Health...Cholesterol....Saturated fats have never been proven to be bad for us...?

[MossRoad]

Anyone ever watched the video of the Tacoma Narrows Bridge in a wind??

Yeah. That's something, isn't it. No one thought about harmonics. Maybe our arteries are like that after a cheeseburger. :laughing:

 

[Frank Surber]

I awoke one morning with severe chest pains. But was ignoring them as best as I could trying to keep the wife from noticing, which was ultimately not possible. Personally I could have cared less about them Because I knew what the cause was before anyone else.
My pains were not caused from an accumulation of my heavy smoking @ the time over 50 years of 3 to 4 packs per day, nor were they brought on by artillery's being clogged from eating far too much fried foods, nor were they brought on by genetics or a sedentary lifestyle, however this may have contributed.
I was hardly what one could consider very much over weight maybe a few pounds should be dropped for my age.
Anyway as I was dressing for work the pain escalated to the point that I broke out in a cold sweat, all of the color drained brom my face and finally I made one mistake in my movements which caused me to wince in excruciating discomfort, violent enough to gasp.
So Jane being fearful for my life called the only phone number programmed in her cell phone other than mine. She told my boss/partner what she feared was happening and about an hour and a half later He is shuttling my sorry butt to the hospital.
The pain has long since subsided however none of my protesting was going to have any effect on my eventual 3 week incarceration in the Hospital.
The full gambit of tests were performed on me
Lungs; clear 90% capacity of when I was about 20 years younger
Heart: fine no out of the ordinary pattern
Blood; normal actually better condition than most @ my age.
Cameras and probes had been forced through every one of my arteries no excessive plaque build up.
every 3 letter & 4 letter acronym machine had been hooked up to me with the exception of shoving me through the big magnet because I refused to let them do that due to old shrapnel in my body.
In the end I wound up with a stint being inserted in one of my arteries.
This stint just happens to have been patented by a distant cousin of mine but that is another story.
Anyway the reason for the stint and my wasted 3 weeks in the hospital actually had nothing to do with any heart or health related issues back in 1972 I had a piece of shrapnel lodged too close to my heart and a main artery for the field surgeon to remove over the years tissue had grown around it causing the artery to be pinched nearly closed.
ON the day prior to my pains I had received a very hard blow to my chest hard enough to knock most of the air out of my lungs nearly collapsing them so bad that it was nearly an hour before I was breathing normally again. This had apparently caused some swelling in my chest cavity then coupled with the position in which I had slept caused my heart to be starved for blood.
So now for a year I have to take an assortment of drugs. These drugs effect my sleeping to the point that I have trouble going to sleep and staying asleep they have my blood thinned out to the point of hemophilia
My LDL is now very low, below 40 my HDL is on the rise over 150 at last check up.
they change my meds each 3 months which brings on bouts of diarrhea
And to cap it off I have a foreign substance permanently inserted in one of my arteries I swear it would be better not to have DRs in this world just let us either live or die naturally

 

[alchemysa]

Cholesterol lowering drugs are the most profitable drugs ever invented. The drug companies want everyone over 21 to be reliant on them, so they have funded research that has set 'safe levels' at figures that are almost impossible to achieve 'naturally'. Doctors get their 'information' from drug companies.

 

[CBW1999]

Cholesterol lowering drugs are the most profitable drugs ever invented. The drug companies want everyone over 21 to be reliant on them, so they have funded research that has set 'safe levels' at figures that are almost impossible to achieve 'naturally'. Doctors get their 'information' from drug companies.

As someone with severe heart disease and high cholesterol- I actually AGREE with you (for the most part).

There is no real evidence that cholesterol alone is a factor in artery blockage. Genetic predisposition is a huge part. I have no scientific evidence but- there are more than just a few "healthy" people that have heart attacks (sometimes just dropping dead).

The drug companies themselves don't do a lot of direct research about "safe" cholesterol levels but, certainly spend a lot of money funding research coordinated by the Heart Association.

 

[N80]

Cholesterol lowering drugs are the most profitable drugs ever invented. The drug companies want everyone over 21 to be reliant on them, so they have funded research that has set 'safe levels' at figures that are almost impossible to achieve 'naturally'. Doctors get their 'information' from drug companies.

And big brother is watching you right now by satellite. And fluoride in the water is a mind control technique. And grandma smoked and drank and did heroin and drank bacon fact and lived to be 120. And seat belts are dangerous because they drown you if you drive into a lake. Blah blah blah.

There are a lot of doctors out there who are idiots. I'd say in exactly the same proportion as lawyers, engineers, airline pilots, physicists, chemists, cops, firemen, nuclear energy techs, sergeants, colonels and preachers. But that doesn't mean that all or even most or even many of these professionals are idiots.

