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  1. #3111
    Elite Member
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    We as human are producing tons of gaseous materials daily that trap and hold heat. This is having an adverse impact on the old rock we live on.

    Climate Communication | Heat-Trapping Gases

    We in our quest for creature comforts, new and improved things and a desire to live, work and enjoy recreational pursuits in a controlled environment contribute to heat trapping gasses. Some of the gases that are ozone-friendly are strong heat trapping which results in warming effects on mother earth.

    Trapping Heat - Graphic - NYTimes.com

  2. #3112
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    Quote Originally Posted by /pine View Post
    congrats..you and r brown are the first two idiots I have ever deemed so stupid and ignorant that I felt compelled to entirely ignore...geeze!, you two are dumber than stumps...!
    Sorry about the end to our friendship. What caused the riff? Was the part about looking in the bathroom mirror to find the answer to the question you asked, just too much?

  3. #3113
    Super Star Member IslandTractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toppop52
    What I disagree with is AGW. No "honest", unbiased data proves the recent warming, which by the way appears to have subsided recently, is substantially different than previous events of warming and de-glaciation.
    You want proof as if we (humans) only move forward when absolute proof is available. Did Colombus have proof or just a preponderance of best available evidence that the earth was round? There are precious few examples in science or engineering where absolute incontrovertible proof is available before people act. Certainly in medicine there is rarely proof, just best available evidence to guide decision making. If I wait until there is absolute proof that a patient has laboratory confirmed sepsis before starting therapy rather than beginning antibiotics when a preponderance of clinical evidence points to the possibility or likelihood of infection, that would be malpractice. I see the climate debate in similar terms. If a preponderance of evidence supports AGW, then act on it and revise as necessary as new data becomes available. With a system as complex as the global climate there is unlikely to ever be a predictive model that is precisely accurate. That doesn't mean we are paralyzed though. If the preponderance of evidence points to CO2 as important in climate change and the human contribution to atmospheric CO2 can be mitigated, then why sit on our hands?

    There is always room for reasonable skepticism in scientific endeavors but there is a big difference between reasonable skepticism and obstructionism motivated primarily by political agendas. The "denier" blogs that are so frequently referred to as sources of information by skeptics in this thread are nearly all blatantly political rather than scientific. I have stumbled upon some British skeptic blogs (eg Bishop Hill) which are far more rooted in science and seem to be counterparts to the skeptical science website rather than BWAAHAHA commie conspiracy baloney. However, even Bishop Hill doesn't provide substantive criticism of the IPCC summaries of evidence and focuses, at least based on my first reading, on pointing out rather trivial mistakes in graphs and arithmetic rather than providing a credible alternative hypothesis. Like it's conclusions or not, the IPCC summaries reflect current consensus opinion of those who are best able and prepared to interpret climate data. It seems rather foolish to ignore such a report just because you don't like the consequences.
    Last edited by IslandTractor; 11-26-2012 at 09:22 AM.

  4. #3114
    Super Star Member Egon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    Wonder where the summer water comes from when the Mountain Glaciers melt?
    Egon
    50 years behind the times
    Livin in a
    Worn out skin bag filled with rattlin bones

  5. #3115
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gator6x4 View Post
    We as human are producing tons of gaseous materials daily that trap and hold heat. This is having an adverse impact on the old rock we live on.

    Climate Communication | Heat-Trapping Gases

    We in our quest for creature comforts, new and improved things and a desire to live, work and enjoy recreational pursuits in a controlled environment contribute to heat trapping gasses. Some of the gases that are ozone-friendly are strong heat trapping which results in warming effects on mother earth.

    Trapping Heat - Graphic - NYTimes.com

    The main tenet of AGW "theory" is that the lower and mid-troposphere should warm at a faster rate than the surface with the greatest warming to occur in the tropics.

    It is not happening; there is no tropical tropospheric "hot spot" in the atmosphere. Nor is the stratosphere cooling. Gases don't "trap" heat; they absorb and re-emit. Not only is this information available in published literature, the data is as well.


    Link to all the sites you want.

  6. #3116
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    Quote Originally Posted by IslandTractor View Post
    You want proof as if we (humans) only move forward when absolute proof is available. Did Colombus have proof or just a preponderance of best available evidence that the earth was round? There are precious few examples in science or engineering where absolute incontrovertible proof is available before people act. Certainly in medicine there is rarely proof, just best available evidence to guide decision making. If I wait until there is absolute proof that a patient has laboratory confirmed sepsis before starting therapy rather than beginning antibiotics when a preponderance of clinical evidence points to the possibility or likelihood of infection, that would be malpractice. I see the climate debate in similar terms. If a preponderance of evidence supports AGW, then act on it and revise as necessary as new data becomes available. With a system as complex as the global climate there is unlikely to ever be a predictive model that is precisely accurate. That doesn't mean we are paralyzed though. If the preponderance of evidence points to CO2 as important in climate change and the human contribution to atmospheric CO2 can be mitigated, then why sit on our hands?

    There is always room for reasonable skepticism in scientific endeavors but there is a big difference between reasonable skepticism and obstructionism motivated primarily by political agendas. The "denier" blogs that are so frequently referred to as sources of information by skeptics in this thread are nearly all blatantly political rather than scientific. I have stumbled upon some British skeptic blogs (eg Bishop Hill) which are far more rooted in science and seem to be counterparts to the skeptical science website rather than BWAAHAHA commie conspiracy baloney. However, even Bishop Hill doesn't provide substantive criticism of the IPCC summaries of evidence and focuses, at least based on my first reading, on pointing out rather trivial mistakes in graphs and arithmetic rather than providing a credible alternative hypothesis. Like it's conclusions or not, the IPCC summaries reflect current consensus opinion of those who are best able and prepared to interpret climate data. It seems rather foolish to ignore such a report just because you don't like the consequences.
    I can see this is going to be fun.......

    Are you prepared?

  7. #3117
    Super Star Member IslandTractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistermcgoo

    I can see this is going to be fun.......

    Are you prepared?
    Yes I am prepared for another denier blowhard with minimal credentials to find the critical typo that demolishes AGW. Can't wait.

  8. #3118
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    Default Re: Global Warming?

    Quote Originally Posted by IslandTractor View Post
    Yes I am prepared for another denier blowhard with minimal credentials to find the critical typo that demolishes AGW. Can't wait.
    The pot calling the kettle black. It doesn't take a consensus (which isn't science) to disprove a hypothesis.

    Let's start with one subject at a time. You believe the IPCC is the last word. Are you aware even the IPCC acknowledges clouds are poorly understood? Climate models do not correctly simulate clouds. That being the case, why is it difficult to grasp that changing cloud cover can account for virtually all cooling and warming? What evidence do you have that changing cloud cover has been ruled out as the cause for recent warming?

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