicle we drive. If it gets too high we will buy less of it, and that might require the purchase or more fuel efficient vehicles. But it should remain a personal choice. I shouldn't be required to drive a little car to help lower the price of someone else's gasoline.

  2. #22
    Veteran Member scesnick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    There is no shortage, there is just more greed from the oil companies. I heard on the news that Exxon- Mobil made a PROFIT of 3.4 Billion ( with a "B" ) this quater alone. doesn't sound like they are exactly hurting now does it.
    It seems to me that the auto manufacturers have been "in bed" with the oil compainies for years. They were not willing to raise the fuel economy or even look into alternative fuel vehicles. Why should they, they were making a fortune selling the gas guzzlers. Now, they can not give away a Ford Expedition or Chevy Suburban.

    Maybe they should have seen the writing on the wall 10 years ago just like the foreign companies did, ( i.e. Honda, Toyota, VW ) and started developing hybrids and diesels. If they would have done so they might not be laying off 30,000 Americans right now and looking down the barrel of chaper 11 bankruptcy.
    My buddy bought a new Mustang with a big V-8 2 years ago. Another buddy bought a 2002 Dodge 1500 with the Hemi. I bought a Chevy Metro 2 years ago that gets 43 MPG. and I bought the wife a VW Jetta TDI that gets 46-48 MPG. They did nothing but rag me about this for 2 years. I am looking like a freakin' genius now !!!! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] ( just kidding )

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    </font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue"> That money didn't just appear in their bottom line out of thin air </font> )</font>

    No it didn't. The U.S. is the only country in the world where individuals and the oil companies can actually own the oil in the ground, everywhere else it owned by governments and the oil companies have to pay the asking price. Now 5 years ago when oil was $18 dollars/bbl, the oil companies were selling domestically produced oil at that price and making a profit. They are making a heck of a profit selling the same oil today at $65/bbl. That's what helps inflate their profits. What can be done about it? Not a lot. During the '70's oil crisis, the government introduced the "windfall profit tax" to try to address that very issue. That piece of legislation almost single handedly destroyed the domestic oil industry. Think about it, if you want 15% rate of return on your investment, why would you invest money on maintaining wells that are producing $18/bbl oil when you can drill new wells and get your 15% return on $65/bbl oil. Unfortunately, the size of reserves that these major oil companies are looking for are not to be found in the U.S. so they don't drill in this country and that investment goes overseas, domestic production goes into decline and you have to import even more foreign oil to make up for the shortfall. It's the classic CATCH 22. No, $65/bbl oil allows low producing and expensive to drill wells to be drilled and that investment stays in this country allowing some of the pressure to be taken off imports.

    I said that I didn't get involved anymore in these big bad oil company debates. I guess I lied but this will be the last time, I promise.

  4. #24
    Veteran Member
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    </font><font color="blue" class="small">( During the '70's oil crisis, the government introduced the "windfall profit tax" to try to address that very issue. That piece of legislation almost single handedly destroyed the domestic oil industry. )</font>

    If that's true, it certainly made a miraculous recovery.

  5. #25
    Elite Member SkyPup's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    <font color="blue">
    If that's true, it certainly made a miraculous recovery. </font>

    All thanks to gas guzzling SUV's..... [img]/forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

  6. #26
    Super Member
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    <font color="red">All thanks to gas guzzling SUV's </font>

    This one really made me laugh. When will people get tired of blaming the SUV's for the worlds problems. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] Fact is the sooner we run out of fossil fuels the better off this world will be. There are SO many cheap, renewable, environmentally friendly fuels out there but the oil money machine will in no way let anything get going that would be viable. Anyone that thinks this is just a supply and demand game has got their head in the same sand that the oil is coming out of.

  7. #27
    Elite Member SkyPup's Avatar
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    Personally, I'm NOT thanking any of the millions of 5,000 pound dinosaurs speeding down our highways for anything besides arrogant indulgence.... [img]/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    </font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="blue"> If that's true, it certainly made a miraculous recovery. </font> )</font>

    No it didn't. It took decades to recover. Don't confuse the mom &amp; pop operations, independent operators and small to medium oil companies that do the majority of the work in the U.S. with the U.S. based, global, multinational companies whose profits are making everyone mad at the moment. They are two very different animals. Generalities are always dangerous but unless they have owned and operated the fields for many years, the huge conglomerates aren't too interested in exploring in the U.S for new oil. Their overheads are so high and there are no large undiscovered reserves in the U.S. and that makes it less profitable for them to operate here. They spend the bulk of their exploration dollars far offshore in deep water Gulf of Mexico or overseas where they have the resources and expertise to develop what they find. They really can't compete with the smaller, leaner and meaner companies and independents when it comes to drilling on land in the U.S. So things like windfall profit tax doesn't hurt the majors all that much, they just shut down domestic operations altogether and go overseas, but it decimates the smaller, purely domestic oil companies and many, many of them never did recover. Remember that the oil business isn't just the big oil companies. There are the rig owners and operators and the multitude of service companies. Again, the huge international conglomerates like Halliburton and Schlumberger got hurt some but they had their international business to keep them going. The smaller, purely domestic service companies went to the wall.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    Cowboydoc, it's very seldom I disagree with you. There are renewable, environmentally friendly fuels out there but I can't think of one that is a "cheap" alternative to oil. If oil hits a $100/bbl then they will become much more viable but in that case who do you think will control them ... the oil companies. Most of the research into alternative fuels, fuel cells, solar, etc., is funded, one way or another, by the major oil companies or the government and we all know that the government doesn't do much. When this country and the world changes from their hydrocarbon based economies it'll most likely be to some system and technology developed, owned and controlled by the oil companies. They're not going to be like the horse drawn carriage maker, sitting by the side of the road watching the Model "T" driving by. They're a lot smarter than that. Back in the 50's, 60's and '70's, when it looked as if nuclear was the way of the future who do you think was the largest producer of uranium in the country, if not the world .... Mobil Oil. If anything does threaten the position of oil that they haven't had a hand in developing, they'll simply buy it and take it over because they can't afford to be left behind and they have the resources to do it. They don't have to suppress it either. They'll run it in addition to their oil business. As the reliance on oil decreases, the reliance on the alternative energy will increase. Either way, they'll maintain their position in the pecking order. I'm sorry, but whatever form of energy we use going forward, we'll still be dealing with the ExxonMobil's, Shell's, Chevron's and BP's of this world. I just don't see any way round it but I would like to see control of our energy supply and use come back to this country. It'll be interesting going forward but OPEC isn't stupid either. I can't see them allowing the price of oil to rise to such an extent that any alternative fuel will become too big a threat. They have to walk a thin line between raising the cost of crude to such an extent that the Western economies go into recession leading to reduced demand and falling prices and raising it so high that alternative fuel become vaible. Now that they've seen that $60+ a barrel oil hasn't hurt the major economies, don't expect any sharp drop in prices in the near future.

  10. #30
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    Wheatland, Wy
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    TYM T330 HST

    Default Re: Gas+oil+momopoly+greed=US oil companies

    </font><font color="blue" class="small">( Personally, I'm NOT thanking any of the millions of 5,000 pound dinosaurs speeding down our highways for anything besides arrogant indulgence.... [img]/forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] )</font>


    That's mostly true. I'm actually glad each time gas prices go up. I see less traffic on the roads as people cut back their driving and more brand new small cars with temporary tags in the back window.

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