And the truth is, that in virtually all these fields, the science changes. Constantly. People seem to have the impression that medical science is somehow static and set in stone. It is not. What was right yesterday is wrong today.....and it has nothing to do with the powerful AMA mafia, drug company conspiracies, idiot doctors or the FDA.

And the real take home truth is that most of the time if people would follow their doctor's basic medical advice they would be a lot better off. But you know what....almost no one does. And they usually don't because they don't have the self discipline and self respect to do the hard things that improve length and quality of life.....or even worse....because they 1) read something in the paper or 2) heard something from Dr. Oz.....or Oprah or 3) read something on WebMD and assumed that they suddenly knew more about medicine than their doctor.

And at the risk of sounding pretentious and arrogant, medicine is complicated an generally beyond the grasp of the general public no matter how much time they spend on the internet. The reason this is not arrogant or pretentious is that it is true about almost every profession or trade. I can't spend a few hours on the internet and know as much about plumbing as my plumber. I can't go to the library and learn how to run a nuclear power plant and I sure wouldn't EVER want to defend myself in court. And yet, it seems that I spend a lot of time dealing with patient's misconceptions that they hold very dear. In the few posts in this thread it is clear that some folks don't even understand the statistical insignificance of anecdotal evidence.

But in the end, the take home story is this: if your doctor is an idiot, get a new one. If all doctors are idiots then DON'T GO TO THE DOCTOR. And if you know the best way to keep from having a heart attack or stroke then by all means, do it. And if you want to eat whatever you want and smoke whatever you want and drink whatever you want and never exercise then that is your prerogative. Just don't try to justify it based on drug company conspiracies, water cooler stories or something you saw on the freaking internet. Just do it because you want to and because you're man enough to live with the consequences. (Cardiovascular disease accounts for 1 in 3 deaths in the US)

 

[/pine]

...but I'll bet we can all tell more stories about people that appeared healthy and keeled over dead from a heart attack long before that age due to undetected heart disease, clogged arteries, etc....

The autopsies performed on young casualties in Vietnam proved this...even a majority of 18-19 year old GIs showed early signs...

 

[Frank Surber]

And big brother is watching you right now by satellite. (1)

There are a lot of doctors out there who are idiots. I'd say in exactly the same proportion as lawyers, engineers, airline pilots, physicists, chemists, cops, firemen, nuclear energy techs, sergeants, colonels and preachers. But that doesn't mean that all or even most or even many of these professionals are idiots. (2)

And the truth is, that in virtually all these fields, the science changes. Constantly. People seem to have the impression that medical science is somehow static and set in stone. It is not. What was right yesterday is wrong today.....and it has nothing to do with the powerful AMA mafia, drug company conspiracies, idiot doctors or the FDA. (3)

And the real take home truth is that most of the time if people would follow their doctor's basic medical advice they would be a lot better off. But you know what....almost no one does. Just do it because you want to and because you're man enough to live with the consequences. (4)(Cardiovascular disease accounts for 1 in 3 deaths in the US)

1 in all probability this has more truth than most realize
2 Absolutely, it takes a very small percentage of incompetent ones to reduce the general population's level of confidence of these persons to near ZERO
3 If things were not in a constant state of evolutionary flux what would be the point in persons of all professional fields needing to periodically refresh and update their knowledge base
4 In general this is perfectly sound advice. This could however drop into one of those ( in a perfect World scenarios ), one size fits all if the worded phrase hadn't included the qualifier (most of the time).
Ultimately the very last part of that statement must become and allowed to be a responsibility left up to the individual
""(Cardiovascular disease accounts for 1 in 3 deaths in the US"" Eventually everyone needs to have something do die from I just had to throw that in there as a joke

 

[Soundguy]

yep.. you can be young, thinn, active and exercise.. and have a heart issue due to cholesterol, trigs, etc...

 

[EE_Bota]

I have no scientific proof of my opinion, so I wouldn't believe it if I were you guys but:

I think a man can eat about anything he wants if he works like a dog. But it can't be really stressful to him to do that work. If you really use your body daily and need the calories, and you like what you do, then I do believe you can do the meals of yesteryear. But don't get used to it because when that activity wains in later life, that intake needs to wain right along with it.

I believe you need to watch your gut. Not your arms, your face, but your gut. Don't have a gut sticking out over your belt if you can possibly avoid it.

I believe that even serious plaques can be removed from your arteries with the right diet. I think some people can have a mild attack in their midlife and pretty much clear their system out of plaques and stay that way for decades. But if I were a doctor, I wouldn't be able to count on that because although it is not a bad lifestyle and the food can be really good, most people lack the creativity and discipline to enact a regimen to accomplish that. I know people who have done so, however.

