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  1. #21
    Veteran Member vtsnowedin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    Quote Originally Posted by N80 View Post
    After accessing Remington's web site, which as mentioned is just awfully slow and clunky, I do believe this is their 'varmint' hollow point round.
    +1 on the bullet ID.
    To me a bad wound is caused by a to light bullet driven at too high a velocity that comes apart as soon as it hits the animal. You can on an angled shot strike the shoulder or foreleg bones make bloody hamburger of the whole shoulder and not have any penetration into the chest cavity to take out any vital organ or cut a major artery. The result is a three legged deer or moose that can go for miles and end up as coyote bait.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    Speer Reloading Manual #14
    Page 22, "Match Boat Tail Hollow Point"
    "Match hollow point bullets are not recommended for game animals. Expansion properties of OTM(open tip match) bullets are unpredictable and therefore preclude their use as game bullets"

    I loaned out my older Speer and Sierra books, but recall they had similar disclaimers.

    Descriptions from them and various reading online about reloading over the years have basically described match bullets as thinner jacket and characteristics more like varmint bullets, that tend to fragment or shed jackets at impact, resulting in more superficial wounds than a heavy jacket game round that has controlled expansion.

    I like Sierra 165 BTHP Gamekings for deer and antelope. It approaches Sierra 168 BTHP Matchking accuracy, but has a heavy jacket for controlled expansion.

    Even with a COM shot, if the bullet comes apart, it will not transfer it energy effectively. It will damage meat, but may not penetrate enough to affect vital organs.

    Quote Originally Posted by wrooster View Post
    I'm having trouble differentiating between a "bad wound" and a "clean kill".

    Assuming the same shot placement, there are two mechanisms which lead to death: 1) hypovolemia link leading to exsanguination link leading to cerebral anoxia link of the brain, and 2) disruption or termination of central nervous system (CNS) function such that autonomous functions (breathing, etc) cease.

    Wrooster
    RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

  3. #23
    Super Member N80's Avatar
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertN View Post
    Speer Reloading Manual #14
    Page 22, "Match Boat Tail Hollow Point"
    "Match hollow point bullets are not recommended for game animals. Expansion properties of OTM(open tip match) bullets are unpredictable and therefore preclude their use as game bullets"
    Does "game" include varmints? I'm guessing not.
    George
    South Carolina

    The size of government is inversely proprotional to the degree of freedom it affords.

    "What is truth?" Pontius Pilate

  4. #24
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    My guess would be no... On the previous pages, they talk about thin jacket varmint bullets being thin jacket "To ensure complete disruption on impact" and that bullet penetration is very limited, and may only wound deer sized animals.

    Quote Originally Posted by N80 View Post
    Does "game" include varmints? I'm guessing not.
    RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

  5. #25
    Veteran Member vtsnowedin's Avatar
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    There is a bit of confusion here. There are two types of bullets that look like the one in the picture. Match bullets built for accuracy in the extreme with no regards for terminal expansion and varmint light weight bullets built to be both accurate and to come apart explosively on impact to avoid the danger of ricochets. Some match bullets are so strongly constructed that they don't expand at all. Sierra match kings for one. These when fired into green poplar wood can be recovered actually longer then they were when fired as they get drawn out like a wire pulled through a die. The second varmint bullets have an empty space at the tip of the closed up jacket that you can't see but breaks up the bullet and separates the jacket on impact. Neither of these is suitable for deer sized game.
    But back to the original question. As the round was bought some years ago I pulled out a "Shooters Bible" from 1996. In the reference section they list Remington's offerings that year for the 7-08 Rem. three entries 120 gr, 140 gr and 154gr. the 120 gr was order code R7M083 and is named "hollow point" not match and is the bullet in the picture. the 140 gr was named "pointed soft point" and the 154 gr. was named " extended range" . Use the 140s for deer and the 154s for moose and bear.

  6. #26
    Super Member N80's Avatar
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    Default Re: What kind of bullet is this?

    Quote Originally Posted by vtsnowedin View Post
    But back to the original question. As the round was bought some years ago I pulled out a "Shooters Bible" from 1996. In the reference section they list Remington's offerings that year for the 7-08 Rem. three entries 120 gr, 140 gr and 154gr. the 120 gr was order code R7M083 and is named "hollow point" not match and is the bullet in the picture.
    I agree. I can't even imagine why my dad would have ever bought match ammo. But he did hunt coyotes.

    I sure wish these were big game bullets. When I shot this gun to check the point of aim the first two holes were literally touching, 2" high and 2" right. Adjusted the scope, next two shots dead center 3/4" high, one hole above the other 1/4" apart.

    Now I've got to take it back out and try it with the 140g Core-Lokt bullets that I have. Hope they shoot as well and close to these hollow points.
    George
    South Carolina

    The size of government is inversely proprotional to the degree of freedom it affords.

    "What is truth?" Pontius Pilate

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