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  1. #11
    Super Member grsthegreat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
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    6,447
    Location
    north idaho
    Tractor
    dk45se hst cab

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Ive seen people pushing trees with FEl and the tree split in half with the top of the tree coming down on the cab.

    thats why i hired a large excavator and operator to fell my large ones. fast, clean and safe
    currently own
    2011 Kioti DK45SE HST CAB tractor/loader, Jimna 6" - 3 point wood chipper, 60" JD Brush Hog, JD 60" Rototiller, 3 point post hole digger with hydraulic assist, 3 point spring tooth rake, Fimco 55 gallon weed sprayer with 12 foot boom, 3 point hydraulic wood splitter (home built)
    Quick Attach 79" loader mount snowblower & rear powerpack
    Quick Attach 84" Snow Blade
    Quick Attach 42" pallet forks

  2. #12
    Elite Member Don87's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Location
    SW Pa.
    Tractor
    Massey Ferguson GC2400

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    The roots on pines are generally shallow, and the root ball will extend out past the lower limbs.

    On a 24 inch diameter pine, that would put the root ball at 8 feet or so away from the trunk. Which means that if you were capable of pushing the tree over............the root ball will flip your tractor. I can almost guarantee it.
    Don

    MF GC2400, FEL, 60in.MMM, 5ft. Cultivator, Single Bottom Plow, Bush Hog RTC48 tiller, MF 2360 front mount snowblower, 5ft backblade. BXpanded Piranha toothbar.

  3. #13
    Gold Member LittleBlueTractor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    435
    Location
    Houston
    Tractor
    LS S3010

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Thanks for all the advice guys. The needles are still on the trees, but they are mostly brown and dying. I've never seen a pine recover after it gets that bad. The only experience I have with a chainsaw was from a really big water oak in my yard after hurricane Ike a few years ago. My "nice" neighbor volunteered to help me get rid of it because it fell from his yard. He ended up helping me cut up all the limbs that were suitable for firewood (for his fireplace) and leaving me to deal with all the big stuff alone. By the time I figured out he wasn't coming back, the tree was pretty dead. So I bought a chainsaw and that's when I discovered dead wood is harder to cut than the green stuff.

    Actually I do have another option. It will involve some work, but I can move my stuff (no permanent structures) out of harm's way and just let them rot and fall. I didn't want to do that because it will take so long and I really like the location. Plus there's a good chance they will damage other trees around them on their random way down. I'm now leaning toward cutting a > in the direction I want them to fall and then cutting from the other side. How deep should the > be? I'm thinking 1/4 to 1/3 in. Probably move my stuff anyway even if I do try cutting them down.
    Lil' Blue
    ------------------
    LS Tractor S3010 w/FEL
    Ag-Meier Mohawk Brave 5' cutter
    Armstrong Ag BB05-Std 5' Box Blade
    TSC CountyLine Middle Buster
    WildKat 48" Single Cyl Grapple
    Versatech 42" Pallet Forks
    A "no name" Stump Bucket that works really well

  4. #14
    Elite Member Don87's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    4,226
    Location
    SW Pa.
    Tractor
    Massey Ferguson GC2400

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleBlueTractor View Post
    Thanks for all the advice guys. The needles are still on the trees, but they are mostly brown and dying. I've never seen a pine recover after it gets that bad. The only experience I have with a chainsaw was from a really big water oak in my yard after hurricane Ike a few years ago. My "nice" neighbor volunteered to help me get rid of it because it fell from his yard. He ended up helping me cut up all the limbs that were suitable for firewood (for his fireplace) and leaving me to deal with all the big stuff alone. By the time I figured out he wasn't coming back, the tree was pretty dead. So I bought a chainsaw and that's when I discovered dead wood is harder to cut than the green stuff.

    Actually I do have another option. It will involve some work, but I can move my stuff (no permanent structures) out of harm's way and just let them rot and fall. I didn't want to do that because it will take so long and I really like the location. Plus there's a good chance they will damage other trees around them on their random way down. I'm now leaning toward cutting a > in the direction I want them to fall and then cutting from the other side. How deep should the > be? I'm thinking 1/4 to 1/3 in. Probably move my stuff anyway even if I do try cutting them down.
    If you've never felled trees before, and are in a tight area............don't attempt it, only bad things will happen.

    I used to be a logger, I'm all too familiar with the dangers.


    But if you are adamant about doing it yourself.........do some studying first:

    http://forestry.about.com/od/chainsaws/ss/fell_tree.htm


    http://www.wikihow.com/Fell-a-Tree


    http://www.ehow.com/how_4893933_fall...direction.html


    Felling pines: http://www.gardenguides.com/109234-fell-pine-trees.html
    Don

    MF GC2400, FEL, 60in.MMM, 5ft. Cultivator, Single Bottom Plow, Bush Hog RTC48 tiller, MF 2360 front mount snowblower, 5ft backblade. BXpanded Piranha toothbar.

  5. #15
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    262
    Location
    N.E. Arkansas (transplant)

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Simply cutting a V notch in a tree doesn't guarentee the direction of fall. Things like wind, which way the tree is leaning, which side of the tree has the most weight from branch growth, all affect the direction it will go independant of V notch/backcut direction. The best assistance though still no guarantee of fell direction with a questionable tree is drive wooden or plastic wedges into the backcut to assist the tree in starting to move in the desired direction.
    Have the proper safety gear in use and be sure to have a clear path to run in any direction when a tree starts to move, in case it goes in an unplanned direction.

    As for pushing them over with any small tractor, it'd never happen. Same for pulling or pushing stumps out. you wont have the traction, weight or horsepower needed to accomplish that task based on my experience. We have a 955 cat dozer and having tried on stumps as small as maybe 16 inches, and 3 to 4 foot tall, it wont budge them as a rule.