My personal strategy: I will go for a checkup each year and have tests appropriate for my stage of life. I try to eat a variety of things, and I try not to eat unless I am hungry (or by the clock*) and stop eating when I am no longer hungry. I try to put less on my plate than most because I hate to waste, so I will eat it if it is there. I don't like to eat out in any place where the portion size pushed me to eat more than I would normally eat. A buffet is completely lost on me unless I just want the variety. At reunions and family get-togethers there is such a variety, and of course I want to try it all. So I get a teaspoon of each of the items, and I am often shocked at how large a plate that makes. Otherwise, I put an appropriate amount on my plate, and eat that, and if I truly desire, I will go back for seconds, but eat that more slowly so I can better enjoy it. But truly, seconds are rare for me.

*Frequently I am not hungry at all. So I don't suffer the struggles of some. I do sympathize with people who are constantly hungry. I go for days eating only because it is time to do so...so I eat.

 

[dmccarty]

My personal strategy: I will go for a checkup each year and have tests appropriate for my stage of life. I try to eat a variety of things, and I try not to eat unless I am hungry (or by the clock*) and stop eating when I am no longer hungry. I try to put less on my plate than most because I hate to waste, so I will eat it if it is there. I don't like to eat out in any place where the portion size pushed me to eat more than I would normally eat. A buffet is completely lost on me unless I just want the variety. At reunions and family get-togethers there is such a variety, and of course I want to try it all. So I get a teaspoon of each of the items, and I am often shocked at how large a plate that makes. Otherwise, I put an appropriate amount on my plate, and eat that, and if I truly desire, I will go back for seconds, but eat that more slowly so I can better enjoy it. But truly, seconds are rare for me.

I get a check up whenever. I have minimized what I eat which is very hard to do as it requires that ugly "lifestyle change" which is fancy way to say habits. I have lost weight but I would like to loose another 10-20 pounds. I think the BMI metric is BS. There is another metric that says your waist size should be no more than half of your height which makes more sense to me. I weigh more today than when I was 18 but I am far stronger today than I was at 18. BMI does not take that into account. If I could just loose that 10-20 pounds. I was really burning off the calories this year with an exercise bike but then work got crazy and there was not as much time for the bike.

We don't eat out much anymore to save money but also calories. I have never been big on buffets and I really don't like to over eat. Now that I have said that.... :laughing::laughing::laughing:

At work we have had two end of year lunches. One was last week at a very nice very high end place and we had a very small buffet. Some people might have been critical of the buffet size but Oh My Goodness was it GOOD. Some of the best food I have ever eaten and I have eaten some good food. I went back THREE times for lunch and twice for desert! :shocked: At least the main course was salmon, AWESOME, so it was healthy, right? :licking::licking::licking:

This place is right across the road from a major university and teaching hospital. In fact my wifey's doctor's office was in walking, well, lets be honest after that meal, waddling distance. :laughing::laughing::laughing: I over ate so much I need a wheel chair to get back to the truck. At least I did not have dinner that night! This week we had another work lunch which was interesting. We had more money to spend than I would have guessed. I had planed on having a hamburger but we had enough money for me to have a rib eye! :licking::laughing::laughing::laughing: I got a 12 oz steak, the smallest, but it had a good 2-4 ounces of fat which I cut off. For $22 you only got the steak and ONE side. I don't eat fries much so I ordered the steak fries. So $22 for a steak and fries. :confused3: Wow, that is alot of money. We normally eat at fancier places on vacation which means we are at restaurants that charge more because of the location. The vacation places ain't that bad when a steak and fries cost $22. So for $22 I wanted more food. On the other hand it was ENOUGH food. Most people got a big lunch and desert but to be fair they did take the desert home. I skip desert. Still shocked at $22 for a steak and fries. Maybe we need to get out more. :laughing::laughing::laughing:

I have been really good at holiday family meals in just getting a very little to eat. I will only get what I most like, not everything I like, which helps hold down the calories though I think it ticks off family members that I don't eat THEIR food or eat enough. Too bad, I don't need the calories.

At work we have been discussing food, diet, and health quite a bit over the last month or two. It is just so easy to overeat and it is fun to eat. Even with food getting more expensive, it still is cheap to eat. It is easy to down a couple beers or soda which can easily add up to 20 pounds of fat in a year. I think we have been conditioned to eat three times a day which made sense when we had heavy manual labor to do. I stopped eating a scheduled lunch years ago. I wish I had stopped decades ago and I would not have this 10-20 pounds to loose. I would eat lunch not because I was hungry but because the cafeteria would close soon. Now I eat dried fruits and nuts at my desk WHEN I get hungry and only what I need to eat. For dinner, I eat very little, often just a sandwich. No more beer during the week either which save money and calories. :drink::laughing::laughing::laughing:

I stopped gaining weight years ago and often am loosing a bit of weight. I think the big mistake people make when trying to go on a diet is to try to loose weight first and fast but that step is too big. They need to change their habits so they are not GAINING weight then ease into changing the diet to LOOSE weight. If you just loose the weight without changing habits, that weight is gained right back. People try to change over night, what has taken years to build, which is a recipe for fat loss failure.

Later,
Dan