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  1. #31
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2000
    Posts
    3,239
    Location
    Eastern Virginia
    Tractor
    EarthForce EF-5 mini-TLB (2001)

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    Paul - No "snideness" at all detected by me!

    And I can see where some might take that education thing the wrong way. I hadn't considered that. We all see things through our own windows. I see TBN as primarily an educational opportunity. Perhaps some view it as a nice way to chat with folks they already agree with. I might tend to torque the latter out of shape on a regular basis, because my assumption (yes, I've heard the saying), is that they wouldn't be on TBN if they didn't want to be exposed to new things. I can see where that may not be a valid assumption. But surely, those folks have by now learned not to read any of my posts, though, don't you think? [img]/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  2. #32
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2000
    Posts
    3,239
    Location
    Eastern Virginia
    Tractor
    EarthForce EF-5 mini-TLB (2001)

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    Richard - You made some very good points. In fact, I don't think I disagree with anything you said. Except maybe the 95% statistic. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif[/img]

    None of the EarthForce machines currently available would be worth a plug nickel mowing lawns because, as you said, they're too heavy.

    Your point about dragging the backhoe around all the time has some merit, but remember that it's not just a backhoe, it's an arm with a hydraulic PTO on it. You can use it to power an auger, a stump grinder, things like that. They're getting more and more versatile all the time, and they're already versatile enough to replace a compact tractor for me. Now, I'll admit, as Paul indicated, I'd rather have my L4310 and the EF-5 with me on every job, but it's not practical, so some compromises are necessary.

  3. #33
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2000
    Posts
    3,239
    Location
    Eastern Virginia
    Tractor
    EarthForce EF-5 mini-TLB (2001)

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    Mark - It sounds like we share more than a common first name. You seem to view TBN in almost exactly the same way as I do. I have learned huge amounts of information from TBN and continue to do so. Education is the only reason I continue to participate here. Chatting is nice, and I enjoy the banter quite a bit from time, and the good-natured ribbing (my EF-5 is still white, not pink, though - Harv still hasn't shown up with his electrostatic paint rig [img]/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif[/img]), but education is why most of us are here, I think (though I've been corrected a few times before with regard to my assumptions about others - maybe this will be another one). At any rate, I'm sure of one thing: the "fun" notwithstanding, when I no longer learn anything here, and no one credits me with at least having exposed them to something they hadn't considered before, whether they feel they've learned something or not, I'm outta here. Or, at the least, very seldom seen.

  4. #34
    Super Star Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Posts
    11,989
    Location
    PA
    Tractor
    NH TC25D

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    <font color=blue>Just that some may take offence at the suggestion that until they read this thread they risk buying the wrong thing.</font color=blue>

    Perhaps it's the inability of the written word to accurately convey intent, but I did not take Mark's post to imply someone would be buying the wrong thing. Rather they might not be buying the best thing.

    If all someone has owned, or has had experience with, are ag tractors or CUTs, then their frame of reference for potential solutions to a particular problem will be to solve it with an ag tractor or a CUT. This isn't right or wrong, it just is how most of us think.

    Here at work, people are 'amazed' when they get a computer program written in the COBOL language when they go to a department staffed by people that only know COBOL. It doesn't matter what the program was needed for, from statistical analysis to payroll processing, they always get it written in COBOL, even though there are programming languages much better suited to statistical analysis, e.g., SAS, because that's the only programming language that department knows.

    Kind of like the old adage, "If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail."

  5. #35
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    932
    Location
    QC, Canada
    Tractor
    B7500HSD

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    <font color=blue>Perhaps it's the inability of the written word to accurately convey intent</font color=blue>

    Couldn't have said it better (no - really, I couldn't).[img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    I see the "looks like a nail problem" quite frequently. I work in a sheet metal shop. When we were a much smaller operation and I was working in the plant, employees were responsible for providing their own tool boxes. Many chose to make their own using the available equipment.
    -All the press-brake operators (metal benders) bent their boxes with as few individual components as possible.
    -The welders cut individual panels and welded them together.
    -The best looking boxes were made by those who used a combination of both methods.

