Backhoe looking to purchase TLB for 30 acre homested

[LMychajluk]

Lol... I'd be a little hesitant to buy a machine that was spitting oil or tranny fluid, but I guess it was worth a look. I'll keep an eye out for any 'side of the road' deals while I'm in the area. The logger down the road from me always has some piece of machinery or other out front with a 'For Sale' sign on it. (I think currently it's an articulated loader...)

 

[hawkeye08]

Daughter and son in law just bought a TLB for their newly acquired 5 acres. They need to cut a driveway, prep a building site, trench for power, water (after well gets drilled) and put in septic. They also have a bunch of stumps that will get taken care of. They went to local auction that had perhaps half a dozen TLBs, and got a reasonable deal. It should work for their needs, but certainly they took a risk (no test drive, no digging, but were able to check it over). Previous owner will be delivering it for them this week.

BTW, neither of them have spent any time on tractors or TLBs. They are get er done kind of people and are not afraid to do some research and figure things out. I'm sure they will do fine.

 

[rScotty]

and if you'r reading this Rscotty, then this is the answer to your question about why I think the price is low. Ironically, I asked if there was room to negotiate on the price and was told no, especially once the leak is fixed then they'l have even more $$ into it.

as soon as the fella started the 580E up, it began pissing black liquid from underneath. nice. literally the moment the engine was started. psssss

the fella moved the buckets and everything seemed to work but obviously I wasn't interested in taking a test drive as the poor girl was losing fluid with every move.

I asked when the last time they serviced it was and he said they didn't. they bought it in the fall and used it to make a retaining wall and now are selling it. no service. later I asked Matt if it would be serviced prior to sale he said no, actually seemed like perhaps I asked a dumb question.

furthermore, as I mentioned earlier in a post, this thing was landlocked in between a few other machines and I was told there is no place to dig and it was not easily able to be driven down the road without moving several other machines.

OK, Yeah, I thought it was better than that and that you had bought it. So I wrote a long post this morning about what to do once you have it.
Obviously I was jumping the gun.
Yes, I'd run away from that 580 and think twice about going back except maybe to thank the guy for being such an *AH* salesman. Being generous, there's just the slightest chance that me might be trying to save you from yourself in the only way he knows. Sounds like it worked.....which is good. I'd say something far more than the leak is wrong with that deal.

the 310 looked great but at 8500 hours and $20k I'm not sure....

It's not impossible at that many hours, but unlikely. I've bought JD310s with 6/7000 hours which worked just fine although they eventually needed about 5K in just old age maintenance = pins, bushings, hoses, tires, batts. But basically nothing really wrong. So maybe such a thing exists at 8500 hrs ?? I doubt it. But if everything seemed to work I'd offer 12. BTW, I'd be looking for another dealer myself. My own experience is that I've rarely bought anything worth keeping from a dealer.

IN THE WORLD OF OLDER TRACTORS, "KEEPERS" TEND TO COME FROM PRIVATE INDIVIDUALS, NOT DEALERS.
A Private Individual Owner is just what you are going to be. Would you trust buying from yourself?

anyway, blah blah blah,,, is this normal? any thoughts on the leak? no crystal ball so don't need to speculate too much, I just wanted to follow up and post the results of that visit and thought it was TOO FUNNNY that you mentioned M&H in your post Lee. again, I have zero beef with the dealer or Matt, he seemed polite and honest, I would be happy to purchase a machine from them just perhaps under better circumstances.

Look, buying a commercial duty machine has little in common with buying a compact tractor. And this is a compact forum. If you are going to keep looking at 580s and 310s, I wonder if you need to back up, and find a dealer who sells these yellow machines exclusively. Maybe go to your local commercial JD310 shop - ask any operator at any construction site for a recommended shop. Snoop around and try to buy lunch for a salesman you get along with. I'll bet you that every saleman there has a private list of private owners that he has known for decades. Mine sure does.

Luck, rScotty

 

[ofenback]

OK, Yeah, I thought it was better than that and that you had bought it. So I wrote a long post this morning about what to do once you have it.
Obviously I was jumping the gun.
Yes, I'd run away from that 580 and think twice about going back except maybe to thank the guy for being such an *AH* salesman. Being generous, there's just the slightest chance that me might be trying to save you from yourself in the only way he knows. Sounds like it worked.....which is good. I'd say something far more than the leak is wrong with that deal.



It's not impossible at that many hours, but unlikely. I've bought JD310s with 6/7000 hours which worked just fine although they eventually needed about 5K in just old age maintenance = pins, bushings, hoses, tires, batts. But basically nothing really wrong. So maybe such a thing exists at 8500 hrs ?? I doubt it. But if everything seemed to work I'd offer 12. BTW, I'd be looking for another dealer myself. My own experience is that I've rarely bought anything worth keeping from a dealer.

IN THE WORLD OF OLDER TRACTORS, "KEEPERS" TEND TO COME FROM PRIVATE INDIVIDUALS, NOT DEALERS.
A Private Individual Owner is just what you are going to be. Would you trust buying from yourself?



Look, buying a commercial duty machine has little in common with buying a compact tractor. And this is a compact forum. If you are going to keep looking at 580s and 310s, I wonder if you need to back up, and find a dealer who sells these yellow machines exclusively. Maybe go to your local commercial JD310 shop - ask any operator at any construction site for a recommended shop. Snoop around and try to buy lunch for a salesman you get along with. I'll bet you that every saleman there has a private list of private owners that he has known for decades. Mine sure does.

Luck, rScotty

scotty that's a fantastic idea! I'm going to take your advice on that and see if I can't get the inside scoop on a nice machine for the cost of lunch and a few pints. Genius.

and yes, I would absolutely trust buying from myself. All I'm really looking for is an honest deal. I just want to get a fair shake, and pay for what I'm getting and get what I'm paying for.

