284 LE oil & filter exchange & tilling comparison

[corey]

Wanted to share that the WIX #51515 and Fram 8A oil filters fit the Y385 engine on the 284LE. The Fram 8A offers three different types with various reported levels of filtering sophistication.
Did a 50 hour exchange recently using Rotella 15 W 40 and Fram Tough Guard 8A filter.

Soil preparation for sweet corn planting with a 54" Howard Rotary Tiller has been done with a Yanmar 240D for years.
Soil preparation this year was done with the 54" Howard Rotary Tiller and 284 LE.
The Jinma does a much better job.
Suspect that this is due to the range of speeds that Jinma gearing offers.

 

[Harrygoodwrench]

Here is a study of common oil filters. I cannot vouch for the study but found it very interesting. Make your own conclusions.

http://www.scuderiaciriani.com/rx7/oil_filter_study/

 

[corey]

Harry,

Appreciate the oil filter analysis link.

Very interesting.

Might go with an AC Delco Duraguard next oil change.

thanks,
corey

 

[F100Panel]

I too am not a fan of Fram filters. Our tractors require anti drainback valves in the filters.. Fram uses some kind of ... I dunno..cardboard... for the valve? Many on the web have lamented having a problem with the valve leaking by/letting ALL the oil from the engine drain back into the crankcase allowing dry start ups. I had it happen on my K Car some years back. Right after I changed the oil & filter ( Fram Filter) the car started knocking terrible on start up after setting overnight. Changed the filter again & the knocking stopped/drove the car another 60K trouble free miles...Granted the problem might be one in a milion but Fram sells Billions worldwide & suppose you were the one in a million? I get my filters at NAPA/Made by Wix with METAL anti drainback valves. Just my 2 cents...experience.. Gee after reading this I guess I REALLY dislike Fram.. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[JINMA224XR]

<font color="blue"> Fram uses some kind of ... I dunno..cardboard... for the valve? Many on the web have lamented having a problem with the valve leaking by/letting ALL the oil from the engine drain back into the crankcase allowing dry start ups. I had it happen on my K Car some years back. Right after I changed the oil & filter ( Fram Filter) the car started knocking terrible on start up after setting overnight. Changed the filter again & the knocking stopped/drove the car another 60K trouble free miles </font>

Hey F100Panel,

I 2nd that emotion. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Fram's do a great job of oil filtration, as long as they are left sitting on the shelf. Early Top end overhaul on motorbike, and I give all the well deserved credit to Fram .

Get your Tractors Running &
Have a nice day,
Joe /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[bruce1966us]

The backflow valve only works when the filter is horizontal. If it is verticle , gravity keeps the oil in the filter. Not that I am supporting Fram. Just stating a fact. I use Powerflo from Advance.

 

[TruChaos]

I think a lot of the anti-Fram rhetoric is just that. As the creator of the posted oil filter rating website says, don't take his word for gospel. Taking engineering advice from someone who cuts open oil filters at home probably isn't wise.

Personally, I've used Fram filters for over twenty years. The only reason I wasn't able to get 150,000 miles on a vehicle was because I sold them. One car I had rang up 255,000 miles before I sold it to a neighbor, who drove it for a while then sold it to yet another person. The only repair ever needed was a water pump replacement. This was with Fram filters and non-synthetic oil.

I don't know which Fram filters you're referring to when you say they use cardboard antiback flow valves but, I've never seen anything but rubber. In fact here's what Fram says;

"This valve is usually in the form of a rubber gasket which allows the free flow of oil through the filter in the normal direction, but when the engine is shut down it prevents the oil in the filter from draining back to the crankcase."

I believe the real key to engine life is proper engine maintenance, regular oil changes and using a name brand filter, be it Purolator, Fram or whatever.

I can put a Fram PH3600 on my Jinma for about $4 or I can spend $10 for a Wix at NAPA. Frankly there is so little difference in actual function, that the deciding point simply boils down to personal bias. Would I use the WIX if it were $4, since the store is only a few blocks away? Yes!

Let's be honest, Fram is the number one selling oil filter in the country for one reason, it’s a good value. Meaning good function for a good price. If there were engines failing all over the country due to Fram filters, they would have been out of business long ago. If Bob used Fram filters and only got 100,000 miles on his car when his neighbor got 200,000 using a Purolator filter, Fram wouldn't be around long.

From the Fram website:

"When new motor oil is installed the pump’s pickup tube inlet again becomes sub-merged trapping air in the tube on the suction side of the oil pump. The trapped air will cause cavitation of the pump and prevent it from producing
oil flow and subsequent oil pressure.

