Taking tree down by digging verses cutting?

[Richard]

I'm at work right now and it's slow..... so I'm just meandering this in my head thinking aloud as I type. There is no significant meaning to this post other than conversation. :thumbsup:

My wifes cousin who lives next door, wants to work on his driveway and that means two dead trees need to come down (he cut them down) and unfortunately, a live hickory tree needed to come down.

He also wanted to dig out the rootball so he can put this back into a nice yard and not have to worry about the hole as the roots rot out.

On looking at the hickory, I sort of muttered out loud... "I wonder if instead of cutting it, we could simply dig on one side of it and push it over?" (I own an industrial backhoe/loader)

He left to go do something, was going to return in 10 minutes or so.

A bit curious... I started to dig rather gently. I had never done this before but reasoned that as long as I only dug on ONE side of the stump (near side) the tree should not fall towards me.

Not really trusting that to be foolproof.... I looked at the lean of the tree and fortunately, it was leaning in the same direction I was hoping it would fall (and that I intended to push)

As I was digging I caught myself digging more on what was the right side of the trunk and not quite as much on the left side. Not knowing how the roots were growing, I told myself that if I did not dig evenly, the tree MIGHT have a root on one side that holds tighter and allows the tree to twist in a direction I dont' want it to go.

So, I made sure that I dug on both sides as evenly as I could. I then put the bucket on the tree, (backhoe bucket about 10' UP the tree trunk) and gave a gentle push with the hoe. The tree fought back so I didn't force things.

I dug some more, maybe 1/4 to 1/2 bucketfulls of dirt since I couldn't really get a great bite in the dirt AND I was close enough to the tree so the hoe would be able to engage the tree about 10' up and still have some extension in the arm to push.

After digging a little more, I put the bucket back up to the tree and pushed. The tree bent. Actually, the tree leaned a bit since I noticed the roots moving. I kept that position and applied a little more pressure very slowly. The tree moved a little more and the rootball moved.

It dawned on me that this was in fact going to work and evidently, work fairly easily.

I pushed more but, rather than simply try to blunt push the tree over, I instead kept steady firm pressure on it and added more pressure. I wanted the tree to arc over pretty slowly so it would not, could not "spring back" towards me. I also knew that once I found some magic point in space, the weight of the tree would start to add to my pushing force.

The tree arc'ed over a little more and I kept the pressure on it. Half the reason for this pressure was to help force it over and the other half was to help prevent it from springing back in my direction.

The tree moved over more and started to fall on its own.

It was amazing to me how "gentle" this tree fell over. I've never really been part of a tree falling where there wasn't much of a WHUMP when it hit the ground. This tree, being alive was full of leaves. The canopy brushed into some other trees that I was trying to fall between and it was the brushing of these leaves/branches with each other that helped lay this tree down.

The tree fell exactly where I wanted it to fall.

After it hit the ground, my wifes cousin showed up and mouth was dropped open. He had basically driven to my father in laws house (2 doors down) picked up some tools and returned to this location which is next door.

This whole process probably took under 10 minutes and the root ball was up.

I ended up digging up the root balls of the other tree next to this one and it probably took me near 30 minutes to dig it up.

I don't know if this is considered a lot more safe or a lot more dangerous than dropping a tree with a chainsaw. I personally feel that I had more control of the situation and feel like I was more safe.

Today, now that I can see how easy it was to drop this tree and how well it worked, I wish I had borrowed my brother in laws video camera. It might have been an interesting YouTube video for others to see what I did. (there might already be videos out there showing this, I have no idea)

So, here I am at work right now....kind of slow....this is on my mind and I thought I'd share what I did.

Unfortuately this went SO easy and SO fast, it was over before anyone even thought about getting a camera so there are no pictures nor video of it.

 

[Egon]

Digging out a tree works quite well.

One problem may be branches breaking off and falling down on you or even a part off of the top of the tree.

 

[rekees4300]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/169618-another-man-dies-tractor-accident.html

 

[crusty 1]

when my grandfather imigrated here from Finland he purchased a wooded piece of land that needed to be cleared to make fields and thats about the way he did it minus the hoe.All hand dug,they used the prevailing winds as a means to aid but same as your out come.Those early settlers had to use a great deal smarts and hard work to make things work out and what a good job they did.I,m over 60 and I still listen to these men who worked so long and hard just not many left anymore:droolave

 

[Richard]

Digging out a tree works quite well.