  6. #16
    Gold Member LittleBlueTractor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    435
    Location
    Houston
    Tractor
    LS S3010

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by Don87 View Post
    If you've never felled trees before, and are in a tight area............don't attempt it, only bad things will happen.

    I used to be a logger, I'm all too familiar with the dangers.


    But if you are adamant about doing it yourself.........do some studying first:

    How to Fell a Tree Using a Chainsaw


    How to Fell a Tree: 14 steps (with pictures)


    How to Fell a Tree in Any Direction | eHow.com


    Felling pines: How to Fell Pine Trees | Garden Guides
    Thank you for the links Don. I'll do a lot of research first, but I probably will try to drop them myself. The area won't be tight after I move my stuff, but at least maybe I can avoid damaging some of the nicer trees I have left. You wouldn't believe how bad it is. I honestly think I'm losing about 1/3 of my pines. See:

    Texas drought kills as many as half a billion trees

    I also like the wedge driving thing Charlie mentioned.
    Lil' Blue
    ------------------
    LS Tractor S3010 w/FEL
    Ag-Meier Mohawk Brave 5' cutter
    Armstrong Ag BB05-Std 5' Box Blade
    TSC CountyLine Middle Buster
    WildKat 48" Single Cyl Grapple
    Versatech 42" Pallet Forks
    A "no name" Stump Bucket that works really well

  7. #17
    Silver Member roman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    151
    Location
    New Hampshire Llive Free or Die (yeah right)
    Tractor
    Ford 1720

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    I agree you should have someone else (professional) cut them for you. Maybe have him drop a few (The more dangerous ones) while you watch. You will then see the danger we are trying to portray for you.
    Then if you feel comfortable you can fell one. You will have enough work just cleaning up the felled trees. The dangers you will encounter then are just as bad but different in nature. I take it you don't have a lot of saw experience...
    Limbing large trees can be scary too.
    My tractor has a steel cab. Once I tried to push over a dead maple stem ten-twelve inches at the stump and 35 feet high. I suceeded in snapping the top eight foot section off. It landed sideways on my cab, ending up straddling the loader arms. IF I WAS IN A OPEN CAB... not good.
    You can learn a lot from a professional in a day and the $ will be well spent. Tackle the big ones after you have some experience.
    Ford 1720, Sims cab, FEL, Woods subframe backhoe, Fisher 7' hydro angle plow, Wallenstein 3 pth splitter, 5' blade, 3 pth carry-all, 3 pth ballast

  8. #18
    Gold Member BeeferMan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    367
    Location
    North Central MA
    Tractor
    Case 1194, Ford 641, NH TT75A

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    As others have said, felling the trees is a much better option that pushing them over. Widow makers would be your biggest danger - you're likely to survive having your tractor flip, you're much less likely to survive a large branch falling a great distance and dropping on your squash. And those falling limbs are almost a certainty if your using under-sized equipment, as instead of a clean push over you're going to be rocking the tree to get is loose and tipped.

    And if you have no experience felling trees, felling dead tress is *NOT* the the best learning situation! Dead trees will often snap rather than hinge, and as stated above, the danger of widow makers is much higher.
    ----------------------------------------------------------
    Case 1194, NH TT75A, Ford 600, Bobcat A300, balers, rakes, mowers, tedders, spreaders and lots of other toys as well...

    - Jim

  9. #19
    Elite Member Don87's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    4,226
    Location
    SW Pa.
    Tractor
    Massey Ferguson GC2400

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleBlueTractor View Post
    Thank you for the links Don. I'll do a lot of research first, but I probably will try to drop them myself. The area won't be tight after I move my stuff, but at least maybe I can avoid damaging some of the nicer trees I have left. You wouldn't believe how bad it is. I honestly think I'm losing about 1/3 of my pines. See:

    Texas drought kills as many as half a billion trees

    I also like the wedge driving thing Charlie mentioned.
    Your welcome.

    Pines are rough to cut. The limbs are generally low to the ground, and when the tree falls......it can roll in any direction.

    Always plan and clear your escape route first.

    Use plastic wedges made by Stihl. Do not use metal ones, one touch with the saw and you'll be sharpening for a long, long time.

    Look at the saw closely. There sould be a 'felling sight' on it. Once you learn to use it, your gold

    Be careful when limbing after the tree is down......the tree will roll...........I once got wedged between two downed trees that way. The only thing that saved me from being crushed was that I turned the saw.........and the bar stopped the rolling tree. Had to wait for the skidder to come back to winch the tree away from me.
    Don

    MF GC2400, FEL, 60in.MMM, 5ft. Cultivator, Single Bottom Plow, Bush Hog RTC48 tiller, MF 2360 front mount snowblower, 5ft backblade. BXpanded Piranha toothbar.

  10. #20
    Platinum Member Hoosier Hay Man's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    552
    Location
    Indiana
    Tractor
    Kioti DK45S Cab, Quicktach FEL

    Default Re: Pushing over dying pines with FEL

    Pushing over dead trees is risky. They have been known to break in half and come backwards. We had a neighbor killed 20 years ago pushing over trees with a Case backhoe.
    Thanks,

    HHM

    Tractors include 2009 Kioti DK45S Cab, 1974 JD4430, 1952 Oliver 77, 1953 JD50, 1940 JD A, 1938 Farmall F-14,

    NH 489 Haybine, NH 315 Baler, Gehl 1465 Round Baler, NH 68 Baler, Kuhn GA301 GM Rake, Kuhn GA25 Rake/Tedder, JD 851 Rake, GT-77 ATV Herd Seeder,
    Everlast PowerArc 200

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