A(nother) Home in the (different) Woods

[dstig1]

Aaron, yeah I got the internet service set up early so I could get cameras going. It appears I have a couple overly nosey neighbors (and one that tried to cause trouble). I'm still working on getting the cameras set up, but am close.

 

[955Lincoln]

Aaron, yeah I got the internet service set up early so I could get cameras going. It appears I have a couple overly nosey neighbors (and one that tried to cause trouble). I'm still working on getting the cameras set up, but am close.

What is it about neighbors. I thought I was moving to the middle of nowhere and ended up with the most miserable SOB's you could imagine. Did you mention the problems in this thread? Tell us more....I love hearing these stories.

 

[955Lincoln]

Wisconsin requires a switch box if you feed a service from another building. Seems redundant to me, but OK. But then the inspector said I had to run the house as a subpanel from this, which I was very NOT OK with. This is a main service, and should be run as such. NEC says nothing about this that I could find, but I ran an extra ground to appease him. I think it is the wrong way to do it (and have questioned his judgement at many points), so I still think he is quite wrong, but I did it rather than fighting it. So here is the switch box for the house that sits on the shop. All utilities come to the shop first and are metered from there.

Ouch!!! Were you able to get the ground through the conduit ok?? I'm afraid the inspector is correct but only because of the stupid way that the code is written. If he had any common sense he should have allowed it. If the service came into the house first then you could have gone with your original plan but not the other way around because the garage isn't considered a "dwelling". Yeah, really stupid. :confused2:

If the code was written properly the easiest way is to install a 400 amp meter with double lugs on the load side and continue the 3-wire service to your house. But once a disconnect is installed then you have to go with a 4-wire subpanel.

edit: Oh.....also you can't have any other metal running between the buildings with a 3-wire service extension which is the only part that makes any sense to me.

 

[dstig1]

But once a disconnect is installed then you have to go with a 4-wire subpanel.

I could not find that anywhere. Can you point me to a section? Given that it is fed directly from the meter, with nothing more than a simple disconnect, I don;t see how it could be required, but there are lots of silly things in the code... We pulled a ground at the same time as the main power wire.

As for the neighbors, apparently one of them called the township and said I was violating setbacks, so they called the inspector who called me. That is NOT a call you want to get. I was quite sure I was fine, but had to race out there in a panic to double check. Set back is 50' and my closest point was 57'+ so I was quite fine. But I was pissed that a nosy busybody obviously came up there when I wasn't around and then tried to make trouble over nothing.

I'll try to get another update or two out tonight.

 

[dstig1]

More concrete

I had one more bit of concrete to pour. There was an 8x24' deck that was over the garage and needed a slab poured on it as the final surface, at least for the time being. I asked the main concrete outfit about it, and they said it was less risky as it was not on grade, and was insulated, so they could make it happen. That was great...until they gave me a quote. For this little slab they wanted over $10/sf! Insane. Not having better options, I scheduled it for the first week of Nov (and risking it getting too cold to really do right). In the mean time I started looking. A guy at work has a FIL that is a semi retired concrete guy. He was pretty much put away for the winter, but was willing to do this as it was reasonably small. So I booked him and cancelled the other guys. And the end result was I got the slab done for ~$800 instead of $2k. And this guy knows what he is doing, so that was good too. Here is a pic of the forms and insulation, and the final slab. It has been covered since then as it got real cold a couple days after the pour. It will probably stay that way until spring. There is a continuous EPDM rubber roofing membrane underneath to waterproof it. It has been great since I got the membrane in. It was pretty bad before that as it is exposed to the predominant wind/storm direction. Between the concrete cap (with a good slope for drainage) and the EPDM membrane, and the insulation board, and the ice dam below that, it should hold out Eventually we will cap it with stone or tile of some sort. Probably slate.

 

[dstig1]

Windows and doors aka "The Great Window Panic of 2013"



A bit of a story here...