Many installers tend to blame this on the oil filter and assume that the filter is blocking the flow of oil. Since the filter is now suspect, the installer will install a second filter. Sometimes this solves the problem because the trapped air
was released when the first filter was removed. Of course, the installer’s suspicion that the oil filter was at fault has increased."


But, let's be honest here, I didn't cut open any filters with a dremel tool out back in the shed, so "don't take my word as gospel".

 

[JINMA224XR]

<font color="blue"> I think a lot of the anti-Fram rhetoric is just that. As the creator of the posted oil filter rating website says, don't take his word for gospel. Taking engineering advice from someone who cuts open oil filters at home probably isn't wise.

Personally, I've used Fram filters for over twenty years. The only reason I wasn't able to get 150,000 miles on a vehicle was because I sold them. One car I had rang up 255,000 miles before I sold it to a neighbor, who drove it for a while then sold it to yet another person. </font>

Hey TruChaos,

I am so glad to hear from the one's that have gotten good service from Fram Oil Filters, as I used Frams for the first 50K miles in my Nissan, before I did some investigation of my own into the Fram's Ability to filter Oil.

I thought that I was in oil filter bliss, while I was consistently using Fram Oil Filters. Then Fram came out with the Double gaurd Filter and I thought that I was in Oil Filter Heaven. Then Fram came out with the Teflon Oil Filter that put Teflon into the oil System. I started asking questions and everybody that knew anything about engines, said that Teflon in the Oil is not good for the Engine. I couldn't understand, why Fram would put something into Oil that wasn't good for the engine. So I investigated even further, and my Nissan Parts Manager, told me that Nissan put out a bulletin a few years ago, warning customers not to use Fram Oil Filters. Then I investigated further and found that the actual filtering capacity of Fram oil Filters was at best around 40 microns and at worst about 80 microns, depending on the quality of filter that you decided to use.

The AC Delco filters have a micron rating of about 10 to 20 microns and so do the Wix, if I remember correctly as well as a couple of others that I looked at. My Nissan OEM Oil Filter has a 20 micron rating, and my Kawasaki OEM Oil Filter also has a 20 micron rating.

On the Motorbike, I remember the Oil Light coming on numerous times, indicating that there was not suficient oil pressure, while I was using a Fram Oil Filter. When I went back to using the Kawasaki OEM oil filters, that never occurred again. I'm almost possitive that the Fram Oil Filter was not retaining the oil in the filter and therefore, I was getting a lot of dry startups and and even on extreme hard breaking, the oil filter was not retaining the oil in the filter.

We could argue about this, until the Cows Decide to Come Back Home, and I hope that you continue to have good luck with Fram Filters, but I for one will only use Strictly OEM Oil Filters from now on, unless of course, I cannot get them or if someone proves to me that the OEM oil filters are indeed inferior. I tried to save some money with the crossover filters and trying to learn from my error, prefer now, to let the manufacturer be in error and not me. Oil Filtering capacity, Anti-DrainBack, and The Proper Oil Back Pressure are 3 things that I will from now on, leave those jobs to the Engine Manufacturer.

Again, I wish You & All, The Best of Luck, using the Fram Oil Filters.

Get your tractors Running &
Have a nice day,
Joe /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[greg_g]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I think a lot of the anti-Fram rhetoric is just that. )</font>

I can't speak for Fram fleet products, but what I see Fram selling around here are four different "grades" of oil filter (ExtraGuard/ToughGuard/ExtendedGuard/DoubleGuard) for one single application. It's marketing hype, when they're in fact merely competing against themselves; four differently priced Fram oil filters for the very same vehicle - sitting literally side by side on the store shelf.

If they were more readily available, I might consider their FLEET products, but I just can't bring myself to trust a consumer-grade product that's marketed on a Good-Better-Best concept. When it comes to protecting MY investment, there's no hesitation; I buy the best.

//greg//

 

[TruChaos]

I agree the issue could be argued endlessly. Actually, I hope I'm not arguing but simply trying to convey my experiences. What we all need is an honest to goodness engineering study done on engine oils and filters which is digestible by the general public. I'd like to see a group like SAE tackle this.

Your point about the Nissan's is interesting since I've owned them since they were Datsun. I bought by first one in 1979 and was sold on them from that point on. The vehicle I mentioned that I got 255,000 miles on was a Datsun 310 which I sold in the mid 1990's. It's the only vehicle I've ever seen where I could change the clutch in 30 minutes with a wrench and a screwdriver.

I also bought a Jeep Wrangler in 1989 and have used nothing but Fram filters on it. I still own the Wrangler. I recently bought a Ford F-150 but I won't be using Fram filters on it since the dealer gave me free oil changes for life (every 4K).

Truthfully, the antidotal comments we are posting are pretty much without merit unless they can be backed with real research data.

Anyone have pull with the SAE? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif