jonyyuma
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What kw is this gen-set---My home is only tied to a 1 inch line from the meter.?
Natural Gas Generator
- Thread starter Rat Rod Mac
- Start date
What kw is this gen-set---My home is only tied to a 1 inch line from the meter.?
ultrarunner
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Yes... poor proof reading on my part.
dcyrilc
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kenmac
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Other factors fugure into this. How long the line is run & how many BTU'S. Gas delivered at 2 PSIG or ? inches system
eepete
Platinum Member
On the pro and con list for NG or propane, add that the engines used in these generators are typically gasoline engines. The down side is the exhaust is much hotter with NG or Propane than with gasoline. Propane is the worst, NG is not quite as bad due to the lower energy content of the fuel. It's not uncommon to see the generator manufactures add their own exhaust manifold to a stock engine.
I've retrofitted a generator to my house and to our fire station. The house was propane, the fire station was NG. Common to both projects was the fact that the site and wiring cost were about half of the cost of the project.
Agree with others that a "tote and connect" backup is not too optimal. But if you do that, make sure the area is big enough for something down the road that is in a housing. This lets you spread the cost out over time.
At the fire station, we had to run a new 1" line to the 20 KW generator and put in a new meter. So you'll want to talk with your gas company at some point in the project to see what you need to do. On my propane unit, I ran a 10 PSI from the tank, to a 2 PSI on the generator, and in the generator this is a 3rd regulator close to the carburetor that makes about 7" of water of pressure. The NG unit at the fire station took whatever came from the street on the 1" line, and then had a 7" regulator in the generator. Again, work with your local gas company. They can also do the computations to size the lines for the run length you have. Size this for what you need to run the whole house.
Check with the gas company or local inspections department or your electrician regarding the site of the generator. Most places require you be 20 feet away from a window. Think about noise for both you and your neighbors.
On sizing the unit, you need to either get a clamp-on amp meter and do some measuring with the cover off of your breaker box, pay someone to do that if you are uncomfortable with that, or go by the ratings on the equipment you want to power. Take the amps of the largest compressor device like a heat pump or air conditioner and double the current so you have power to start the compressor. You just need to do this once for the largest device you have.
In any event, you'll need a list of what you power and how much power it takes. Only then can you make a "gotta have/can do without" list. Measurements are better than labels on the devices.
Whether you go whole house or just a few circuits you'll need to figure out the cost of re-wiring up those circuits to some device that is the transfer switch from the generator. I have 45 KW generator. When I made my list up for my all electric house, the resistive electric strips on the heat pumps were killing me. I ended up putting in a panel box before the transfer switch so I could transfer some of the "can do without" items to that panel. I ended up putting 15KW of heat strips and the block heater on that panel.
I also bought more generator because it was cheaper than buying new appliances. The point I'm trying to make here is that you should be sure to calculate the cost of all the wiring you have to do to use a smaller generator and see if you might be able to buy something bigger with that money and get something simpler/lest costly on the wiring side.
So you need to:
1) Make a list of what you have, what it draws, and how crucial it is.
2) Talk to your gas company and find out what it takes to get enough gas for running the whole house on a generator (even if you're just starting out small). You'll also find out if you can even have a "tote and plug" unit or if it has to be a fixed/permanent installation.
3) Figure out what all the wiring cost will be and what the various options are as far as panel before a whole house switch, cheaper "just 6 circuit" manual transfer switch, etc.
4) Plan your outside area to hold something big enough for the whole house (say a 4' by 8' pad) and bring the wiring and gas supply up next to the pad. You don't need to pour the big pad, just have the space available.
Then, the last step in the process is buying the generator and figuring out what wattage you need. While this planing is annoying, it's better than buying generators to see if they work and trying out different wiring and fuel supply options.
Finally, it is difficult to underestimate the level of spousal approval garnered with any automatic system. Even if you put 75% of your $$s into the transfer switch and start out with a small manual pull generator, after the 1st or 2nd outage you can look at a fixed generator. I bought my B21 so I could do my own install of the generator and propane tank. Nuff said there....:thumbsup:
Sorry for long post, lots of details as is typical with any big/fun project.
Pete
I've retrofitted a generator to my house and to our fire station. The house was propane, the fire station was NG. Common to both projects was the fact that the site and wiring cost were about half of the cost of the project.
