Ballast - Any merit in this idea?

   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #1  

kenlip

Silver Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2017
Messages
222
Location
NSW Australia
Tractor
Kubota MX5100 with Challenge FEL and 4:1
Tractor MX5100. Challenge loader, 4:1 bucket, pallet forks, loaded tyres, hilly property.

I am planning on copying James K0UA's idea, http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...nt-counterweight-post2318005.html#post2318005

Looking at dozens of posts on TBN, it seems that the challenge is to get adequate weight in the ballast box/barrel.

But, at the same time one doesn't want to have too much weight, because that can then cause the front axle to become too 藜*ight?

With these concepts in mind, I am thinking of making two barrels, that can be linked together when more ballast is required.

By having the second barrel behind the first on, one is also increasing the lever-arm effect, making the second barrel even more effective.

Before I spend too much time designing ways to couple the two barrels together, I'd be interested to hear all your comments about the concept.

I plan to use as much steel as possible (e.g. old brake disks), as steel is about three times the density of concrete.

Using steel rather than concrete allows the weight to be kept lower, improving the centre of gravity of the system. It makes sense to me to rather fill a barrel 1/3 full of steel, than completely fill it with concrete, for the same weight.

How much weight should I aim for?

How would you divide it over the two barrels?

Ken
 
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   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #2  
Modular rear ballast... I like it.

Agree on all points, more steel, lower the better.

I would add one caution/idea to the mix... my dad has a barrel much as you describe, 55 gallon drum, filled up about 2/3-3/4 full with scrap steel and then concrete filler, with the lower link pins quite far to the 'rear' of the barrel, to the point where the 'front' of the barrel is nearly touching the PTO shaft on his ol' Massey Ferguson 135. This allows the barrel to sit on the draw bar, bearing most of the weight, not the 3ph arms. It does, however, require a custom, 4" long 'top link', which permanently attached to the barrel.

Dad left 2 pieces of rebar sticking out of the concrete, looks like joystick levers, put some old carpet in the bottom, pipe foam insulation around the top edge of the barrel, and as a small kid (circa mid-1980's) I spent hours sitting in that barrel, 'driving' while dad did loader work. The safety police would go nuts these days... As dad gets older, more frail from fighting age and cancer, memories like these are priceless.

Good luck on your barrel build... please share pictures of progress.
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #3  
I think for the attachment mechanism, I would make something similar to half of a skid steer quick attach, like one of the two in this drawing.

CroppedImage582325-Skid-Steer-Quick-Attach-Device-Adapter.jpg

But you may find that a single centered attachment may allow the rear barrel to swing side to side, as on a rough road, stressing the connection.

Bruce
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea?
  • Thread Starter
#4  
Modular rear ballast... I like it.

I would add one caution/idea to the mix... my dad has a barrel much as you describe, 55 gallon drum, filled up about 2/3-3/4 full with scrap steel and then concrete filler, with the lower link pins quite far to the 'rear' of the barrel, to the point where the 'front' of the barrel is nearly touching the PTO shaft on his ol' Massey Ferguson 135. This allows the barrel to sit on the draw bar, bearing most of the weight, not the 3ph arms. It does, however, require a custom, 4" long 'top link', which permanently attached to the barrel.

Interesting idea about having the barrel sit on the drawbar, to take the weight of the 3PH. This would, however raise the centre of gravity of the system. I am not sure if it preferable to protect the 3PH a bit or have the COG as low as possible. I tend to think the lower COG is more important.

Dad left 2 pieces of rebar sticking out of the concrete, looks like joystick levers, put some old carpet in the bottom, pipe foam insulation around the top edge of the barrel, and as a small kid (circa mid-1980's) I spent hours sitting in that barrel, 'driving' while dad did loader work. The safety police would go nuts these days..
.
Yep - sounds like great fun, but my grandkids are just going to have find other ways to have fun :)

As dad gets older, more frail from fighting age and cancer, memories like these are priceless.