One problem may be branches breaking off and falling down on you or even a part off of the top of the tree.

Worked great. All these years I've been using a chainsaw...

Regarding windowmakers (did I just say window makers?) :confused2:

regarding window drats....did it again

(typing with single fingers now)

regarding widow makers, (sigh) I am always scared of those so tried to scan the tree over.

This was a perfectly healthy tree that was unfortunately, in the way of the wider driveway.

Second, my JCB has a cab and although a steel roof means little when a tree or a large branch might fall on it, it offers a bit more protection than my thick head out there with merely a hardhat on it.

 

[Richard]

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/169618-another-man-dies-tractor-accident.html

Eak...ugly story.

One thing I have only done maybe three or four times was try to push a tree over with my front bucket. Those were trees that were maybe 4-6 inches in diamater, I could almost drive over them without thinking.

When it comes to a bona fide tree, I've always used my hoe. I've always felt (right or wrong) that I have a little more control with the hoe. Additionally, there is less chance of driving the machine on top of the root ball as it pops out of the ground since I'm further away.

Being further away is another reason why I like using the hoe end.

In my case, it does help that the machine has a reach of approximately 21 feet. I can be maybe 10' away from the tree and still have several feet of extension available to me (though as I reflect, I'm probably more like 8 feet away....so I can reach higher on the tree for better leverage but I've never measured)

I might add that historically, I've used my hoe in conjunction with a chainsaw. I cut my wedge. I then cut a thicker hinge when I do a back cut and don't cut as deep as I might. I WANT the hinge to keep the tree up there. (if it falls, then it should fall with my wedge cut)
I will have prepositioned my hoe already ON the tree with machine running so all I have to do is climb in and help force it over.

When the farm was timbered 8 years ago, we had tons of pine trees. HUGE tall pine trees. I told the timber dudes "you can have ALL of my pine trees (which were not part of their deal) as long as you try to minimize damage to my other trees"

These guys ran rough-shod over the farm and really had little regard for anything so on MY property, I was not going to let them kill 80% of everything else for some free trees.

once he heard me say "as long as you don't destroy my other trees" he said he had no interest. These trees were dying because of that Japanese beetle that ravaged many pines.

I decided to take them down myself. I worked my hoe through the woods, taking out what was necessary and trying to otherwise, minimize my footprint through the woods. The above is exactly how I cut these pines down. they WERE in distance of hitting the house had they fallen the wrong way so I had little room for error and that is when I thought about using the hoe to help.

The tree that gave me the most nerves was maybe 20/24" diamater. I wanted no part of it falling towards the house. Set the machine, cut the wedge and as I was pushing it over, discovered I could "influence" it a little bit to the left or right during the EARLY part of the fall. Note that I did not say I could sway it.... During the early part you could tell it wanted to fall a certain direction. I kept the forward pressure on the tree however, moved the hoe bucket to the side just a little bit and you could see the entire tree change direction just a bit.

It helped me save a smaller tree however, I would have wiped them all out had it been necessary to keep the house safe. As it was, this method worked great and that's how I've done it for years. Never thought of simply digging on half of the rootball.

 

[Thomas]

I know of some rope/chain tree than put little strain w/come along than slowly dig.

Years back there was member on TBN digging out trees,well root ball gave him BIG surprise..whew,he came out okay.

 

[scgargoyle]

When they cleared some of my land in SC, they just pushed the trees over with an excavator (BIG hoe!). No digging- just push 'em over. He said it's a lot easier than digging stumps out after a tree is cut. He took out oaks up to 24" in diameter. The pines were actually tougher, since they have a tap root. They tended to snap off rather than uproot.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

We used to pull them over with a dozer with a winch line. Just make sure the cable is long enough It's nice getting the root out, saves a lot of digging later.

 

[Reg]

As I read through the base post I kept thinking there's gonna be an "Aww Sheep" moment, because somewhere at the beginning was mention of dead trees and I thought this was one of them - didn't refer back to check.

Anyway, yes - with a live and healthy tree it can work very well and at least half the root ball removal work is already done. Just be careful when cutting up the trunk that the root ball doesn't plop back into the hole and whip branches at you as the trunk stands up again.

With a dead, diseased, or storm damaged tree - Ya takes yer chances.