My Pond Project

[ETD66SS]

Some updated pictures:

whitedwarf3's photos. Get free image hosting at ImageCave.com - free image hosting at ImageCave.com

[EddieWalker]

The pond looks great, and those piers for the bridge are very nice. From the pics, it looks like metal square tubing. Is that right? What are you going to do to protect the metal?

I'm looking forward to the rest of the bridge build. The ends should be real interesting. I've been working on a plan for a smaller version over my overflow, so it will be nice to see what you come up with.

Thanks,
Eddie

[ETD66SS]

Originally Posted by EddieWalker

The pond looks great, and those piers for the bridge are very nice. From the pics, it looks like metal square tubing. Is that right? What are you going to do to protect the metal?

I'm looking forward to the rest of the bridge build. The ends should be real interesting. I've been working on a plan for a smaller version over my overflow, so it will be nice to see what you come up with.

Thanks,
Eddie

The steel is actually 3" wide x 5" tall I-Beam.

This picture shows that the vertical steel has been fully encased in concrete:

http://usera.imagecave.com/whitedwar...s_concrete.jpg

The lower cross beam was welded in place, that was just covered with dirt. The second cross beam was bolted in place and then that bolted connection was encased in concrete.

The second vertical cross member will be under water, so it should no oxidize too fast. I'm sure it will be there for at least 100 years.

The bridge will just basically be a 50 ft long x 6 ft wide dock, with ramps on either end.

[ETD66SS]

Latest Pictures

[streamin]

I bookmarked your thread last year and just now getting back to it. You have a really nice project here. I wanted to do one very similar with the island in the middle, interesting on all the input but I'm with you on the island. I have some property in Franklinville, NY but not sure if the soil would be the same.I have hills also so I would need to build a burm.I want to go 20 feet.
Some questions: I think I saw the final acreage at 1.5? I want about 2 acres, do you think bigger would be easier to do a steeper slope? Why couldn't you make it steeper the the escavator? How long did it take you?
I don't have the equipment besides my tractor so I thought I would hire the digging out.Did you look into that and what prices would you think could be reasonable? Thanks.

[EddieWalker]

Originally Posted by ETD66SS

Latest Pictures

Missed it when you posted the link to the pictures.

What do you do with your equipment in the winter? One of the pictures shows a small truck that's covered in snow. Do you just leave them sit until spring?

Did you finish? What about the bridge? I'm really looking forward to see pics of it.

Eddie

[germ-X]

looks like its coming along nicely. cant wait to see it finished. good luck man.

[ETD66SS]

-Streamin

I work with a guy here who has a pond in Lynden NY, and he has had major problems keeping water in it. Not enough clay in his area. But that does not mean your property is the same...

I wanted to go 20 feet as well, but hit glacial till at ~12 feet. and it slowed my digging process down quite a bit, so only went into that 2-3 ft because it was costing me a fortune in fuel.

Yes, the total water surface area when full will be 1.5 acres. That is both ponds combined. The one with the island is just over 1 acre.

Digging a steep slope with the excavator was not a problem. Spreading the clay on a steep slope with my bulldozer was. The sandy loam is such loose dirt, any steeper an angle and the dozer would spin it's tracks and not climb the bank. I almost lost the dozer in the water one time because of this. That scared me enough to abandoned the 3:1 slope and go to 3.5:1 or 4:1 in some areas.

As far as how long it took me? Well, I have owned the property for 5 years now, and the pond digging took me 3 years. First year all I had was the dozer, that didn't work out due to the soft clay when I got deeper. The next year I bought the excavator, finished digging the small pond, and 1/2 the large one. Summer 2008 I finished digging the large pond, and spreading the clay on the banks of both ponds. There is still a chance the clay lining will not hold water properly as I could not get a sheepsfoot roller on it to pack it in, so I'm crossing my fingers. Due to a combination of only packing it with the dozer tracks, and heavy rain, some of the clay lining sunk into the pond, in 2 areas, so might have to fix that this summer.