    When I wrote that some <font color=blue>may take offence</font color=blue>, may is what I meant. I come here to learn new things, as MarkC does. Just saying that some may not react too well when they're 10K$+ purchase decision is questioned. Same goes for the brand of beer a guy drinks, or the type of hunting dog he uses. Eggshells, you know what I mean?

    Anyways, I'm dropping out of this now as MarkC has already clarified to me what the purpose of this thread is and I have already given the reason for my decision to purchase a CUT. No hard feelings anyone. By the way, I'm usually not this neurotic.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

  6. #36
    Super Star Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Posts
    11,989
    Location
    PA
    Tractor
    NH TC25D

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    <font color=blue>-All the press-brake operators (metal benders) bent their boxes with as few individual components as possible.
    -The welders cut individual panels and welded them together.
    -The best looking boxes were made by those who used a combination of both methods.</font color=blue>

    What great examples! It's nice to know that it's not only computer programmers that try and apply the only tool they have to every problem they come across. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  7. #37
    Veteran Member Charlie_Iliff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Posts
    1,896
    Location
    Arnold, MD
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT1845, John Deere 2240, John Deere 950, John Deere 755, Jacobsen Turf Cat II

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    Mark:
    Right up front, I'd like to admit that many of my purchases have been wrong - generally too expensive, and generally not quite addressing my real needs. Like CowboyDoc, I suspect if I had a backhoe, its use would be seldom, but I really want one. The Earthforce would be great, but I'd seldom use it - so why do I still want it?
    My actual use of machinery is at least 90% mowing. For lawns, we use an old Jacobsen Turf Cat II with 72" front mounted finish deck. It is far better than the MMM's we have worn out doing the same areas for a lot of years, on a B7100 kubota and 755 JD, not to mention a Cub Cadet. Our only FEL is on a 2240 JD. We use it for bucket work, forks, and log moving, etc. because that's what we have. I have no doubt that an Earth Force would be better. For pasture mowing, we use a 950 JD with an old Woods 6' brush hog. Although nervous making on the steep areas, it has performed fine for decades. A batwing would be better. A batwing up front would be great, but wouldn't work on an Earthforce.
    I'm still hoping to get a Power-Trac. The prices on the 1430 and 1845 just came down. They only have 1200 lb loader capacity, but they push a 6' mower, and probably can do both my lawn and pasture work, as well as the vast majority of the loader stuff. For that combination, they're better than the Earth Force. I still want a backhoe. Maybe I can adapt a 3 point hitch hoe to ride the front of the Power Trac - for those few times I need to avoid a shovel. (I am talking to Long about the plumbing needed to use the Power Trac hydraulic PTO to open and close a 4 in 1, with a toggle switch on the joystick, so I can lift, roll and open and close all at once. It may even work.)
    This thread has stimulated a bit of brand loyalty, but has been fun. It has shown, however, that the Earth Force isn't quite the perfect machine yet. It isn't quite all things to all TBN members yet, so please continue your long strange quest.

  8. #38

    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    349
    Location
    Peculiar, MO
    Tractor
    B2400 Kubota

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    The problem as I see it is that MarkC is confusing uses of a dirt moving machine and a compact tractor. Each has it uses. The dirt moving for movig dirt, it just happens to look like a tractor, the other used to mow, till and other farming(small farming that is) things. One is not better than the other, just different tasks to be accomplished. The thread really belongs in the construction equipment group. Which I read to learn more things then i know now.

    Dan L

  9. #39
    Epic Contributor MossRoad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    29,802
    Location
    South Bend, Indiana (near)
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    Please clarify for me...
    CUT = compact utility tractor
    TLB = ____ loader backhoe?

    What else is there.

    Would the PT425 be a mini TL with no B?

  10. #40

    Join Date
    Aug 2000
    Posts
    3,371
    Location
    California - S.F. East Bay & Sierra foothills
    Tractor
    Kubota L2500DT Standard Transmission

    Default Re: Tractors, Mini-TLBs, and Life

    David -

    Tractor Loader Backhoe

    You might enjoy skimming through an old thread called, "<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showthreaded.pl?Cat=&amp;Board=support&amp;Number= 27525&amp;page=&amp;view=&amp;sb=&amp;o=&amp;vc=1# Post27525>Glossary Of Tractor Terms</A>".

    I love word puzzles.

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