Need help to save this old barn!

[MikeB44]

Howdy. We recently purchased an old farm that had not been used for farming in 15-20 years and we have cleared some land for fences (goats/horses) and a house for my parents. On this farm we have an old barn that could use a bit of restoration.

The barn measures (if I remember the dimensions correctly) 30’ deep by 40’ wide. It is divided into 3 sections with two outer bays being roughly 12’ wide, and the center section being 16’ wide. It is about 25’ tall at the peak and at the eaves it is 15’ and 17’ tall.

The center section is the oldest and in the best shape. It is made from square cut lumber and the posts are notched. It is braced and cross braced, and appears in fairly solid shape, save for a few posts that are rotted or with insect damage.

The outer bays are in the worst shape with the majority of the outer posts cut from trees which are now rotting away. The outer sections are braced against the center section and nailed into the outside tree posts (which are notched) and then nailed into ~2x12(10?) which in turn appears to be nailed to the outside wall & posts of the center section.

The barn has survived numerous strong storms, one of which recently produced 80 mph winds in our area. I would like to save/restore the barn and put it back to use as an animal shelter/hay storage building. Any ideas/suggestions/links on how to do so would be most appreciated. (I have access to old utility poles, I just need to get them hauled to the site.)

The picture of the barn front shows a Kubota L3010 peeking out of one of the bays. It was through advice on these forums that I was able to recently purchase that machine and I have been very happy with it (many thanks!). I now hope y’all can help me save this barn!

Thanks,

Mike

 

[daTeacha]

What you have there is a "Witches Hat" style barn. The beams you showed are sawn, not hand hewed, so it isn't as old as many around here. The main problems of rot are from someone not keeping the water/manure etc. off the wood and choosing the wrong species of wood in the first place.

Step one would be to put up some tarps to protect what you have from getting any more weather exposure.

Step two is brace and reinforce the parts you think you can save

Take off those parts you figure are too far gone to work with, like the bad sections of siding.

Find a small local sawmill if you can since you'll be wanting a fair amount of wood. Native stuff is way stronger than the pine/spruce/fir you'll get at a lumber store.

Rebuild the frame using locust or sassafras or treated wood where you will be in ground contact. Better, get some concrete in there and set your posts off the ground a ways. Locust is best of the naturally rot resistant woods, but it's heavier than stink. The weight is indicative of the weight, however. Sassafras doesn't rot much, but it's a lot lighter and not quite as stong as the locust. The utility poles are good, but they tend to be tapered and so you might want to get them sawed parallel on two sides at least. Cutting them produces a pretty offensive brand of sawdust from the creosote and they will burn like a coal fire if they get started, so choose your uses wisely.

There's all kind of tricks involved in jacking the thing up, straightening it out, and so on. You'll need some bottle jacks, lots of 2, 3, 4, and 5 foot sections of stout wood -- old RR ties are good -- pulleys or come alongs, and stuff like that.

I admire you wanting to save it, but that's a big job for one guy. Try to find some Amishmen or local guys familiar with barns to help. There are also professional barn restorers out there, but I don't know that they have websites.

Keep us posted as you get into this thing. It could be interesting.

 

[dknarnd]

Mike...unfortunately I don't have pictures for this story but I will take some this weekend when I visit my brother of the finished job.

My brother has had the Amish working on his barn for the past couple of weeks and they (all three of them) have done tremdous work at very reasonable price. His barn (used to be our Grandfathers) is 34 x 58 with a full hay mow over most of it. For abour $12k they have replaced the entire roof with new painted metal, including all new lath under the roof, new fasica, new rake boards and gutters. After the roof they replaced a bunch of beams, floor, and wall boards. For the beams they were 8" x 8" hand hewed hemlock (local wood) and we are not talking short pieces either. In one corner they replaced the post which is about 20' then about 30' of bottom and top sill. Several other beams inside were replaced also plus a good section of floor. All new doors and probably about 50' of new side boards.

Now they are starting on the wagon shed which is leaning very badly and ready to fall. Today they removed all of the boards leaving only the frame and roof. He is having it completely rebuilt where it stands since it is on the road and there is a stream behind it you would never be able to rebuild in the same spot. I should be able to get some photos of this one beacuse I will be there Thursday and Friday. This building is about 25 x 35 and will cost him about $10k to save. For the size of the buildings this is very cheap compared to paying to replace it with a simular structure.

 

[EddieWalker]

You only take on a project like this if money and time are plentiful. It's extremely expensive and time consuming to save an old building, so don't even start unless it's something you really want to do.