As far as cost. Well, I have $80,000 tied up into my Backhoe, Dozer, Excavator & Dump Truck. I'd say in the last 5 years I have spent another $5000-$6000 on maintenance & repair. And the Diesel fuel bill for the property since starting the ponds is $12,000.

However, those prices also include using the equipment to log 10 acres of large trees, and putting in 400 ft of my driveway, amongst many other tasks. I sold about $8000 worth of firewood to help offset fuel costs.

As far as hours spent moving earth, I would have to guess about 9 weeks worth of vacation time digging dumping, piling & pushing dirt. At about 10 hours per day on average. So lets say 600 man hours. Most of the time I had my dad helping, but honestly, I would have to wait for him to get back with the dump truck to continue digging with the excavator, I really needed 2 dump trucks & drivers. If I had hired an experienced crew, I'm sure they could have had it done in 2 weeks, maybe 4 guys. An excavator, dozer and 2 dump trucks. So roughly 200 man hours. Basically 1/3 the time due to their efficiency. All in all, to pay for the pond to get done, it would have cost me roughly $20,000. However, understand I would have had to pay for 10 acres of land to be cleared & logged first. The forest is worthless to loggers, I had a forester come in and look, so getting a logging crew in and making money off the trees was not an option.

I know my bother asked about getting a 1 acre pond excavated, and the cost was $6000 for fuel alone, plus the labor. Excavated ponds on a flat lot are the most costly... And that was like 4 years ago, before fuel prices went crazy.

I did not buy the equipment just for the ponds. And if I had to pay crews to do all the work I have done in the last 5 years... Well, I would have never been able to afford that.

I estimate I have logged 2000 trees. At least 500 stumps that weigh in excess of 10,000 lbs, some of them 20,000 lbs +. I have tons of silver maple trees, and they have huge root balls that won't let the dirt go...

-Eddie

All the equipment stays outside in the weather. Nothing else I can do at this point in time. The plan is to build my carriage house this summer, and then a 40 x 60 barn the following year. Then I will finally have a place to work on this equipment. That "small truck" is a Ford F8000 tandem dump truck.

As far as the bridge, I did not finish. Most likely, I will just span the pillars with 4 steel I-beams, and cover them up with treated wood to make it look mainly just like a dock.

[streamin]

thanks for the great response.It gives me more insite to what I'm up against.Would you mind if I came by this summer to see your ponds?

[EddieWalker]

Great breakdown of your expenses in building your pond and working your land. It's always shocking to see how much money it costs to do these things yourself!!!! I have a stack of reciepts that I'm curious to add up, but also afraid to because I really don't want to know. LOL I spend just about everything I make on my land and my equipment. I know it's allot of money, but if I had to hire it out, I could never afford any of it without going very deaply into debt.

One thing that keeps me sane is looking forward to the day that I sell most of my equipment and go into a maintenance mode. Then if I need something done, I'll rent a new machine to get it done and be done with it. These multi year long projects are only affordable when buying used equipment, but it does take a physical and emotional drain on you. At least it does with me.

I've also noticed that with one truck and one tractor to load it, that there's not allot of time savings with two people working. I'm loading my 5 yard single axle dump truck with my backhoe. It's a smaller scale they what you are doing, but probably a similar job. I can load the dump truck, get off the bakhoe and go dump the dump truck fairly quickly. When my dad is here, he'll drive the dump truck while I load it, and we do get more dirt moved, but not enough to justify what it would cost to pay somebody to do this. Dad works for free, so it's a no brainer. If I had two dump trucks, then it would make allot of sense to have two drivers to eliminate the down time while the truck is dumping it's load. Of course, that's just another expense that I don't have the money for, but something that I day dream about while waiting for the dump truck to come back for another load. Waiting for dry conditions is a much bigger issue anyway.

I'm looking forward to seeing your bridge. I've been planning one across my spillway for a few years now. It's not a priority, so I can't say for sure when I'll get to it, but it's something that I'm looking forward to building. The railing is where I'm hoping to be creative and make something interesting. At least, that's my plan.

Eddie