This, that, and the other

[patrick_g]

Harv, If great minds work alike, how come I think like you? Your little bites (mordida in español), is definitely a good thing. In some of my college work, divide and conquer was the catch phrase used to describe the same concept. If a task seemed too large and complex for a simple enough solution then you needed to divide it into its component parts and those parts into smaller parts until the complexity/difficulty was reduced to a level you could deal with.

One of my best attempts at applying YOUR method of little bites was in designing a way for a single person (or small crew of two or so) to pour and finish a large (2500 sq ft, or any size really) concrete slab. (method available on request) The rebar mat is continuous throughout the entire slab. There are ample control joints to mostly prevent uncontrolled cracking.

Note: Due to limitations of a small crew, maybe one guy, you just can't practically use truck delivery of premixed concrete but instead you use a portable mixer (even I don't like mixing it manually with a hoe or rake.)

To use "THE HARV METHOD" (AKA Little Bites) you don't have to be able to lift 1000 lbs but you do have to be willing to lift a single pound, a thousand times.

Pat

[weldingisfun]

Originally Posted by patrick_g

Harv, If great minds work alike, how come I think like you? Your little bites (mordida in español), is definitely a good thing. In some of my college work, divide and conquer was the catch phrase used to describe the same concept. If a task seemed too large and complex for a simple enough solution then you needed to divide it into its component parts and those parts into smaller parts until the complexity/difficulty was reduced to a level you could deal with.

One of my best attempts at applying YOUR method of little bites was in designing a way for a single person (or small crew of two or so) to pour and finish a large (2500 sq ft, or any size really) concrete slab. (method available on request) The rebar mat is continuous throughout the entire slab. There are ample control joints to mostly prevent uncontrolled cracking.

Note: Due to limitations of a small crew, maybe one guy, you just can't practically use truck delivery of premixed concrete but instead you use a portable mixer (even I don't like mixing it manually with a hoe or rake.)

To use "THE HARV METHOD" (AKA Little Bites) you don't have to be able to lift 1000 lbs but you do have to be willing to lift a single pound, a thousand times.

Pat

That is good. I like that and will use it again myself. Thanks.

[Bird]

After you divide the work up into small bites, I know in some cases, those small bites have to be done in a particular order, but on some jobs (or multiple jobs) you can decide for yourself which to do first. So how do you decide.

Personally, I always liked to do the worst jobs first, so wherever I was in the process, I could always figure the worst is behind me. But I remember when I just a kid that my Dad said he liked to start with the easiest job, so he could always figure he was doing the easiest job available.

[rox]

Patrick,
To use "THE HARV METHOD" (AKA Little Bites) you don't have to be able to lift 1000 lbs but you do have to be willing to lift a single pound, a thousand times.Me too I like the way you worded this and this is literally how we farm.
There is lots of equipment ww will buy one day but for the moment is is one pound a thousand times.

harv,
I am so honored that your daughter recognized that the food tasted better by using our oil and that perhaps we ahve some new customers. We really do appreciate every single bottle of olive oil sold.

Bird,
I'm with you I always do the hardest job first I cna't stand to have it hanging over my head.

All- After Harv's encouragement I got my mojo going and I have been hard at work ripping the sucker branches off the feet of the trees. I guess by wrting it down that I thought I was perhaps slowing down it motivated me to get going and get moving. When you are self employed and are not serving any customers on any jobs then your schedule is mostly your own. It is kind of easy to fall into procrastination. Thankfully between my husband and myself we prod each other if one of us starts slacking. I am determined not to slow down and blame it on being 4 years older. Since I first wrote I have been working everyday at a good clip and it sure feels good. I relaly value this TBN community, well except for one member and I won't name names but Bird prolly knows.

[patrick_g]

Originally Posted by Bird

After you divide the work up into small bites, I know in some cases, those small bites have to be done in a particular order, but on some jobs (or multiple jobs) you can decide for yourself which to do first. So how do you decide.

Personally, I always liked to do the worst jobs first, so wherever I was in the process, I could always figure the worst is behind me. But I remember when I just a kid that my Dad said he liked to start with the easiest job, so he could always figure he was doing the easiest job available.

After sub dividing a large or complex task into sub tasks and maybe some of those sub tasks into sub sub tasks (lather-rinse-repeat as needed) you may find some tasks are independent and can be done at any time while others have a rigid sequence . For example: you don't install the shingles before you build the roof but you can build the fence around the house any time.

Decomposition or successive decomposition is the professional term for breaking a task into its component parts. With experience you learn how far to go in the decomposition of tasks into ever smaller tasks. Once a task is decomposed into small enough pieces that you and or your compadres can wrap their minds around it then don't simplify any further. For example: lunch break shouldn't have to be broken down into simpler pieces for anyone.

