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  1. #1
    Silver Member
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    Nov 2000
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    CA, Placer County
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    1999 Kubota L4310 HST 4WD, R4 Tires, Folding ROPS, Kubota Canopy

    Default Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements


    Need some advice on how thick should asphalt or concrete driveways be constructed to allow a LARGE double dump transfer truck to pass without tearing up the roadbed. Here is the plan: I need to put in about ~800 of driveway. The plan is the first 300 will be concrete and the final 500 will be asphalt. My neighbor has 3 of road base and 1.5 of asphalt and he no longer needs to steer his car once he is on his driveway. On a hot day last summer a large truck drove down to his house (per his insistence) and left a nice 2 deep furrow the length of his driveway. I have a trusted contractor. This is the third house he has built for me, but he is not experience in the problems associated with heavy trucks.

    First the asphalt: This driveway extends from the main house to the barn. The driveway contractor tells me that 6 of road base covered by 3 of asphalt is more than enough to carry a double transfer truckload of rock without a worry. (25tons of rock plus whatever the truck weighs, my guess is 20,000lbs). I would appreciate some coaching from anybody who might have any experience with this?

    Second the concrete: Part of the loop driveway in front of the house needs to be able to carry the same trucks so they can get the asphalt drive that extends down to the barn. Right now the plan is for 4 road base and 4 of fiber reinforced, 5-bag mix concrete. The driveway contractor says when you use the fiber mix, there is no need for steel in the concrete. I am leery of not having steel in the concrete. Again, I would appreciate some coaching from anybody who might have any experience with this?

    Thanks in advance,
    -Roger



  2. #2
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Texas

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    Roger, I don't think I know enough to help you much, but I was a project manager several years ago on the construction of a police auto pound (15 acres of asphalt) and we used 6" of asphalt on a "lime stabilized" base to handle trucks and wreckers of all sizes. It was applied in two 3" layers. That generally worked well, but we had a couple of small spots where the contractor failed to properly stabilize the base. So I think the base under the asphalt is perhaps as important, or more important, than the thickness of the asphalt itself. The "experts" told me that 4" of concrete or 6" of asphalt was the way to go. At that time, it was cheaper to go with the asphalt. Then a couple of years later, we doubled the size of the auto pound, and by that time concrete was cheaper than asphalt, so one half is 6" asphalt, the other 4" of concrete. I have no idea how they'd compare today.

    Bird

  3. #3
    Veteran Member gerard's Avatar
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    Syracuse NY
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    Kubota L2500DT w/FEL

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    As Bird I'm no expert here but when I had my house driveway done they used a backhoe and took out 8-10 inches and replaced it with crusher run base. (This was by far the most expensive bid but I wanted it to last and I didn't regret the decision). Only after that was compacted then they put down the asphalt binder and let that settle for a year. The following year they come back and put on the top coat which is finer and is mainly for that nice smooth look but really doesn't support anything in and of itself. 4 inches of base seems a little thin and if you don't have a solid base what the top is made of isn't going to matter much. You could also consider a geo textile underlayment which would help considerably. (It's standard in current roadbuilding). If you only need to have all this truck traffic until your house is done I'd hold off on the topcoat until the heavy traffic is done, then put on the top coat. That way all the truck traffic will actually help compact the sub base and when you top coat it will fill the valley caused by the truck tires and give you a nice level surface. Sorry, can't help you on the concrete.


  4. #4
    Veteran Member gerard's Avatar
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    Syracuse NY
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    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    If you go to this site you'll find a lot of good info on roadbuilding etc. It's a military site.

    http://www.adtdl.army.mil/cgi-bin/at.../5-436/toc.htm


  5. #5
    Gold Member
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    Apr 2000
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    northern calif.
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    JD-970

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    I am wondering if the board can help me with me with a problem I am having with my barns asphalt floor. I should have poured a concrete (cost twice as much) instead of asphalt floor but just couldn't afford it at the time. Well, the asphalt is just to soft and gets dinged up easily when working on it. Also, I would like to put some implements on dollys to make for easier storage. Question is, is there some kind of surface sealer (epoxy?) that can give the asphalt a slightly harder face then it has now???
    I would be very greatfull for any advice you folks can give me on this.

    thanks again,
    george


  6. #6
    Veteran Member
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    Jan 2001
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    San Francisco Bay Area California (CA)
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    Kubota B7500

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    <font color=blue>is, is there some kind of surface sealer (epoxy?) that can give the asphalt a slightly harder face then it has now???
    </font color=blue>

    I don't know about a sealer, but if you want to keep the asphalt, you may want to look into something called "Petro-Mat". It's a geo-textile specifically for reinforcing asphalt surfaces. Where ever it's sold, they will give you an equivalence for each layer of Petro-mat = so many inches of asphalt.

