Wheel motors on - starting to get anxious now...

[KentT]

Two speed motors would be nice. Does anyone make them? Actually, two speed with brakes would be even better.

Yes, they're available. I didn't price them so I don't know how expensive they are.

I did consider adding brakes -- Surplus Center actually carries 15.X ci (15.3ci, I think) motors with brakes for slightly less than I paid for these. However, then I would've had to plumb in a brake tender, in addition to buying all new 1.25" hubs. So that quickly made them out of my price range. They would've had heavier duty roller bearings instead of just thrust bearings, though. Combine that with the fact I wasn't sure that displacement would give me the torque I was looking for, and I decided to go this route...

 

[ponytug]

Dear KentT,

I have a couple of places with no run out at the bottom. They all make me really, really nervous- for traction issues. Mostly, they end in a barbed wire fence and a 6-12' vertical drop down on to a paved road. Is there a lower slope route to enter/exit the area?

Several times, I have lost traction on the soil here. For much of the year, we have a dry clay soil with 1/8-1/4" fractured rock in it. If the tires dig through the grass to the soil, the pea gravel pebbles in the soil act like little ball bearings on the hard surface and traction goes to pieces in seconds.

SO...my concern with your mowing down there has everything to do with traction to get back out. I've gone brush cutting on some of the lower slopes only to have the tractor have issues climbing out again, either because of the gravel, or wet cuttings.

Once I had the draft control on coming up a 25+degree slope and the tractor barely made it on a hot day. Trying again later, I lifted the brush cutter, which transfered the weight to the tractor wheels, and it wasn't a problem. Live and learn. I think it was just the extra load to drive the float over rough ground that put the tractor almost over the edge, so to speak. I have also had it occur mowing lush thistles, when the sap was so wet that it was like being on ice. Just a heads up. Worst case, I am sure that you could add a little additional help from a second vehicle if you get get stuck down there.

I may go the route of the 20W50 oil and something to beef up the side slope resistance, but for the moment, I am still learning the limits on the machine. As you can imagine, I would really, really, really prefer not to tip it over. After Ksmolo's great experience with chains, I looked into them, but I haven't found ones that match the skid steer tire currently on my 1445.

I think you have created a really interesting tractor, and I'll be interested to see how you like it, and how it performs, both in terms of slope, and confidence, but also what impact the new motors have on temperature and engine speed.

All the best,

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for taking the time to confirm my "guesstimates" -- I thought I was about to the 20 degree point on the areas I've had the PT on. All I knew was it really taxed the PT to climb out of there with a bucket of mulch. I mowed going around the slope as best I could, and it would still crab down the hill as it bounced.

Luckily the steeper area off-camera, above, is pretty small. The challenge is that theres no place at the bottom to turn around or maneuver -- theres a bank down there from where a dozer cut a trail when the ponds were built about 30 years ago. It will require that I either mow around the slope and climb out (most likely path), or back down as far as I can and climb out. You can see what I mean in this series of pics taken from about the same position as the panorama, and starts at the lower end of that mulch pile and goes farther left...

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/65/177069514_750bf6512b_b.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/63/177069598_a7a35185a0_b.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/73/177069661_47fe98fae1_b.jpg

I don't think it gets any steeper than 25 degrees (yes I'm aware of the Kohler's limitations) and I think my own "personal pucker factor" will likely kick in before I run into an engine oiling problem.

If nothing else, I think this illustrates why: (1) I have my wheels reversed, and (2) I was looking for more wheel motor torque to climb out of there...

 

[KentT]

Dear KentT,

I have a couple of places with no run out at the bottom. They all make me really, really nervous- for traction issues. Mostly, they end in a barbed wire fence and a 6-12' vertical drop down on to a paved road. Is there a lower slope route to enter/exit the area?

Unfortunately, there isn't any other way in to that spot except from the top or around the slope. The whole front area to the left is still thick with trees.

SO...my concern with your mowing down there has everything to do with traction to get back out. I've gone brush cutting on some of the lower slopes only to have the tractor have issues climbing out again, either because of the gravel, or wet cuttings.