A very important part of this systematic approach is to know what the required inputs are to a process and what the output(s) is(are) you get out. This relates directly to Bird's question of how do you decide. If a process requires say three inputs... You need electricity to the job site area of this sub task, you need water to this location too, and you need one particular non load bearing stud wall framed up to accept the installation of some thingy. So before you uncrate the thingy and try to install it you first have to have electricity and water and the stud wall.

Experienced contractors sort of employ this process casually and informally to build a simple house or whatever. Architects, engineers, and tradesmen erecting a sky scraper tend to get a bit more formal with their plans and have detailed written descriptions of the broken down tasks.

Not everyone can intuit the flow of work in a complex job, especially if it requires coordinating the efforts of various groups of workers or even applying your own labor in the proper sequence of events. I find that I NEED to think about a larger or more complex job in these terms when the consequences of "messing up" are not trivial.

I am currently in the process of moving a 35x70 foot metal bld with 18 foot side walls and 14x14 foot roll up doors at opposite ends. I am moving it about 1/4 of a mile across one of my fields to a more convenient location. One of the early sub tasks was to empty the bld. But... what do you do with the contents in the mean time? So a precursor task to emptying the building was to build some 4x4x8 ft boxes to store stuff. I also emptied out 2 each 20 ft steel shipping containers, dragged them out of the bld and refilled them with stuff.

I also had a pad constructed to accept the bld. Now I need to have piers dug by my driller who can do 16 inch piers up to 24 ft deep. I need to fabricate weld plates to set in the concrete of the cast piers. I need to build "boots" to raise the pipe columns of the bld to make up for the fact that I will not be pouring a floor or a foundation or stem wall. The current situation has a ledge in the poured floor to accomodate a few inches of overlap of the metal siding. If I just sit the cut off columns on the weld plates I will crush a few inches of the bottom of the siding all the way around the building. So I will make "boots" out of the next larger size pipe to raise the building 6-8 inches. I will then be able to see "daylight" all around the building. I can use pressure treated wood set into the soil an inch or two and be screwed to the metal siding. Thus no earth metal contact, just wood to dirt and metal to wood.

This is my first building move of this sort so I had to break it down into bites I could easily understand and chew one at a time from start to finish to be sure everything was going to flow smoothly. Now it is raining and I can't get the driller on site. If it rains enough with insufficient time to dry between rains I may be "rained out" and the next window of opportunity will be after the ground freezes enough to take the load (if the winter is cold enough.)

Anyone have a discount ticket for a heavy lift helicopter?

Oh by the way there are lots of different pieces of competing software that simplifies decomposing a job into tasks and subtasks and tracks the input requirements and outputs. If estimated times to do the various tasks are input then the software will help you estimate several things rather well, including: the "critical path", lay times, total time to complete and such.

These software applications typically support PERT charts, a powerful management tool. For info, Google on PERT chart.

Pat

[Bird]

Pat, I see at the very end of your post, you got to the "PERT" chart, but way back up in the middle, I was expecting to see mention of a "FLOW" chart.

[patrick_g]

Originally Posted by Bird

Pat, I see at the very end of your post, you got to the "PERT" chart, but way back up in the middle, I was expecting to see mention of a "FLOW" chart.

Bird, A PERT chart IS a flow chart. There are several kinds of flow charts and the PERT is one of them.

They are all tools and as in other disciplines you need to know what tools to use to best accomplish a task. The best tool in the world can be useless when brought to bear on the wrong sort of problem.

A simple flow chart will not provide the information you can get with a PERT chart. Some jobs are not complicated enough to warrant the overhead of a PERT chart but many are.

Pat

[Bird]

A PERT chart IS a flow chart

Yep, but before I was halfway through reading that post, I was expecting to see "flow chart" and just wasn't thinking of the PERT chart until I got near the end.

I had a little experience with them when I was the department's project manager when we built an entirely new combined police & fire communications center in a new City Hall, and then later was the department's project manager when we built a complete new police auto pound on undeveloped land; storage facility, auction facility, office building, parking lot, etc.

[Egon]

Contact for a lifting helicopter.

Monino museum highlights


some places they are called critical path schedules.

[patrick_g]

Bird, Why am I not surprised that you were a chart using project manager...

Egon, Thanks anyway for the lead on the chopper but you sent that site's URL to me before. I still have reservations regarding their current air worthiness certs.

CPM (Critical Path Management) is a common tool.

At times I was so immersed in such that I would dream in charts! When I taught evening courses in software engineering to university seniors I also took on their senior projects classes that were three each 5 quarter hour courses in a row. A couple times the team projects (5 person teams) were to develop a computer based tool for project management along the lines of CPM. (Not to be confused with CP/M (Control Program for Microcomputers, an operating system originally created for Intel 8080/85 based microcomputers.)

Pat