Neighbor removed my property line pin

[dodge man]

To Pclausen, I would say this is a case of where adverse possession could happen. Yeah, it doesn't seem fair, but it does happen. Its tough to prove, and not likely to happen in this case, so I wouldn't worry about it too much. I would try and go ahead with the land exchange, it would be the easiest way to take care of it.

I'll kind of talk about my experience with adverse possession. The law varies by state, but it basically allows someone to take your land. Paying taxes on the land, and having color of title usually speeds up this process. Color of title is a case where two people have a deed for the same property, but one is obviously not valid when investigated further. Someone who has occupied land for a certain length of time, can prove this in court can get adverse possession on a parcel of ground. My experience is that this is rare, although there was a recent famous case in Colorado where this happened. I've seen adverse possession used more often than not just to clear up a confused boundary. Say in a case where everybody thinks a fence is a boundary line, but when its surveyed, it turns out not to be. Nobody knew a problem existed, the person wasn't really trying to steal land, but a judge just says "it looks like its adverse possession to me". There are other legal terms that also cover this, such as Acquiescence, Boundary by Estoppal, and Boundary by Practical Location. In most of these cases, its a method of putting the boundary where everyone always thought it was. In Pclausen's case, I think he can prove the fence is not where everyone thought the boundary was, but it more or less is there by accident.

 

[ray66v]

As in many legal disputes, adverse possession would likely come down to who has the best lawyer.

If you have a good lawyer, and file suit first, unless they have money, and want the fight, they will probably just give in.

 

[ray66v]

Trading frontage for back and may work to the OP's advantage for property taxes. I know it would here. The taxes are high on the "first acre" that fronts on a road the way our lots are assessed for taxes. They basically multiply the frontage by some number, and that becomes the value of the first acre. What's behind that is based on actual land value. Swampy land with standing water is $100/acre for example.

Sure, you can also take a cut in pay, to reduce your taxes.

 

[Jstpssng]

As in many legal disputes, adverse possession would likely come down to who has the best lawyer.

If you have a good lawyer, and file suit first, unless they have money, and want the fight, they will probably just give in.

As I said before, other criteria would need to be met; the first being her desire to fight for it. I really didn't want to turn this into a big issue, just thought he should be aware of it.

To put in perspective; this is less than 1/10th of an acre... "or about 1/20th of the size of a football field".

 

[dave1949]

Sure, you can also take a cut in pay, to reduce your taxes.

I don't get the comparison. If the OP wants to raise trees and having the frontage is of no real value to him, then here at least, he would pay less taxes on non-frontage acreage than on frontage in a land swap. He gets a pay raise is more accurate.

Frontage comes with other "hazards." Sometimes you will pay more for water and sewer lines if they get extended to your area, you get to pick up more road trash too.

 

[ray66v]

I don't get the comparison. If the OP wants to raise trees and having the frontage is of no real value to him, then here at least, he would pay less taxes on non-frontage acreage than on frontage in a land swap. He gets a pay raise is more accurate.

Frontage comes with other "hazards." Sometimes you will pay more for water and sewer lines if they get extended to your area, you get to pick up more road trash too.

Owning property comes with "hazards".

You example is a false choice. Yes, he gets a trivial reduction in costs now, but his property is declines in value.

He bought and paid for frontage.

Frontage is worth more money.

I can also name reasons why it is not to your advantage. You could lose money when you sell it, and potentially other things, like what if that frontage is needed to meet minimum frontage requirements for buildable lots in the future? What about money from easements?

 

[dmccarty]

PClausen,

Don't even think about cutting her trees. In NC that is a criminal offense I would be shocked if your state is not the same.

If you are very sure of the pins, I would talk to a lawyer to get their opinion on the situation. The lawyer is not to sue the lady but to see what the law says about such a situation. I doubt the lawyer will charge you. If the pins are in doubt then you have to deal with the cost of a survey. A land swap seems reasonable to me but it require some paperwork to change the deeds. The lawyer and/or the deed office can tell you what is required.

Later,
Dan

 

[Robert_in_NY]

PClausen,

Don't even think about cutting her trees. In NC that is a criminal offense I would be shocked if your state is not the same.

If you are very sure of the pins, I would talk to a lawyer to get their opinion on the situation. The lawyer is not to sue the lady but to see what the law says about such a situation. I doubt the lawyer will charge you. If the pins are in doubt then you have to deal with the cost of a survey. A land swap seems reasonable to me but it require some paperwork to change the deeds. The lawyer and/or the deed office can tell you what is required.

Later,
Dan

I have talked to a few lawyers for different situations and most of them go over the issue with me via phone and if it is something they can help with they schedule an appointment, they usually go out of their way to give me the knowledge I needed to make a decision and never have I been charged for the initial conversation. The one lawyer could have made a lot of money off of me but he knew there was a good chance I would win the case but come out money in the hole because of the legal expenses. Gave me the option and all the information and I appreciated it. I have a lot of respect for him and would use him if I ever had a reason to. There are a few others though that I would never use.

So in short I agree, call a lawyer and ask him/her how they would advise you to proceed.

 

[pclausen]

Appreciate all the great advice guys. I'll consult a lawyer. I'm not really worried about loosing a little road frontage as I got plenty of it. Here's a zoomed out view of my lots (1 and 2) and her lot (86E).

My improvements (house and shop) are both on lot 2 even though my personal property tax shows the county thinks my shop is on lot 1. I never bothered to get them to correct that, but maybe I should get that taken care of as well while I'm at it? I own lot 1 free and clear but have a mortgage on lot 2 with the house (and shop) on it.

Since this sat image was taken in 2007, I have cleared the pine stand between my shop and her house, which is when I discovered the issue with her fence being on my property.

 

[Gator6x4]

Adverse Possession may be a moot question in the State of VA. What ever happened to 8.01-218.1 Adverse possession abolished.

No action or defense shall lie or be maintained in the Commonwealth for adverse possession upon which the action or defense arose on or after July 1, 2010.

Richmond Sunlight ｻ SB67: Adverse possession; abolition.

VA was trying to join Washington State and abolish "Adverse Possession".