Upgrading Septic System

   / Upgrading Septic System #1  
R

rdwarner

Guest
Moved onto our place about a year and a half ago. We new at the time that the septic system wasn't up to local code, so we put it in the job jar to upgrade. We've got visible things going on like a couple of perpetual wet spots out over the leach field, and the graywater bypassing the septic tank and running out into the woods. Had a guy out the other day that's proposing to use some "tunnel-like" material with louvers on the sides to put into a new field. Anyone familiar with this stuff? Also, he claims that he can run it into the woods and that only cedars are intrusive to the system. any thoughts?
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #2  
Hi rdwarner,

I am in the middle of replacing ("upgrading") a septic system. I have collected a lot of info and would be glad to share it. It will help to know some more about your situation and needs:

1) Where are you located, geographically (will can a BIG difference)?
2) How old is the original system?
3) What type of system is in place now?
4) How many people live in your household?
5) Have you had percolation tests done on the soil? If so, what was the result?
6) Generally speaking, what type of soil do you have?
7) Are you in a residential or rural area?
8) How much acreage are you on?

What does "not up to local code" mean?

With some more info, I'll try to offer some insights.
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #3  
rdwarner

The chambered system that I am aware of is made by Inflitrator. Try this link <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.infiltratorsystems.com/>http://www.infiltratorsystems.com/</A>.
They are supposed to allow more rapid water disposal but it is dependent upon your type of soil and they are not acceptable in heavy clay or sand type of soils. I would look at why your original leach field decided to quit working. Some states allow a reduction in the length of the leach field for using this type of field but I would not skimp on the length if you have enough property to handle a standard designed leach field. You may even want to manifold it into your existing field with a control valve to switch the flow. If your existing field is allowed to rest for a year it may recover and give you additional capacity when you need it.
Low water using fixtures and front loading washing machines can help reduce the amount of water you have to deal with in the first place. Also make sure that you do not have too small of a septic tank to begin with. If the solids do not stay in the tank they can get to your leach field and clog it up. Also when was the last time you had it pumped out and inspected?
Good luck on getting your replacement field, I know that can be very expensive.

Randy
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #4  
Since you mention code, I assume you will have to satisfy the inspectors. I too need to put in a new drain field but my system was grandfathered in as is because I have enough acreage that the seeping grey water does not impinge on any neighbor's property. Be that as it may, I want to fix the system for my own well being. One concern I have is that if I have drain field work done I must have it inspected and OK'ed...no problem there, but I understand that the inspector then has the right to inspect the entire system. As it happens, my tank is way undersized by current code. It works fine. I had it pumped last fall and the honey dipper guy (love that phrase) said it really didn't even need pumping. Replacing the perfectly working tank will cost at least $5000. Will the inspector insist I do that? Apparently it depends on the inspector, the time of day, and what he had for lunch. Hopefully none of this applies to your situation.

Chuck
 
   / Upgrading Septic System
  • Thread Starter
#5  
BobT,
1) Troy, MO - about 50 miles West and North of St. Louis (BTW - most of my family live in Tipton County, IN)
2) The present system is about 6 years old.
3) The current system is just the concrete tank and the pipe and gravel field... no aerator, no pump back...nothing fancy.
4) 2 people in household.
5) Don't know outcome of last soil test. It was done prior to us moving in. (see #6)
6) The area around the septic tank and out into the field is mostly clay. (Which is probably why the septic man wants to go into the woods.)
7) Rural area, but in a group of parcels ranging from 5 to 20 acres
8) We have 11 acres.

The county code was changed right about the time this house was built, to stop the bypassing of septic tanks with graywater for instance. Now I know that I'm probably "grandfathered", and I don't plan on ever selling this place, but ya' never know. Besides, the smell of that graywater running out into the woods, can ruin a family barbecue on a steamy summer evening.
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #6  
<font color=blue>Besides, the smell of that graywater running out into the woods, can ruin a family barbecue on a
steamy summer evening.</font color=blue>

I hear that! Besides, the kids, or grandkids in my case, are sure to wander into that area sometime.

Sounds like your best bet is to contact the health inspectors office before having anything done. Despite my earlier posting, they can often be quite helpful. Though they aren't supposed to recommend particular installers, they should be able to give you a list of qualified people and answer questions regarding your particular situation. It's my impression that they either do the percolation test themselves or have to OK it anyway. Since your system is relatively new....mine is 44 years old...you shouldn't have to worry about the tank at least.