Agree with others that a "tote and connect" backup is not too optimal. But if you do that, make sure the area is big enough for something down the road that is in a housing. This lets you spread the cost out over time.
At the fire station, we had to run a new 1" line to the 20 KW generator and put in a new meter. So you'll want to talk with your gas company at some point in the project to see what you need to do. On my propane unit, I ran a 10 PSI from the tank, to a 2 PSI on the generator, and in the generator this is a 3rd regulator close to the carburetor that makes about 7" of water of pressure. The NG unit at the fire station took whatever came from the street on the 1" line, and then had a 7" regulator in the generator. Again, work with your local gas company. They can also do the computations to size the lines for the run length you have. Size this for what you need to run the whole house.
Check with the gas company or local inspections department or your electrician regarding the site of the generator. Most places require you be 20 feet away from a window. Think about noise for both you and your neighbors.
On sizing the unit, you need to either get a clamp-on amp meter and do some measuring with the cover off of your breaker box, pay someone to do that if you are uncomfortable with that, or go by the ratings on the equipment you want to power. Take the amps of the largest compressor device like a heat pump or air conditioner and double the current so you have power to start the compressor. You just need to do this once for the largest device you have.
In any event, you'll need a list of what you power and how much power it takes. Only then can you make a "gotta have/can do without" list. Measurements are better than labels on the devices.
Whether you go whole house or just a few circuits you'll need to figure out the cost of re-wiring up those circuits to some device that is the transfer switch from the generator. I have 45 KW generator. When I made my list up for my all electric house, the resistive electric strips on the heat pumps were killing me. I ended up putting in a panel box before the transfer switch so I could transfer some of the "can do without" items to that panel. I ended up putting 15KW of heat strips and the block heater on that panel.
I also bought more generator because it was cheaper than buying new appliances. The point I'm trying to make here is that you should be sure to calculate the cost of all the wiring you have to do to use a smaller generator and see if you might be able to buy something bigger with that money and get something simpler/lest costly on the wiring side.
So you need to:
1) Make a list of what you have, what it draws, and how crucial it is.
2) Talk to your gas company and find out what it takes to get enough gas for running the whole house on a generator (even if you're just starting out small). You'll also find out if you can even have a "tote and plug" unit or if it has to be a fixed/permanent installation.
3) Figure out what all the wiring cost will be and what the various options are as far as panel before a whole house switch, cheaper "just 6 circuit" manual transfer switch, etc.
4) Plan your outside area to hold something big enough for the whole house (say a 4' by 8' pad) and bring the wiring and gas supply up next to the pad. You don't need to pour the big pad, just have the space available.
Then, the last step in the process is buying the generator and figuring out what wattage you need. While this planing is annoying, it's better than buying generators to see if they work and trying out different wiring and fuel supply options.
Finally, it is difficult to underestimate the level of spousal approval garnered with any automatic system. Even if you put 75% of your $$s into the transfer switch and start out with a small manual pull generator, after the 1st or 2nd outage you can look at a fixed generator. I bought my B21 so I could do my own install of the generator and propane tank. Nuff said there....:thumbsup:
Sorry for long post, lots of details as is typical with any big/fun project.
Pete
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dmccarty
Super Star Member
Dang.
I was thinking UltraRunner was really UltraMan in disguise and you just carried home the 5,000 KW genset.
My hero has been cast down.
:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:
Later,
Dan
ultrarunner
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Dang.
I was thinking UltraRunner was really UltraMan in disguise and you just carried home the 5,000 KW genset.
My hero has been cast down.
:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:
Later,
Dan
Brother's Father-In-Law was plant superintendent of a pulp mill that was converted to cardboard recycling... they had a GE power plant on site that size... sold excess power to the grid and did well doing that...
Plant was shut-down 2 years ago and all that is left is the weighmaster shack/scale and a deep water dock... real sad to see it go because it will never come back...
Riggers came in and carted everything off to some foreign land...
hr3
Veteran Member
What size are you looking for and might I ask why you looking for a portable.. You can buy a small 7kw ng for about $1,800 and you don't need to mess around with converting something that wasn't made to run on ng.
Ooo and one thing to remember most kw ratings are given for propane you must read deeper to find out what it will put out on ng. It will be less on ng.
LBrown59
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This would be great, especially if you had free gas; then you could eliminate both elcetric and gas bills.
kenmac
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Most all newer generators are made to be able to convert from 1 gas to the other