Well pump pipe and electrical wire in the same 4" PVC pipe?

[rogerius]

Hello,

Hope the sign of winter will be gone in a couple of weeks so I can continue the adventure in building our home. The question which I have is about how to protect the well pump pipe and the electrical wires at the bottom of the trench. The trunch needs to be 4ft deep so I'm planing to use 4" PVC pipe to protect both, the 1.25" poly line and all the electrical wires. I choose the 4" PVC pipe because I've got some left over from the house sewr system. Is this a good plan? Any other idea?

Thank you.

 

[RNeumann]

Not a good plan. Use the standard conduit designed for electrical wire. It will be a separate pipe from the water line and should actually be 1’ away from the waterline- same trench is ok. Your plan doesn’t meet code, is dangerous and would be a disaster if a repair is ever needed.

 

[RickB]

I agree this is not a good plan and not to code.

 

[rogerius]

Not a good plan. Use the standard conduit designed for electrical wire. It will be a separate pipe from the water line and should actually be 1’ away from the waterline- same trench is ok. Your plan doesn’t meet code, is dangerous and would be a disaster if a repair is ever needed.

I was thinking to keep it separately but I asked myself; why in the actual vertical well is accepted and in the trench will not? Inside the well, the wires are in direct contact with water no? I'm using the same wires type in the trench.

 

[Lineman North Florida]

If I understand what you are saying you would be putting electric wires in sewer conduit not gray electrical conduit which could be disastrous for someone in the future, several accidents in past were plumbers were electrocuted cutting white pipe that was supposed to be water, if I misunderstood please disregard. Charlie.

 

[Mendonsy]

Another issue in addition to the code violation is that the poly pipe will move when the pressure changes. That movement will eventually wear through the insulation on your wires and cause a short circuit or ground fault.

 

[RNeumann]

I was thinking to keep it separately but I asked myself; why in the actual vertical well is accepted and in the trench will not? Inside the well, the wires are in direct contact with water no? I'm using the same wires type in the trench.

In the well the electrical is typically taped to the pipe or a little plastic holder is used. In this environment the wire is only touching air or water.

Underground, to be blunt, shot (with an “I”) happens! Rubbing, rocks animals, shovels, tractors, settling etc can all damage pipe and wire. With that it’s required things be separated and and installed in the correct pipe/conduit. That way, in the future, when digging, folks will know what is where. Plus if things are separated it will be easy to dig around something and repair it.

Probably should watch a few well install videos on YouTube. The pitless (for the water) comes in the side below the frost line. The wires come in the top above grade. From above grade the wires heads back below grade and to the power source.
Pro tip- since the trench is 4’ deep put the water line at 4’ and then backfill to 2’ and put the electrical line. This will get your separation and meet code. Add a conduit slip fitting above grade to account for any movement/settling. Typically the well pump installer will put the pump and pitless in and hook up the water line if it’s there. The wires will be left long but sticking out the top. You or your electrician would take it from there.

 

[EddieWalker]

Another issue in addition to the code violation is that the poly pipe will move when the pressure changes. That movement will eventually wear through the insulation on your wires and cause a short circuit or ground fault.

This was the biggest reason that I wouldn't do that. Your pipe is going to move, and with all that space inside of a four inch pipe, it's going to move A LOT!!!! There is no question that the movement will lead to failure, it's just how long until it happens?

Then you run into the issue everyone else is mentioning. Fixing a broken pipe inside of a larger pipe, probably full of water, with electical wires that where probably also damaged by the moving water line inside the pipe.

There just isn't any upside to doing this.

 

[Oldoak]

.....................................................
Underground, to be blunt, shot (with an çš„? happens! Rubbing, rocks animals, shovels, tractors, settling etc can all damage pipe and wire. With that itç—´ required things be separated and and installed in the correct pipe/conduit. That way, in the future, when digging, folks will know what is where.................

I take it you have never heard of direct burial cable for 200 amp service from the utility poles to buildings. A 175 length of direct burial cable was utilized for 40+ years at my rural residence without incidence. No conduit required.

How did we all survive for so long without all the governmental regulations and codes in today's world? :confused3:

 

[RNeumann]

Not sure the point of that. OP wants to go above and beyond (my impression) with the install and is wondering how. Direct bury cable is an option.....it doesn’t excuse the code requirements with regards to distance from other utilities underground. Direct bury requires conduit above grade.

Bottom line- if someone wanted to meet code and install the cheapest, most short sided underground electrical possible- Direct bury cable is an option.