Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    125
    Location
    Scappoose, Oregon
    Tractor
    Kubota B6200 HST

    Default Property Lines

    I have a property line question. I live on a piece of land adjoined by two other parcels owned by two separate (other) parties. All three properties are accessed via my driveway which is an easement. No problem. Property owner 2 and 3 are having a dispute. Property owner 3 says their property line crosses over property owner 2's existing driveway and thinks they should move it. In looking at the survey I had done a couple of years ago, property owner 3 may be right. But, even if they are right, can they request owner 2 to move their driveway? I should note, that all properties and driveways are in the same location since land was developed 30 years ago. Any surveyors or experienced people have any ideas on this?


  2. #2

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    709
    Location
    Saint Hedwig, TX
    Tractor
    TC29D, 8n, 9n

    Default Re: Property Lines

    Property owner 2 should consult with an attorney that has a good working knowledge of the real estate laws of your State. On such matters property laws can vary from State to State, and can be subject to interpretation. I've looked up such laws in Texas, but they may not apply. I would also like to add that I have seen these kind of disputes get way out of hand. It would be in everyones interest to keep a cool head[img]/w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif[/img].
    Ernie


  3. #3

    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Posts
    125
    Location
    Scappoose, Oregon
    Tractor
    Kubota B6200 HST

    Default Re: Property Lines

    I did some further research on this. I looked thru my title report from 2.5 years ago when I purchased my property. Included in this was a copy of a joint maintenance agreement between previous owners of property 2 and property 3. The agreement states that property owner 3 does own real property described. But their ownership is subject to a non-exclusive road easement in favor of property owner 2. It states this easement is a non-improved road upon which property owner 2 can enter onto and exit their property and home. It also states this is the sole means of egress and ingress upon said property. JOint maintenance of this road is also stipulated. The agreement shall be binding upon the parties, personal representatives, successors and assigns. I would assume that this transfers to new ownerships of the properties? Thanks for your help on this matter as I want it to just clear up and get bad blood good again.


  4. #4

    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    569
    Location
    Central Maryland
    Tractor
    Kubota BX 2200

    Default Re: Property Lines

    Ernie is correct about laws varying and the need for local console. Jurisdictions usually recognize that if you use someone's property for some extended period of time, and they witness it, but do nothing, then they forfeit the claim (know as adverse possession).

    When I moved onto my property 12 years ago, not all my corners had surveyors stakes (metal and buried). I immediately paid a bonded surveyor to drop stakes just so that I knew exactly where my property lied. It's relatively cheep insurance to prevent issues arising years down the road.



  5. #5
    Super Star Member Thomas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    14,056
    Location
    Lebanon,NH.
    Tractor
    Kubota L2800HST w/Frontloader & CC LTX1046 & Craftman T2200 lawn mower.

    Default Re: Property Lines

    I let party 2 and 3 settle there dispute,and if you have the deed to your land I check very closely also visit your town office just to make sure there isn't a grandfather cause they may affect you.

    Thomas..NH [img]/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif[/img]

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    610
    Location
    Ontario
    Tractor
    Ford 1710: Loader, Hoe, Snowblower, Box scrapper & 3ph Forks

    Default Re: Property Lines

    We had a survey done for our camp this summer. The survey wasn't related to any disputes or title insurance things. We needed an electrical permit to up grade the service and a health permit to put in a trailer. We couldn't either permit without having fairly definite property lines.

    It seems that 'fairly definite' is about as good as you can get many places. The surveyor was having trouble placing one rear corner, and said some things I found interesting. Quite a bit of survey work in the country can't be reconciled. In our case, the original drawing indicates a surveyor's bar at the rear corner. A later drawing by same surveyor indicates the same corner as having a bore hole. However, nowhere in the field notes does the surveyor say he replaced a stake with a bore hole. We did find something of a bore hole, but not the type a surveyor would ordinarily use.

    So, the surveyor asks us: 'Did anybody ever tell you that hole was the property corner?' 'No,' we said. He said that he couldn't resolve the corner using known points and angles on near-by properties. He said he would be prepared to defend the bore hole because the original surveyor wasn't always orthodox, because his survey information suggested the corner might be further, and because nobody says the bore hole isn't the corner.

    So, I hope you get the idea that a survey is a guarantee of property lines only as long as there is no dispute. In a legal dispute, survey information is only one type of supporting information. The surveyor also said that, here in Ontario, judges usually support community usage over survey information if the two conflict. He said that several neighbours who say that the bore hole was used as the property line would be stronger in court than anything he could do.

    Our camp also contains a piece of an old highway and right of way. Locals use the old highway across our place to get onto the new highway. The only other entrance is under a low railroad bridge at a sharp bend and is very dangerous.

    A new highway access is planned, and we may want to close the old highway since we may have some liability. However, I believe we need to go to court and petition a judge to issue a road closure order. In Ontario, roads that are used to access property can only be closed by judicial order--even if they cross private property. The road to my brother-in-lay's camp goes between somebody's house and barn.

    So, I don't know if the law in your area is similar. Best advice I can think of is avoid legal procedures if possible. If you get into one, they can become very complex and very costly, and in the end, the legal resolution may end up fluke' or whimsical. Getting a local authority (social services or police) to bring in a conflict resolution mediator may be much better than court. On the other hand, if the other parties end up going to court, then probably need your own lawyer to look out for your particular interests.



  7. #7

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    709
    Location
    Saint Hedwig, TX
    Tractor
    TC29D, 8n, 9n

    Default Re: Property Lines

    If the conditions you describe in your second post are part of the Deed of Record, then that's probably it. But, if they really wanted to party #3 could find grounds to contest it. If party #2 can not/will not move the driveway, then really the ball is in #3's court. I have to go along with TomG, it would be best if a mediator could be used. Ater facing each other in a courtroom, seldom to people come away as friends.
    Ernie


  8. #8
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    444
    Location
    Central Arkansas
    Tractor
    Kubota /L2650/ LA450/B4690 -- John Deere 450 Dozer

    Default Re: Property Lines

    The one I have seen here most is the new property owner move in and after about a year start telling the owners around him where the property lines are and what the realy mean. It is always the new one.


  9. #9

    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Posts
    569
    Location
    Central Maryland
    Tractor
    Kubota BX 2200

    Default Re: Property Lines

    An aside. When I was younger, my uncle had approximately 150 acres. One of his boundary lines was delineated by three stone markers, all laid by Mason and Dixon (MD/PA border). Some property markers are just too engrained to ever be disputed. (But then again, there was that NY/NJ flap over Ellis Island [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img].)


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
© 2016 TractorByNet.com. TractorByNet is a registered trademark of IMC Digital Universe, Inc. Other trademarks on this page are the property of their respective owners.