So this was one in a lengthy series of mad scrambles. The windows arrived at the lumber yard in Early/Mid Oct. We weren't quite ready and they were fully willing to store them for a bit, so no big deal. The problem I ran into was that my helpers were having other conflicts in Late Oct, so my help pool dried up right when it got critical. Then the other problem was I heard that the windows were ridiculously heavy due to the size and the oak trim. Well no big deal - we have a construction lift rental! Well when my help started to disappear, I asked them to extend then rental period for a week. It was due back Nov 4 early. They said no - it was already rented out. Crap. Well I now the panic started. I needed help, so I asked my framer if any of his guys were looking for extra work. One guy was so I hired him for a weekend. OK that helped and I figured we would be able to get a real good start on it the weekend of Oct 25th. Then it got worse. A few days ahead he said he got access to his new apartment and needed to move that weekend. Then my wife's mother passed away. Not totally out of the blue as she has been on the downside of cancer for a while, but nobody was expecting it then. So that weekend was totally toast, and it made for another crunch - this HAD to get done the next weekend.

The stars aligned a bit and I got help plus my hired help all on board. We started on Thurs (Halloween) and got a lot of the smaller stuff done then with just 2 of us. That was a great start. Then Fri came as there were 3 of us, so the plan was to start on the big windows as they were indeed heavy. We got the first one on the lift and ready to put in when the hired guy says "wait a sec - this ain't right" And he was right - the window was almost a foot short of the width of the rough opening. So we get to measuring and figuring out what is going on and it turns out the units that came pre-mulled were way short of the ROs spec'd by the software. A call to the lumber yard told me that I was hosed, and that he never double checked the ROs. I should have requested the ROs so I could verify them all, but chalk this one up to inexperience. The only saving grace is that it was not the other direction. We were able to frame-in the openings to match and proceed (heights were fine, just widths were off), but it cost us a lot of time that day, and a lot of money as all the openings were already prepped and ready to go. This was one key point that rubbed me the wrong way with the lumber yard as he basically told me "tough noogies". If they don't double check these things or give you the info to do so yourself, why are you paying them a premium? That really frosted me, as they has a full set of plans that included the window specs and ROs. I was beginning to feel like a second class citizen to them, and I guess I was "not in the club" by not being a contractor. After yet another similar issue a few weeks after this, I am done with them. I'm guessing another lumberyard might be better, as I have worked with them before and been happy. These guys were the ones the framers wanted to work with, so I went along. Lesson to the wise, I guess...

But in the end we got it done and all 32 windows and doors got installed that weekend before the lift had to go back. Some were 3 stories up and the mulled units were so heavy that 2 men could not reasonably lift them, so the lift was critical. So after all that venting, here are a couple pics...


















Since this point, the last garage door has been put in, and we got a temp front door, so the house is now fully enclosed and we have been working on the interior framing and such. Hard to show interior framing in pics, and I don't have much, so I may just skip that for now.

So I think that brings me up to current, though I am very unhappy at how cold it is now. That is killing me...



-Dave

 

[Dr Dave]

Looks great, I like the windows you installed. What will you be using to insulate the ceiling?

Dave

 

[TnWV]

Your house looks great. Very unique style(atleast for my area). I have to say, I've never seen a basement floor poured after the interior basement walls were already in place. I imagine that took some extra steps up front to make sure it would work out. With all the other home building threads coming to an end lately, I'm glad you started posting again. I think I was having home building withdraws! Keep up the good work, I look foreword to seeing the rest come together.

 

[955Lincoln]

I could not find that anywhere. Can you point me to a section? Given that it is fed directly from the meter, with nothing more than a simple disconnect, I don;t see how it could be required, but there are lots of silly things in the code... We pulled a ground at the same time as the main power wire.

There is no cut and dry wording that makes it easy but a service turns into a feeder after the first disconnect. I don't know which code cycle you are on but I was looking through 2011 for these references.

There is a flow diagram in 230.1 that may help.
230.70 disconnect
215.6 Feeders
250.32 (b) (1) Grounding and Bonding

Local ammendments aside, if the service was run to your house, and you tapped off of the load side of the meter, and there is no ethernet, phone, cable, or any other metal between buildings, you could have run 3-wire to the garage.

 

[dstig1]

955, Thanks. I never found a good ref either. We're on 2008 still. I used 230.6 to argue my case. There is a nice illustration showing my exact situation called exhibit 230.14. But you are probably right that the disconnect and the over current protection are what makes the break point (the flow diagram you pointed out seems to make it the breakers that actually are the delimiting point). Still annoys the crap out of me. I don't WANT my ground running back through conduit 300+ feet. I want it properly grounded and bonded at the house. That is the best way to deal with it. I don't see anything that indicates running from the house is any different than running from the shop. There will be Ethernet running between the buildings too. I suppose if I had to I could figure out fiber for that, but that would probably be painful.

Oh well...