 

[ofenback]

and regarding The advice you gave me when you thought that I already bought the machine, that's fine… I'm going to need that exact advice as soon as I do end up with something so timing may have been off but the content is much appreciated and well received.
thanks again.

 

[ofenback]

hey fellas, thanks for bearing with me on all this.
I've got a lead on a 580 K, which I think is from about 88 or 89. It appears to be a phase 1 machine as it's got yellow fenders and the gearshift is on the floor.
It seems to have had a fairly cushy life, used at a garden center for loading mulch.
one owner.
It's got plenty of rust around the cab and the glass, but everything is intact and it's in fairly good shape as far as I can tell.
A few spots rusted through under the wheel wells, but the chassis and rims are good.
The one issue is that the passenger side stabilizer ram is leaking considerably. as a result, the machine is was very low on fluid when I went to look at it. engine oil was good and clean and what little hyd fluid was there looked clear, but it was very low on the dipstick. almost non-existant.

So I have a few questions..

1. could anyone to help me identify the exact spec of this machine with the serial number?

The serial number is JJG0007288.

2. how difficult is it to replace the cylinder and repack everything on a stabilizer? And should I do the other one at the same time, with hoses and a seal kit, or should I just do them one at a time as needed?
3. then, should I be concerned about possible damage to the hydraulic pump if the machine has been low on fluid for any length of time?
4. based on my previous posts, looking for a machine for a rocky hillside does anyone have any specific thoughts on the 580 K for this? if this is phase 1 it's got the same somewhat simple transmission found on the earlier c's d's and e's correct?

5. are there any issues that i should be aware of and look for with this model?


thanks so much fellas! Really appreciate all the help.

 

[ofenback]

just a few more tidbits of info, she's somewhat whiny. As I am moving buckets up and down and messing with all of the functions, (3 lever!!) she whines. Is that a symptom of being low on fluid? she can pick herself up off the ground with the stabilizers the front bucket and the hoe together or independently no problem. So she seems strong, she just whines.

this was definitely the nicest one that I've seen so far, under (15k) and the owner seems the most honest and straightforward so far. He fired up the machine, showed me a few basic controls and then walked away and left me there for over an hour to mess with the machine, lift up rocks, dig mulch and item and just play and suss the girl out. So that made me feel pretty good.

 

[rScotty]

just a few more tidbits of info, she's somewhat whiny. As I am moving buckets up and down and messing with all of the functions, (3 lever!!) she whines. Is that a symptom of being low on fluid? she can pick herself up off the ground with the stabilizers the front bucket and the hoe together or independently no problem. So she seems strong, she just whines.

this was definitely the nicest one that I've seen so far, under (15k) and the owner seems the most honest and straightforward so far. He fired up the machine, showed me a few basic controls and then walked away and left me there for over an hour to mess with the machine, lift up rocks, dig mulch and item and just play and suss the girl out. So that made me feel pretty good.

I don't know those 580s like I do the 310s. But lots of friends have them and love them. My impression is that the Case 580 was designed a bit more towards owner maintenance and upkeep than the JD or Cats - and I do like that. Overall this one sounds pretty good. You'll want to check the clutch to see how it feels. Is there any way to check how much life is left in that mechanical clutch plate and throw out? I don't know, hope someone here does. Sometimes you just have to go with what you feel.

Not surprised it can lift itself up - All these TLBs can. If a full sized TLB gets hold of something solid with the backhoe bucket, they will really throw themselves around.

A stabilizer cylinder is nothing. Someone probably tried to move the tractor with the stabilizer down and put a small bend in the rod. Old seals couldn't compensate and you get a leak. New seals are more rubbery & will sometimes compensate for some rod bends or dings.. Some hydraulic shops can straighten or turn rods. Any commercial cylinder can be substituted. Not a big deal.

If hydraulics whine it is the pump and is due to either it is low on fluid or has been run low. DO NOT RUN ANY TRACTOR LOW ON HYDRAULIC OIL.
ADD OIL NOW!.
What happens when a fluid pump gets low is that air gets entrained into the fluid and that makes micro-bubbles. As the pump works it shears the bubbles which is what is causing a whine initially. But eventually the exploding micro bubbles also are like little bombs and erode the close tolerance faces of the pump. So if this goes on for awhile that eroded surface in the pump will also will begin to whine even after fluid is added. What it means is that pump now has a limited lifespan. You have no idea if that means months or years....but it will eventually weaken and may just flat fail. On a whiner, change hydraulic filters often, consider adding a bypass filter to catch the sub-micron crud. Too bad, but not the end of the world. The reality is that all hydraulic pumps eventually wear faces and seals. Check pump prices though.

Why the rust? Parking lot salt & fertilizer?
rScotty

 

[Luke'sScreenName]

The biggest issue for me on big cylinders is getting the gosh dang gland nut off. IMO, worst case, you spend a few hundred $ to have a shop do it. I've paid just to have them crack it open. Don't let that stop you as cylinder issues are innevitable at your price point.

Also IMO I would not do the other side unless it's leaking excessively.

Did the breaks work?

 

[ofenback]

The biggest issue for me on big cylinders is getting the gosh dang gland nut off. IMO, worst case, you spend a few hundred $ to have a shop do it. I've paid just to have them crack it open. Don't let that stop you as cylinder issues are innevitable at your price point.

Also IMO I would not do the other side unless it's leaking excessively.

Did the breaks work?

yeah the breaks worked ok, but I did need to get on em pretty hard for the machine to stop quick in 1st gear. it certainly didn't skid