Oil & Fuel Gas Tank

   / Gas Tank #1  
L

ldabe

Gold Member
Joined
Apr 6, 2006
Messages
354
Location
SE, Michigan
Tractor
PT-422 2002 Robin eng.
Saturday Evening was forecasting a heavy amount of snow, so I went to make sure my tractor (422) and truck were full of fluids, and tried to start them up.

The truck had a dead battery. Jumped it and it started up.
Put the Snow Bear snow blade on...ready to plow 1600 feet of drive.

The 422 cranked and cranked until the battery began to die down. Jumped it, still cranked and cranked but no start.
Used 'starting fluid' and cranked the crap out of it some more! After doing this (outside temp was around 37 degrees, 422 kept in a 3 sided and roofed pole barn, no door) for quite sometime, numerous times, it finally started. Man! Is this thing a cold starter or what? Anyone else have this problem when the temps dropped down below 50 degrees?

After letting it run for about 15 min. I did some lifting and moving with it for about 10 min., then let it run for another 15 min. while I jockeyed things around in my attached garage (not heated, but insulated same as the house) to put the 422 into.

Now for the "gas tank".

The gas tank did not have a shut off valve on it, and I remember reading in either the Robin manual or the Power Trac manual that it should have one. So I put one on before the beginning of summer.

I have had the 422 in my garage before, when I didn't have the gas shut off valve, and there was a very strong odor of gas, very strong.
After putting the shut off valve on, and turning it off after the engine shut down, there is still a very noticeable odor of gas, but not nearly as bad as without the shut off valve.

Question? Does anyone else get this very noticeable smell of gas?

Is this smell just from what is left in the carb?
Can it be corrected?
 
   / Gas Tank #2  
Same cold start problem. I had the recall on the ignition coils, so now now at least it starts under 40F. Two magnetic heaters on the bottom of the hydraulic reservoir, and a kerosene torpedo heater blowing into the engine compartment. Crank over for about 5 seconds then back fires. Crank over some more, couple more backfires and then finally get it running. These are not small backfires either, sounds like a 12 gage shotgun. The cold oil hydraulic load on the engine while starting is pretty large. Wish there was a better way.
 
   / Gas Tank #3  
I have a 2001 model year PT425 with the Kohler engine. I have started with no problems down to -5. No preheating of the engine or hydraulics.

As for gas smell. I keep it in a shed. Never had a smell of gas.
 
   / Gas Tank #4  
I have the Robin in my 422...cold(less than 25 in a non heated garage) is slower starting than normal but nothing like you guys state! I have never had the gas odor problem either...seems strange the same engines have such different situations!
 
   / Gas Tank #5  
   / Gas Tank #6  
Just my $0.02 here, but I wouldn't want to have equipment that has noticeable fuel vapors coming off of it. For some reason engine fires leap to mind. Wherever the leak is, cap, tank, lines, filter, carb, I'd put in a little time to find it and fix it.

I'm also surprised at the variation in starting. I wonder if it something systematic, like differences in spark plug gaps, or coil/lead performance.

I'd expect a normal Kohler to catch within a few seconds down to freezing, a bit longer if it was 0.

When you have the cold start problem, do you smell lots of gas in the exhaust, like the engine is flooding? If you do, have you checked the gap on your spark plug?

Diesels are a different story. My 1445 takes perhaps twice as long at 40F to start, and when it does, it seems like there's a cold cylinder for 30 seconds or so. Twice as long being ~7 seconds of cranking.

Still, it seems rude to me to ask a diesel to start without prewarming the glow plugs.

All the best,

Peter
 
   / Gas Tank #7  
I have the 2003 425 with Kohler engine. I do use a block heater on the oil tank but other than that nothing. With temps getting into the -10 to -25 it will start after a few turns. Must wait about 10 to 15 minutes to get warmed up before starting to plow. No gas fumes ever.
PJ
 
   / Gas Tank
  • Thread Starter
#8  
I agree Peter, that is why I don't want anything around it to possibly ignite those fumes.
I have not checked the gap lately, it was correct when put in at beginning of the summer.
Shouldn't plugs last at least a year?!
Now that you mention it, I do believe it gets a slight smell of 'flooding'. I will check the plugs.

Moss Road,
From all the input we get from you, I believe the Kohler engine is a much better engine than the Robin, hands down!
I have a 1974 Wheelhorse rider with a 16hp Kohler, and man that thing runs great! You never have to worry about the weather and it starting, and I don't take care of it even 50% as well as I baby the PT 422. In fact, you could say I neglect and abuse it.

By the way, if
Jack Robin
sees this, I would appreciate his input ;~)
(Just thought of something, if the Robin is really a Subaru, why don't they even come close to operating like a Honda, including the quietness?)

Check this out from the Subaru/Robin site:
Standard Features:
• Easy Start
• High Power & Performance
• Great Reliability & Durability
• Long Life
• Low Emissions, meeting EPA Phase 2
& CARB Tier II requirements
• Quiet Running, with low noise,
rust resistant mufflers
• Easy Maintenance
• 2-Year Limited Manufacturer’s Warranty
from Subaru Robin

"Easy Start" and "Quiet running"! Come on, not from the testimonies you read on here.

So again, it is probably a stretch to also say "Great Reliability & Durability ". Just before mine turned over to 300 hrs. (it is a 2003) I had to have the ignition coils replaced.

Oh! And for Easy Maintenance", not really. But I cannot blame that on Subaru/Robin, Power Trac was the one who jammed it down into a 'coffin' so tight that you can barely get one hand in between the engine and the 'coffin box'.

I have said it before and I will say it again, "When the PT in operating the way it should, it is hard to beat; but when it doesn't, it will feel like it beat the crap out of you."
 
   / Gas Tank #9  
I agree that a gap should last a few hundred hours. Out of curiousity, how were the plugs when you last looked at them? i.e. did it look like they were running hot/cold/rich/lean? Plugs can be very informative.

By the way, you might also want to pull a spark plug lead and make sure that there is a reasonable spark.

Have you checked to see if the air filter is clean? (It would help flood the engine, if it isn't...)

All the best,

Peter
 
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