I'm hoping that with the "extra-low" gearing that I've concocted, that I can creep up out of there without ever spinning. That's another "special order option" that I spec'ed out -- low-speed valving, which supposed increases the efficiency of these geroler motors (which are inherently less efficient at low RPM than the original geroters) at very low RPMs. Preminary reports are that the treadle is VERY sensitive at low speeds now, likely as a result of the larger displacement plus these valves. But hopefully once I adjust to that, that I can "inch" my way up the hills when needed.

Just a heads up. Worst case, I am sure that you could add a little additional help from a second vehicle if you get get stuck down there.

Good point! Now that my son is 16, with a learner's permit, at least I have someone I can use to tow me out with my 4WD pickup.

I think you have created a really interesting tractor, and I'll be interested to see how you like it, and how it performs, both in terms of slope, and confidence, but also what impact the new motors have on temperature and engine speed.

I'm hoping that the efficiency and the reduced "bypassing" will balance out any possible temp increases from this mod. Obviously, I'm excited to see!

 

[MossRoad]

...Good point! Now that my son is 16, with a learner's permit, at least I have someone I can use to tow me out with my 4WD pickup...

It is a sad, sad day when we admit that our children learning to drive is going to help us get out of situations that we tell them never to get into!

My 15 year old drove the tractor to pull our stuck van out of the snow this winter after I buried it. She also drove the tractor to tow the car home when it died two blocks away from the house.

 

[Bob999]

After Ksmolo's great experience with chains, I looked into them, but I haven't found ones that match the skid steer tire currently on my 1445.

Not sure what you are looking for in chains to "match the skid steer tire". However, I have chains on my skid steer to plow steep (20 degree) slopes which are at times icy. I purchased standard hardened 2-link chains and they work well. See: Tractor Tire Chain

 

[ernemats]

Check tirechains.com for a good selection of chains and prices.

 

[ponytug]

Dear Bob999,

Yes, they have a great site. I was hoping to find a diamond pattern or ring chain for some help against crabing on those steep slopes. For my 16.5x10 skid steer tires, I haven't been able to find someone who stocks them. (They are the bar tires that PT offers.)

Any other suggestions? I looked at some forestry websites and several other tractor supply houses.

All the best,

Peter

Not sure what you are looking for in chains to "match the skid steer tire". However, I have chains on my skid steer to plow steep (20 degree) slopes which are at times icy. I purchased standard hardened 2-link chains and they work well. See: Tractor Tire Chain

 

[KentT]

Don't know if they have the right size for you, but here's a good resource:

Welcome to Wallingford's Inc. - Logging Supplies and Tire Chains

 

[Bob999]

Dear Bob999,

Yes, they have a great site. I was hoping to find a diamond pattern or ring chain for some help against crabing on those steep slopes. For my 16.5x10 skid steer tires, I haven't been able to find someone who stocks them. (They are the bar tires that PT offers.)

Any other suggestions? I looked at some forestry websites and several other tractor supply houses.

All the best,

Peter

My only experience is with the standard cross chains. Based on that experience I have no hesitation in recommending the standard chains. Before I used chains I would find my machine uncontrollable on ice--sliding off in what ever direction the slope took me. Since I installed chains I have been able to work securely on ice. My use has been on steep paved surfaces--not mud.

Usually machines designed to work in deep mud have very substantial ground clearance--not a feature of either the PT or a skid steer. I strongly suspect that the ability of the PT to work in mud will be limited more by ground clearance than any difference in traction between standard cross link chains and some of the more complex patterns sold for heavy mud work.

 

[ponytug]

Dear Bob999,

It is great to have heard your experience. I have loose gravel on a dry steeply sloped hillside, which is probably closer to your ice experience than mud. Based on my experience with cars and trucks, I had been looking for the diamond chains for transverse control, as well as traction, but perhaps I should reconsider it.

Thanks!

All the best,

Peter

My only experience is with the standard cross chains. Based on that experience I have no hesitation in recommending the standard chains. Before I used chains I would find my machine uncontrollable on ice--sliding off in what ever direction the slope took me. Since I installed chains I have been able to work securely on ice. My use has been on steep paved surfaces--not mud.

Usually machines designed to work in deep mud have very substantial ground clearance--not a feature of either the PT or a skid steer. I strongly suspect that the ability of the PT to work in mud will be limited more by ground clearance than any difference in traction between standard cross link chains and some of the more complex patterns sold for heavy mud work.