"Old world craftsmanship" How NOT to pour footings

Builder · Jun 25, 2007

Check out this garbage I have to under-pin for my customer. These guys must have been drunk when they dug/poured these footings. Their garage/house was built ~30 years ago. Obviously, no inspections were required back then or this never would have passed.

This is the front right corner of a garage I have to extend out 8' Look how the existing front corner of the footing is "undershot" by a few inches. Then as you go towards the back of the garage, it's overshot in the opposite direction. I get mad when I'm off by a couple inches over 24 feet. These clowns were off by 2 FEET in 24 feet of trench.

Notice how the footings are far too shallow? Not even close to below frost line (36") that's why the front corner block has cracked joints. Now I gotta fix this mess.

Here's a shot of the back-even worse than the front. Block is cracked, footing is waaaay off center, footing is far too shallow:

I started the underpinning process in the back, but stopped to keep the whole side of the garage from collapsing. Notice the 3 #5 bars already heading under the bad footing.

This "surprise" will probably cost my customer quite a bit of $$$ to fix.

tile · Jun 25, 2007

Wow thats a job there fixing that mess.
Good luck and post a few pics after the job is done would like to see them.

Ron.

thatguy · Jun 25, 2007

I think they call that "job security" in a lot of areas.. LOL

brian

Builder · Jun 25, 2007

The sad part is my Customer's dad built the house for him back in the mid-70's.

Gotta be careful what I say about "dad's" construction quality (or lack thereof)

john_bud · Jun 25, 2007

Builder said:
The sad part is my Customer's dad built the house for him back in the mid-70's.

Gotta be careful what I say about "dad's" construction quality (or lack thereof)

Better get some "tongue band-aides" for the bite damage!

jb

Nat · Jun 26, 2007

I don't want to start an arguement but it may suprize you to see some of your work in 30 years. Things change all the time and construction practices are one thing that changes a lot. I remember the first shop I built, I layed 4 " solid blocks in a trench I dug by hand and laid 3 courses of 4 " block for a foundation then framed it up with rough cut 2x4s. I was at that house a couple years ago and it was still there and I was amazed at how I had done it. Here in NC the code will let you be off on the footing no more than 1", and I expect that the foundation on that job wasn't off more than 2 or 3".
I wish you luck with the repairs. Later, Nat

Builder · Jun 26, 2007

Nat said:
I don't want to start an arguement but it may suprize you to see some of your work in 30 years. Things change all the time and construction practices are one thing that changes a lot. I remember the first shop I built, I layed 4 " solid blocks in a trench I dug by hand and laid 3 courses of 4 " block for a foundation then framed it up with rough cut 2x4s. I was at that house a couple years ago and it was still there and I was amazed at how I had done it. Here in NC the code will let you be off on the footing no more than 1", and I expect that the foundation on that job wasn't off more than 2 or 3".
I wish you luck with the repairs. Later, Nat

You have to understand that the footings themselves are only ~16" deep. There supposed to be 36" deep. That's 20" off code. The block is overhanging the footings on the front by 2-3" on the back by 2-3". That's a lot more than 1". The footings are the minimum 8" thickness with NO rebar. That does pass the minimum code, but no effort was put into squaring the trenches, or making them straight. The inside garage floor is severely cracked from frost heave because there's NO, I repeat, NO front wall under the garage slab!! Nice, huh?

It's one thing to just barely meet minimum code, but he failed to do that in several categories.

Poor workmanship.

dtd24 · Jun 27, 2007

I love it when people say "They don't built houses like they used to!!"

Thank goodness! We would all have problems like that!! I've seen some very strange things in my short time. That is the problem with renovation projects, not only do you need every tool you own to complete the project, but you end up rebuilding the existing in areas you didn't plan to touch.

Dargo · Jun 27, 2007

I've always considered "code" as the bare minimum. I don't think I have anything that is built to code. Since I plan to stay at my residence until they plant me, everything is well past code. I wouldn't consider building on a footer where any portion of the block would even be to the edge, let alone over the edge. Heck, I poured 24" wide by 14" thick footings with 4 runs of rebar just for the outer edge of the wrap around country porch I have on my house. I'd assume that "builder" has the same thought I do about the foundation of a building; if the foundation is crap, it doesn't matter what you build on the foundation, it will not last. I'd think two of the hardest building errors/omissions that would be the most difficult to fix would be faulty foundations and trying to add a basement to an existing house.

Builder · Jun 27, 2007

Dargo said:
I've always considered "code" as the bare minimum. I don't think I have anything that is built to code. Since I plan to stay at my residence until they plant me, everything is well past code. I wouldn't consider building on a footer where any portion of the block would even be to the edge, let alone over the edge. Heck, I poured 24" wide by 14" thick footings with 4 runs of rebar just for the outer edge of the wrap around country porch I have on my house. I'd assume that "builder" has the same thought I do about the foundation of a building; if the foundation is crap, it doesn't matter what you build on the foundation, it will not last. I'd think two of the hardest building errors/omissions that would be the most difficult to fix would be faulty foundations and trying to add a basement to an existing house.

That's right. You can never recover fully from a bad foundation, just like you see in those garbage garage footings.

It really pays to build the foundation beyond the minimum code requirements. I always try to do just that. Footings are only required to be 8" thick. I pour minimum 12". Rebar isn't required, but I use it. #4 bar is all that's called for, I use #5.

All just in case.....