N80
Super Member
Chuck52 said:George, I admire your taste in ginger ale, but I think you fall into the common trap of assuming that whatever problem comes up must be the fault of those other guys, and here those other guys would be the foolish liberals. It is not at all clear how the US nuclear energy program was essentially junked.
Well, I agree and disagree. I do not agree that there were significant other factors outside of environmentalist/anti-nuke pressure. I understand that it was a multifactorial issue, but the primary factors were clear. The fact that Three Mile Island became a rally cry, was pretty much an anti nuke creation.
I do agree that my post was purely one sided and I thought about that as I typed it but decided it was an overly involved rant already. But sure, you create a vacuum by disabling nuclear energy and you create market and power opportunities that will be filled. The petroleum industry in all this is as big a bug bear as any other faction or idealogy.
Was anyone clammoring for nuclear power?
Why yes, yes they were. Definitely. But between the media and the activists, what was already a potentially risky investment became untenable.
Since the Great Prevaricator made Liberal a dirty word in the 80's, Conservatives have had at least as much time to undo the damage if that was of interest to them.
The Great Communitcator had less to do with making 'liberal' a dirty word than the Great Do Nothing he replaced. But I agree, in the interveneing years, no political party, right or left, has done anything to make anything better. But sure, plenty of blame to go around. But I prefer to blame those with whom I disagree....don't you? And someone mentioned the president from Arkansas. Who else could appear at a gathering of anti-logging environmentalists in the morning and a gatthering of lumberjacks in the evening, promise them both that he was totally on their side....and have both groups go home happy! That man is a Jedi!
Follow the money is a phrase that comes to mind, and money knows no ideology.
I am in total agreement. And there is no better way to divorce idealogy from money than to make property ownership corporate. Corporations do not have souls. Don't get me started, this is an interest of mine that I have put considerable study into. Corporate irresponsibility is a real issue.
Is Science a Liberal field?
No. And I did not suggest that it was. I said that science was as prone to liberal ideaology as any other institution. It can be prone to any ideaology you choose. That is my point. Too many people assume that 'science' is somehow this great, neutral arbiter of truth. It isn't. In fact, its no closer to that than any other -ism or faith based religion.
While Universities have the reputation of being Liberal, the Sciences, Engineering, Medical and Agricultural faculties probably reflect about the same political balance as the general population.
Maybe. Maybe not. The medical sciences tend to be enormously liberal in some very specific and prominent subspecialties and organizations. No 'science' is immune. In the fields you cite, corporate influence trumps ideaology more than anything else. When DuPont or Phizer builds your university a mulit-gazzilion dollar chemistry building....which way do you think the research trends?
The next political cycle may help clarify who thinks what, since the apparent front runner on the Republican side doesn't seem to hold Al Gore in contempt.
We've been asked to keep politics out of this but I'll hazard to suggest a bipartisan aphorism and state unequivocally that political cycles never clarify anything.
Great discussion Chuck.
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