It would be chaeper to knock it down, salvage what you can from it and burn the rest. Then build a brand new building. There are lots of options for building a barn or shop that you can do for allot less then you'll end up putting into that building.

Of course, I've been wrong on these things before and I could be wrong again, but from what I've seen in your pics, I'd walk away from it.

Good Luck,
Eddie

 

[AlanB]

Mike, I know squat about fixing barns, but I know Ed White of Whites equipment here in Clarksville TN has some done as a pretty regular thing. You might give him a call and ask who he uses or what he would reccomend.

I believe that he has a couple of crew's that he uses to do that, and I know he has several barns on his personal farm that have been redone.

Good luck.

 

[MikeB44]

Rich,

Thanks for the detailed restoration information. We do have a local sawmill that I can get lumber from. I’ll see what I can find there. I know that oak is plentiful, as my neighbor used 1” oak boards for siding his barn. Do you know of any good links to show the concrete post details (like diameter, depth & height of the post, rebar configuration, & the wood to concrete connection)?

As the utility poles I have access to are used, I would probably have a hard time getting them sawed parallel by someone else (worries about nail/spikes buried in the wood). Would there be a way to connect the beams (boards) without shaving the sides of the poles, such as metal hangers?

Your advice on using Amish or similar barn restorers is well taken. I will see who I can find in our area, however costs may be prohibitive at this point in time for us. I will keep you posted on the progress.

Jim (dknard),

Thanks for the information on the Amish builders. That was very helpful in giving me some potential cost guidelines. I would appreciate seeing any pictures you can take of the wagon shed during restoration, as well as of the barn having been restored. I do agree that the cost to save is much less than the cost to build it over again.

Eddie,

Thanks for your post. You are right on target about time and money. (In fact, I wasn’t able to post sooner due to work.) I have thought about taking down the 2 outer bays (where the posts (trees) were mostly gone, and rebuilding a single wider (16’) outer bay now, and a second one later. However, if at all possible, I want to save the center section as I admire the craftsmanship & would like to preserve the history.

Alan,

Thanks for the info on White’s Equipment. I will look up his number and give him a call. We’ve traveled to Clarksville for our daughter’s basketball games.

To All,

Quite amazingly/coincidentally my Mom had some visitors at the farm yesterday. Two brothers stopped by who used to live on the property. One brother is now in Colorado and wanted to stop by and see the place. He was concerned about stopping, since he didn’t want to get shot , but since we cleared a good bit of the junk trees and weeds out he felt more comfortable stopping.

They told my Mom where the well, spring, garden and fruit trees were. They talked about picking pears in the fall, and putting them in a crate beside the chimney until Christmas when they would be ripe and juicy (I was wondering how long it took for these TN pears to turn ripe – if anyone has recipes or other way’s to use/ripen them – let me know!). They talked about not having money and working for the neighbors to be paid in pigs or calves (since they didn’t have money either). They also talked about the barn…

The barn (I assume the center section only) was built around 1934, after the previous one burned that year. At the time of the fire, there were horses inside the barn. The farm owners had a blind man that lived with them (he was no relation to them, but as he had no other place to go, they allowed him to live there). The blind man made his way from the house to barn, by using his cane to tap fence posts for 300 feet or so. Once at the barn he opened the doors, went inside and chased the horses out, saving them.

I have not had a chance to talk with the brothers, but they may stop back out again this week. The story gives me yet more incentive to save the barn. If I get more information, I will pass it along.

Many Thanks!

 

[TNhobbyfarmer]

Mike...I live in Nashville (actually Hendersonville) as well. I have a farm in Stewart County between Clarksville and Dover. I have a couple of old barns that could use a lot of restoration, however, funds aren't currently available for such a project. I will be interested in how your project progresses and how much it costs. By the way, where is your farm?

 

[AlanB]

There seems to be a couple of us on here from this area.

Would any of you guys care to get together sometime, share lies (oh, I mean stories) some lunch and maybe look at some stuff together.

In the blacksmithing community they get together once a month at different folks shops build a little something, share some information and do some other neat things.

Was not sure if that was something that might work in this community occassionally as well?

I know there is a seperate forum at the bottom for this but thought I would ask here as there are at least three of us here now.

 

[MikeB44]

Jerry (TNhobbyfarmer),

We are pretty much next door neighbors (just outside of Millersville). I will definitely keep you informed on the project.

Alan,

Getting together sounds like a great idea. There is a diner in Millersville that we have been planning on trying out. We could then go and walk the farm afterwards.

 

[Egon]

Just from the pictures restoring means rebuilding on a new foundation if you want any type of sound results.