Trying to build a small barn. Feed back is more than welcome.

[RJohnsonEOD]

It was suggested that I move this post to this forum so off we go.
Pole barn, shed, barn, run in shed. Amazing the amount of information on this website alone about building a place to park the tractor and tiller.
I am building a barn that is 24' deep and 36' wide with four stalls (2ea 10' wide and 2ea 8' wide) with 10' high openings. The openings will run along the long side as if it were a run in shed but the roof will be standard gable with the peak running the 36' length. From the front (north) corner to the far rear (south) corner the land drops about 30"? This is the best spot other than where the house is built and I think my wife would be upset if I wanted to relocate the house. I was going to use 4x6x16 posts on the outside walls and one roughly center (adjusted to not block the stall location) for additional roof support. These will be planted about 24" (bottom 3ft wrapped in tar paper) with gravel in the bottom of the hole and dry concrete poured around the post with the last 6 filled with dirt. The spring rain is here so the concrete should set fine. I want 10' high openings so I will make the opening 11' or 12' from the ground so I can add gravel at the end for a raised floor. Once I have the wall posts in place I will find my floor level and from that level I will then place treated 2x below the line in the dirt to about 4" and work the slope until I am down to the concrete of the far corner post. Place some perforated drain pipe (have left over pieces) along the back wall and run it out the lower end. Fill with dirt just short of the level board and top with 6" to 12" of gravel. The gable rafters will be about 24" apart (probably over kill but if I have to climb up there I really want it to hold my big b). The roof will probably be corrugated metal roof and I have not decided about the walls. Using a framing nail gun for the initial build but will go back and add bolts and screws at the end. It seems like an odd size but it will hold all of my stuff plus room for my sons to work on old cars. One of the 8' stalls will be enclosed for storage of the tiller, chains, small gear and no door on the other stalls. 4x6x16 posts are a pain to locate so I might build my own with 2x. Suggestions?

 

[KennyG]

Just a few thoughts. 24 x 36 there is no point to a center post. You ridge pole doesn't support vertical weight, it only transfers the lateral load from the two opposite walls. I'm surprised you have trouble finding 4x6x16 posts. My local Lowes has them in stock.

 

[dave1949]

I think you could start by using google to research pole building methods. You can find a lot of good info that way.

Some things that jumped out to me, are you using roof trusses? 24' span trusses are very common and I doubt you can stick build any cheaper than buying pre-made trusses. Most pole builders put a concrete disk in the bottom of the pole hole as a footing to bear the building weight. I don't think it is a good idea to put your bottom treated board in the dirt, it should be in gravel.

It will be a lot easier to level your spot before putting the building in the way.

Here is a web site with a blog hosted by a TBN member, polebarnguru:
Pole Barn Kits and Pole Buildings - Hansen Pole Buildings

 

[RJohnsonEOD]

I have 4 lowes and three home depots within 30 minutes of my house and the 4x6 only go to 12". They can order them but it will be a week to three weeks. The 4 lumber companies near here are helpful but expensive. It is cheaper to make them then to buy from the lumber yards. There used to be small sawmills where you could buy "raw" lumber but the economy killed them. THanks for the tip on the center pole. I always over build for some reason.

 

[RJohnsonEOD]

Dave: The bottom boards are to frame the fill. I considered rail road ties. I looked at leveling the area but I thought the mound would have to be pretty good size. I like the concerte disk in the bottom and will work that in. Not sure where to get the trusses locally but I will check. Thanks

 

[schweizer]

If you put a bag of dry concrete on the bottom, you will accomplish the same as a concrete disk but it conforms to the bottom better. The poles eventually rot near the surface, not that deep anyway.

Did you try looking at 6x6's?

 

[quicksandfarmer]

I think you'll come out way ahead to buy a kit with all the pieces and engineered plans. With a building that size there are non-trivial engineering issues to make something where you'll be reasonably certain that it will withstand wind and snow loads. If you live someplace that requires permits or inspections you're going to need an engineer's stamp on your plans anyway. My impression is that the kits end up being very price-competitive with buying the lumber one stick at a time from a lumber yard.

There are probably thousands of companies offering pole barn kits, from big box stores to specialty retailers. Google is your friend.

Once you have all the pieces and plans building it seems like a doable project.

 

[schweizer]

Respectfully, I disagree with quicksandfarmer. If you follow some decent plans, you don't need to buy a kit. Much of the engineering can just be looked up on load tables (online, books, or lumber yard). As long as you're using regular framing, or pole construction on accepted intervals (8', 10', 12'), hurricane ties on the roof, etc., it should be fine. I don't know where you live, but in many rural areas you don't need a permit for a barn, especially for agriculture.

Maybe you're interested in something like this. (See attached pics) I just found this while looking through some of my books from when I was planning our barn last year.

Marcus

 

[RJohnsonEOD]

Thanks for the feedback. I looked at the kits both metal and wood but I have built small garden sheds before 8X10, 10X10 and wanted to try my hand at this from stick and plans. After over 20yrs in the Army I am now chained to my desk (my job is all about desk/computer work) so I spend all my time at home out side regardless of the weather so this project is as much about the mission as it is about needing a barn. If the kits would save me a few thousand dollars I would go that route but the difference is not as much. As for the permits the county is kind of fuzzy. I don't think this will meet the cost limits that require a permit but since it is so small (most of the barns out my way are three time the size of my house) with no windows, no power, no water, no sewer, gravel floor, and it will not be used as living or meeting space they really are not concerned. Houses in our county are popping up everyday in our county pluse people are still rebuilding from all the tornados. The county people are very helpful but My little project is not worth their time but they did give me some tips on on construction as many were building contractors themselves. We are getting alot of rain right now but come july/aug it is so dry the dirt pulls away from the fence posts so much that you can almost pull them out of the ground by hand. I put several 6" fence posts in without concrete but ended up going back and resetting them in crete because they were so loose in the summer. Thanks again for your tips

 

[RJohnsonEOD]

Found a local (30min away) lumber store that was recommended by a local farmer. Old fashioned kind of place and extremely helpful. Even their engineer got in on the conversation. 6x6x16 posts in the ground now. Only got them down to about 36" as that was as far as I could get with the auger and post hole digger. 1/2 bag of dry concrete in the bottom and at least 2.5 bags around each. Having the trusses made. I cannot buy them for that price. Have to pick up some more 2x12 and 2x10 today. I got a little behind in the project. Got twisted up unloading the lumber and then the weather rolled in. Beautiful weekend coming so I want to at least finish the frame work to try and keep the posts from cork-screwing too bad. Do the final measurement for the trusses and place the order. Have to find a good place for the roof. Tin or composit really depends on the cost. I am not living in it but I want it to last a few years. Not sure how I will finish out the walls yet. Old barn lumber is grabbed up quick so I will check back with the lumber company for a suggestion.