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  1. #1
    Platinum Member wasabi's Avatar
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    Mar 2002
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    717
    Location
    Cullowhee Mountain, NC
    Tractor
    PT2445 and PT1850

    Default 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    I know most TBN PT owners don't have to wrestle with this challenge, but mayhaps you, or "conventional" CUT owners will have insights to offer about the optimum 3 pt hitch. I am soon to pick up a PT2445 with a trailer package. It includes a serious backhoe (3200lb breakout) that is conveniently removable and can be replaced with a 3pt.

    In the now famous "Goodbye kubota, Hello Power-Trac" thread, M Chalkley wrote: <font color=blue>"It was the three-point hitch that worried me. It consisted of a hydraulic top link and two cylinders to control the height of the side links. The cylinders are controlled by a three-spool valve on the right side of the seat. It had the advantage of allowing down pressure, which is something I've always wished my Kubota had, but it did not provide a float position - the side link arms are held rigidly in whatever position they are set to with the hydraulic cylinders. This was completely unacceptable, because most three-point hitch implements require the float position. So, Jack and I have developed a plan for a new three-point hitch design and are working on the implementation of it. The new design also uses only three cylinders, but provides both float and down force when necessary, as well as top and tilt functions, and is a significant improvement over both a standard compact tractor three-point hitch and the original Power Trac design, in my opinion. The new three-point hitch design will do everything a "normal" compact tractor hitch with hydraulic "top and tilt" will, plus down force. A rear hydraulic PTO provides power to rear-mounted tillers, etc. provided, of course, they're hydraulically powered."</font color=blue>

    Here is my quandary. The unit I am acquiring has the 3pt, but the seller wants extra for it. I can't quite tell without actually spending time messing with it, whether or not MCHalkley's eloquent description of improvements can be retrofitted using the existing PT hitch or if it is a start from scratch project. My inclination is to buy it as is (assuming fair price) under the supposition that I can make it work.

    What think you all?

    P.S. In case you are wondering what I would do with it, I imagine it being fairly handy....for example, I have tons of gravel to spread over a mile and a half loggin road. With a rear 3pt and quick plate, I could use the angle blade while simultaneously using the bucket to dump and spread in the same FEL swoop (pun intended). Similarly, I could both rake and till.....or till and harrow....or mow and rake....etc

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Charlie_Iliff's Avatar
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    Jun 2001
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    1,896
    Location
    Arnold, MD
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT1845, John Deere 2240, John Deere 950, John Deere 755, Jacobsen Turf Cat II

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    Doug: In my enthusiasm to eliminate my personal contact with three-point hitches, I ignored Mark's criticisms, while wishing him well on the proposed fixes.
    All of my three points have float automatically, since they have no downforce. On the front mounted PT implements, float is sometimes required, and is built in. I would think it worth a call to Power Trac to see how they rationalize the combination they selected. It may be they can convince you that the machine will work fine for you.
    What is it that the old owner wants to charge extra for? What use does he have for it without the PT?
    It sounds to me as if it's time for you to get Mark Chalkley on the phone and talk it through. It may be that you are better off buying it without the factory 3 point and mounting Mark's improved model. He alone knows what parts his plan would replace, or whether you gain or lose by purchasing the seller's set.

  3. #3
    Platinum Member marrt's Avatar
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    Mar 2002
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    542
    Location
    Northern VA
    Tractor
    Power Trac 1845

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    For what its worth, I was told by PT that they will "soon" have a floating 3PH available for the 2400 series. Apparently, they listened to Mark even though he abandoned PT for some unknown piece of equipment made in a former communist country. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    Platinum Member
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    Apr 2002
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    864
    Location
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Tractor
    Massey-Ferguson MF 1220

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    I'm not sure what their 3PH looks like, but it can't be that hard for them to make it float, can it? I thought float is merely a function of the valve that controls it's position?

    Dave

  5. #5
    Epic Contributor MossRoad's Avatar
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    Aug 2001
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    23,516
    Location
    South Bend, Indiana (near)
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    I wonder why the owner wants to keep it? Maybe he wants the cylinders for some other project.

    The PT 3point hitch is lacking float and one other feature; DRAFT CONTROL.

    Now, most small tractors don't have draft control on their 3pt hitch, so it might not be a problem. My IH2500b has draft control and it is very useful in tough soil conditions. My PT425 doesn't have it either, so I obviously can do without it.

  6. #6
    Platinum Member wasabi's Avatar
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    Mar 2002
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    717
    Location
    Cullowhee Mountain, NC
    Tractor
    PT2445 and PT1850

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    <font color=blue>I thought float is merely a function of the valve that controls it's position?</font color=blue> That is my impression as well, Dave...so I would assume that I could somehow either swap out, or supplement the valves to make it work, add cylinders, or use some of the parts.....