Sorry to hear that time is taking its inevitable toll on your dad and that he has to face the 'Big-C'. :sorry:


Good luck on your barrel build... please share pictures of progress.

Thanks. I'll to document the build with lots of photos, but I often tend to get caught up in the moment and forget to take photos
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #5  
I think that filling the lower portion of the barrel with steel is a good idea, and I wish I had done it. I would think for your size tractor about 1200 or 1300 lbs would be about right. I have never felt that the front end of my tractor or in this case the two tractors I have had my barrel on have been light. And when you have a front end loader on the front, that is a pretty good lever arm even when empty. Let alone when you have over half a ton in it as a load.

So things I would do differently in my build. I would have put several more hundred pounds of steel in the bottom. I would have put 4 two inch PVC pipes in as tool holders instead of just 3. It always seems I need "just one more". Maybe a slot for the chainsaw too.
Good luck with your build.
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #6  
Tractor MX5100. Challenge loader, 4:1 bucket, pallet forks, loaded tyres, hilly property.

I am planning on copying James K0UA's idea, http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...nt-counterweight-post2318005.html#post2318005

Looking at dozens of posts on TBN, it seems that the challenge is to get adequate weight in the ballast box/barrel.

But, at the same time one doesn't want to have too much weight, because that can then cause the front axle to become too 藜*ight?

[snip]
Ken

This would be the last thing I would worry about in making a rear 3ph ballast.

My first worry would be: Will my 3ph lift it?

My second worry is if the answer to #1 is Yes, then: Did I make it heavy enough?

I made a 55 gallon barrel/concrete ballast weight. I used it until I got my LMC 6' box blade. Never used the 55 gallon barrel ballast again.

So instead of making a single-use, worthless for anything else (other than carrying something), I would modify an existing and useful implement and add weight to that.

For example the aforementioned box blade: I added 6' of 140 lb RR rail to it (since removed) and a 410 concrete, steel and lead weight block to the rear. I then mounted the 110 lb Ratchet Rake onto that for a total of 520 lbs on the back end of my box blade. Not quite as compact as a 55 barrel but far more useful.

Pics:

IMG_20150409_140748593_HDR (Large).jpgIMG_20150409_140802465 (Large).jpgIMG_20150409_140826974_HDR (Large).jpgIMG_20150409_140833497_HDR (Large).jpg
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #7  
Just another idea; how 'bout turning the barrel on it's side to lower the cg, then making a framework coming out the front that has several places to attach the 3 point. Each attachment position would put the barrel further out to give more leverage to it's weight.

The last time I made a barrel ballast for an old TO30 I had years ago, I used a plastic barrel. It came out really nice and surprisingly durable.
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #8  
So instead of making a single-use, worthless for anything else (other than carrying something), I would modify an existing and useful implement and add weight to that.

I agree with this approach, as does a good friend of mine. His solution is quite effective, mine is a smaller copy of the same principle. He took about half of the counter weight from an old Clark fork truck he scrapped, and mounted that to the top of his box blade. Very effective as ballast, adds weight to cutting edge of the blade for dirt work, and very useful when in the woods doing his yearly firewood, as he has Westendorf BrushCrusher grapples.

I have a much smaller tractor, so a 5' piece of rail road track chained to the back edge of my box blade does the trick. I often use the same piece of track in the loader bucket for extra front ballast when brush hogging, as my brush hog is almost too big for my tractor/loader to balance on the steeper places on my farm. I have traversed 45º (accuratly measured, not guessing) slopes with this set-up, going up and down.
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea?
  • Thread Starter
#9  
So instead of making a single-use, worthless for anything else (other than carrying something), I would modify an existing and useful implement and add weight to that.

I agree with you. However, I don't have any rear-mounting implements (yet). At the moment the only implements I have are the 4:1 and the pallet forks.
 
   / Ballast - Any merit in this idea? #10  
I agree with the above posters. If your after-market loader lifts say 1800-2200lbs then make the ballast 1200-1300lbs (assuming your tires are loaded) and don't worry about your front end getting too light... It won't happen.
 
 
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