    The GlueGuy

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Jul 2000
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    Alabama
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    JD 2240 2wd, (50 pto hp)

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    I've been responsible for some paving projects at my workplace and can tell you what we've done. These paving projects were drawn up by some civil/structural engineer in another state. First, strip the the topsoil off (about 8" around here). Compact the soil with a vibratory or sheeps foot roller compactor. Add about 6" of 'crusher run' crushed limestone and compact that very well. Apply a tack coat (hot asphalt like substance that is sprayed onto the crushed stone. Put down 2" of 'Base' asphalt (which has larger rocks mixed into the asphalt than the finish coat). Compact this 'base' with a roller compactor, and then add 1" of 'finish' asphalt paving and compact. Now you're finished, and this will hold up to heavy trucks such as you described.

    Good luck and get your checkbook ready!
    Boots


  8. #8
    Veteran Member
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    russellville, arkansas
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    Kubota M4900, B7510 and RTV

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    good luck; one of the locations i work at has had the driveway completely redone at least 4 times in the last 6-10 years. they have @10 buses a day on the drive, in june, july and august; and the ruts get pretty deep. of course each time its redone, its the "answer to the problem" till the next hot summer. i doubt you'll have that kind of traffic, so i'm sure it will work out better for you..let us all know how it turns out, i've got 500 ft i'd like to pave too..
    almost forgot, i have seen folks put dry cement on top of asphalt, i think to help it resist gas an oil, but supposedly to make it more stable an a little harder; they just broadcast the stuff by hand.
    heehaw


  9. #9

    Join Date
    Aug 2000
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    Texas
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    my 18 horse Sears doesn't even count as a tractor

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    A good base is key to a well performing top. How you prepare the base depends upon the type of soil you have. A clay soil holds water and really shrinks when it dries out. That is why lime is added to the soil to reduce the expansion and contractions. If you have a sandy soil, they support loads well until they dry out and then they just mush out under the tire loads. Many people stabilize sandy soils by adding cement which combines with the sand to become more firm no matter what the moisture content.
    If you have a soil that stays wet most of the year and water works it way to the surface under wheel loads then you may wish to consider one of the geotechtic fiber mats to keep the road base in place and allow water to drain through it. In general the thicker and more well compacted the base the better the top surface will perform whether that is asphalt or concrete. If you elect to use concrete as a minimum I would add a wire mesh for reinforcement, with very expansive clays reinforcing bars will be necessary. Good luck.

    Randy


  10. #10
    Silver Member
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    Feb 2001
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    Central Pa.
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    96 KUBOTA L2350

    Default Re: Asphalt/Concrete Driveway Requirements

    R. Malkey
    This is going to be long-winded. Let's see if I can shed a little light on this for ya. I've been delivering concrete for the last 10yrs. First off, you need a very good contractor you can trust. If you go with fiber, you know it's all thru the concrete when it's delivered. If you go with the wire mesh or rebar that's ok too. But most of the time or 90% of the time the contractors don't pick the rebar up or wire mesh so that it is in the middle of the concrete. And they let it lay on the bottom where it doesn't do any good at all!!! I SEE THIS ALL THE TIME!!! [img]/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif[/img][img]/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif[/img] We don't do by 3-4-5-6 bag mixes anymore. It's 2500-3000-3500-4000-5000psi, and then there's Penn Dot Class A-AA-AAA State Highway mixes!!! If you want to get a tech. to take cylinders that way you know what you got. It takes 28 days for the moisture to evaporate out of the concrete for a good cure. If you live in the freeze/ thaw climates and you throw salt on it to melt the ice, the salt will melt the ice but as it does, this warms the concrete and the melting ice absorbs into the concrete and freezes again. Then it does what we call popping the top off. And in the springtime, you will have a patch where it's all rough and crumbly. That's where a very good sealer comes in when your pouring the concrete. And if your doing a big section, it should have expansion joints cut in it! Myself, I wouldn't go anything less than 6" of concrete and make sure the sub-base is a good one whether your going with crete or asphalt! I have a 36 X 48 garage and I went with fiber for the floor. It has some small hairline cracks in it. I have around 70 yds poured on my parking lot between my house & my garage! I am 3/4 of the way to the house with it. It's all 5-6" thick around both sides & in back of my garage. I bring my truck home from work time to time. It weighs around 16 ton empty. I park on the concrete, turn around on it & it hasn't broke-up yet. This is a little more than 2 cents worth, I'll call it a nickels worth. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img][img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img] As for asphalt, its great for around here because the winter months when the sun comes out and you have snowplowed it off, the little bit that's left will melt off & dry up, looking like new again. I have a B-law who has a big driveway & parking lot too at his house. The contractor put down 5" of course asphalt & then 3" of top-coat asphalt & within 2 yrs, you could see where he parked the vehicles all the time.

    PS What I meant by picking the wire mesh up & rebar, anybody that has replaced their sidewalk or driveways that had wire in the concrete, the wire was laying totally on the bottom. Right! Right!

    Camshaft in Pa


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