    <font color=blue>In my enthusiasm to eliminate my personal contact with three-point hitches</font color=blue>....I hear you Charlie....and, having been introduced by YOU to the PT quick attach system, I now share your aversion....but, with a back quick attach plate, I can potentially have the best of both worlds. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif[/img]

    <font color=blue>It sounds to me as if it's time for you to get Mark Chalkley on the phone and talk it through</font color=blue>...I e-mailed Mark and in fact, just got off a long phone chat with him. What a gentleman!....he called me, taking HIS valuable time to describe in detail what he was thinking...sequed into other important aspects including safety and generally reassured me that this was as ideal a machine as I could find for what I face (Best Mountain Tractor) He is even sending me the specs on the 3pt he designed. What a guy!...all of TBN is lucky to have you and guys like Mark around.

    <font color=blue>For what its worth, I was told by PT that they will "soon" have a floating 3PH available for the 2400 series. Apparently, they listened to Mark even though he abandoned PT for some unknown piece of equipment made in a former communist country.</font color=blue> Interesting....I didn't know that and neither did Mark. One of his parting coments was he did not want TBNers to think that he had abandoned PT because he has an EarthForce. He still thinks they are great machines...not for him primarily because of the close quarters issue (up aganst walls and such).

    As Charlie said early on, half the fun of acquiring a tractor is the hunt (research aspect). I'm learning valuable tractor and SAFETY insights everyday here. This 3pt issue is, to me, quite fascinating (wonder what that says about my exciting life [img]/w3tcompact/icons/hmm.gif[/img])

    I think it is clear that PT owners are not too hindered in the creativity department. I may be way over-extended here, but I am convinced that this detail can be worked out. With talented, experienced guys the likes of Charlie, MossRoad, Mark, Bubenberg and many others, all pitching in to help spend my money, no problem is insurmountable. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif[/img][img]/w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif[/img][img]/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

    First the tractor, then the implement adaptations.....

    I'll get back with you all after I've done some more cogitatin'.

  7. #7
    Platinum Member
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    Apr 2002
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    864
    Location
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Tractor
    Massey-Ferguson MF 1220

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    MossRoad, educate me here. What does draft control do?

    Dave

  8. #8
    Epic Contributor MossRoad's Avatar
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    Aug 2001
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    23,516
    Location
    South Bend, Indiana (near)
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    If you have a plow in the ground and are happily pulling it along in soft soil and you run into hard soil, the wheels will start spinning and you might get stuck if the soil is hard enough.

    With draft control, the tractor will sense the change in pull and start to lift the implement out of the soil until the pull lessens. Then it will lower the implement back to the pre-set depth.

    The depth of the implement, and sensitivity of the response to pull changes can be set by the operator by making some test runs through the soil before plowing.

    The bigger Power Tracs have draft control on the front lift arms. I'm not familiar with its setup, but apparently, when you are pushing a huge implement, if it starts to get stuck in the grass or ground, without draft control, you could break something. I think Charlie posted something on it earlier. And there is a link to the draft control on the Power Trac website somewhere.

    It is not available on the 400 series and I doubt that you would need it. It is not available on most smaller tractors either.

  9. #9
    Platinum Member wasabi's Avatar
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    Mar 2002
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    717
    Location
    Cullowhee Mountain, NC
    Tractor
    PT2445 and PT1850

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    Actually, MossRoad, believe it or not, the seller in this case owns TWO PT2445's and is keeping a number of implements for the other one, including a sweeper, which I have no use for.

    I offered $500 for the PT 3pt attachment gear, such as it is. He graciously turned my offer down. He says PT will buy back implements for 60% of retail (may be of interest to you for your 24" auger if I don't buy it myself, DaveSisk)

    I figure I can get along well enough without it for a while and then either pick up the "soon to be released" improved PT version or tackle crafting the MChalkley improved version....with "Draft Control" as you suggest.

    Now I'm wondering if I can't bolt a quick attach plate to the 12" bucket on the backhoe to attach the power angle scrape blade...[img]/w3tcompact/icons/hmm.gif[/img]

  10. #10
    Veteran Member Charlie_Iliff's Avatar
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    Jun 2001
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    1,896
    Location
    Arnold, MD
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT1845, John Deere 2240, John Deere 950, John Deere 755, Jacobsen Turf Cat II

    Default Re: 3 pt hitch for PT2445

    <font color=red>The bigger Power Tracs have draft control on the front lift arms. I'm not familiar with its setup, but apparently, when you are pushing a huge implement, if it starts to get stuck in the grass or ground, without draft control, you could break something. I think Charlie posted something on it earlier. And there is a link to the draft control on the Power Trac website somewhere.</font color=red>
    The 1845 does have draft control. It picks up the implement so that there is very little weight on the implement wheels, and max traction weight on the front of the PT. It is recommended on the rough cut mower not only because of increased traction, but also because the mower is so heavy it can break its guide wheels off if allowed to float.
    I haven't tried the draft control with anything but the mower, and don't really know what it is good for.

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