Chuck
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #7  
Last year when our septic failed (it had been so long since anyone had pumped out the tank we weren't sure where it was anymore!) and a brown geyser erupted in the lower field we had a trackhoe unearth the tank (250 gallon rusted out metal tank packed solid with sediment like a pint of Ben and Jerry's best!) we were sure we were facing $10k to bring it up to code. But the guy we called liked our coffee and our attitude. After poking around a bit he declared that extending the main drain thru the silted up tank to a new tank and leach field downhill about 25' was only a "repair" since the entire system hadn't needed replacing. (The main drain was OEM.) We used an infiltrator type system under the premise that anything that didn't result in a geyser was a big improvement. Besides, with several generations buried in the side yard it's not like we're planning on going anywhere.

Pete
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #8  
Hi,

The other posters have some good suggestions. The thing that just leapt out at me was:

"2) The present system is about 6 years old."

Now, some say a septic typically lasts 10-15 years, but ours is 27 years old. I am sure other forum members have systems that are older than that. But six years in my opinion, is WAY too short a life cycle for a septic system.

Even with clay soil, a system should be capable of lasting 15-20 years. Our previous system was an "evapotransporation" type of system, because we had essentially -zero- percolation at 40 inches after one hour. That is BAAAAD.

Our system nonetheless lasted 27 years, and only failed, I am convinced, because we added "soft water" (high sodium) about 3 years ago. Our system has not totally failed, but backs up if we take 4 showers, run the dishwasher and two loads of laundry---all within an hour.

"3) The current system is just the concrete tank and the pipe and gravel field... no aerator, no pump back...nothing fancy."

Well, the ideal septic system doesn’t NEED to be fancy most of the time. My notion is that the need for all of these chlorinators and pumps is a concept “sold” by various interested parties to local health departments, who "require" them. A lot of "fancy” equipment will usually cost more to maintain, and fail sooner than any so-called simple system.

"2 people in household."

Again, this doesn’t make sense, as 2 people should not be able to overload practically ANY septic system. It is possible that 2 people wearing out a septic system within 6 years, means it was improperly installed or configured in the first place.

"6) The area around the septic tank and out into the field is mostly clay. (Which is probably why the septic man wants to go into the woods.)"

Eleven acres if sufficient to create dispersion channels out into the woods.

"Besides, the smell of that graywater running out into the woods,"

Graywater usually means water from washing machines and dishwashers, which is just water and soap, and usually contains no harmful bacteria. It MAY smell, but your septic should be handling this as well. It may be that the graywater is not going through your system, but just being piped out into the top of field.

If it is ONLY soap and water, it will most likely be in accord with “residual effluent” health department regulations. It doesn’t look so nice, and may not even smell so nice. But, is likely poses no health hazard. You could have that standing water tested, and compared to health department codes.

My advice to you is to locate, and hire, a "septic engineer." Ask around to real estate agents and general building contractors. They will be able to provide several names. Or look in the phone book yellow pages. Any “residential” engineer will know how to design a septic system.

It will probably cost $80-100 for him (or her) to come out and fully evaluate your current system. If it has failed or is failing, he will create complete blueprints for a proper replacement system, that will of course not only handle your septic needs, but also conform to all health and building codes.

I got estimates from $1,500 to $20,00 from various "experts' I consulted. They all were trying to sell me something. In the end, I got the best and straightest answer from the state-licensed engineer.

He charged me $550 for the evaluation and new septic plans. Total cost will be around $6,000. No, I don't like to spend it, but am assured that it is really what I need, and hopefully, I won't have to come back (in six years) and do it over again.

Also, do a search in the TBN forums on “septic” and “septics.” There have been a couple of long and very good threads on septic systems, wouldn’t ya’ know.

All the best,
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #9  
rdwarner,
When I bought this place it was during a drought. The next summer we were deluged with rain, and it seemed it took forever for water to drain/soak in over the leach field. Then we noticed the black pools developing in the yard. I called several people out to look (not the Health Department mind you) and was told the tank had somehow let solids out into the leach field. The culprit was the wrong outlet fitting in the tank, but still had to deal with the clogged lines and field. I did some research and found this outfit http://www.terraliftinternational.com/main.html
There was a local sewer cleaning company that had the machine, so I figured a call was in order. They came out and pumped the tank, then told me what a new field would cost, including hauling the 'hazardous waste dirt' away. Around $7000. But I could try the TerraLift treatment and see what happens for $1200. I must say it has made a 100% improvement. No more black ponds and no more getting the Yanmar stuck in the muck. If you ever have the chance to see anyone do this to a leach field, wear a rain coat. Sends geysers of black water about 15 feet in the air when they inject those beads/air in the ground at 300 psi.
 
   / Upgrading Septic System #10  
We had an Infiltrator system put in at our weekend home about five years ago based on what the local health department recommended. Five years is not much of a test but we have had no problems at all. I did do some research at the time and this system does, although fairly new, seem to be the system of choice in many parts of the country.

MarkV
 
 
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