Retrofitting a chimney with double-wall wood stove pipe

[beowulf]

We have an insert in our fireplace. It is one with a glass door, a fan (we put on a rheostat control), and is all sealed up neatly into the fireplace opening. We burn wood maybe a maximum of 30-40 days a year - sometimes much less than that depending on the weather. We live on 90 acres so have a never ending supply of wood stacked in a shed and sometimes burn wood left over from ranch projects.

We have had a chimney sweep guy clean it perhaps 3 times over 20 years - then the guy disappeared - perhaps he is stuck in a chimney somewhere.

I am concerned about creosote build up and a risk of fire. I am considering retrofitting it all with a double wall metal pipe. I think the opening on the top of the insert is 6 to 8 inches. From the top of the insert to the top of the chimney is, I estimate, about 20'. I think I could drop the pipe from the top down and have it rest on the opening. Once this is done, I should be able to clean the pipe myself with the correct diameter brush and extension handles for that - the debris would hopefully fall into the insert and then could be removed from there.

The problems I see are: 1) removing the damper (I have no idea what that will involve but I don't think it will be a lot of fun), and 2) trying to drop in the new pipe and have it line up with the insert - there will be no ability to do much other than drop it in using a trouble light inside the pipe to try to line it up - as once the insert is into the fireplace opening it is totally sealed up. Thee is also the issue of attaching the several sections of the pipe - one by one - without dropping them down the chimney. I think I can manage that with some help - and a home-built clamp of some kind. I would also have to match up the lengths of the pipe sections to have it finish up even with the top of the chimney - will have a spark arrester cover there. I know this will not be easy and I will run into problems I have not thought of.

Anyway, my question is how doable is this? Are there easier ways or options I have not considered? and what am I in for in removing the damper? All help is appreciated.

 

[LittleBill21]

you really don't need double wall inside a chimney , is there a reason your not using a flexible stainless insert? its certainly cheaper

 

[beowulf]

you really don't need double wall inside a chimney , is there a reason your not using a flexible stainless insert? its certainly cheaper

LittleBill21. Thanks for responding. No reason for not using a flexible stainless insert - just don't have enough knowledge about this yet - at the brainstorming stage. Good to know that don't need a double wall. I will check out a stainless flexible insert. Would I need to remove the damper to use that? Installed from top down but any issue trying to get it connected to top of insert (or resting on it)?

 

[/pine]

What size and material is the original flue? was the flue replaced when the insert was installed?

 

[turnkey4099]

LittleBill21. Thanks for responding. No reason for not using a flexible stainless insert - just don't have enough knowledge about this yet - at the brainstorming stage. Good to know that don't need a double wall. I will check out a stainless flexible insert. Would I need to remove the damper to use that? Installed from top down but any issue trying to get it connected to top of insert (or resting on it)?

You have identified the major problem - connected the liner with the insert. Talk to a good HVAC business or a one selling stoves. They will have the expertise. I had mine relined. Yes it is expensive but not a real bank breaker.

 

[beowulf]

What size and material is the original flue? was the flue replaced when the insert was installed?

The fireplace was used as a fireplace by the former owners - they had a glass cover of sorts covering the opening. We took that off and put in a wood burning insert - basically a completely closed box with a glass door and fan, which fit into the opening. The lip around that box butted against the brick/rock fireplace face and we sealed that off with special fireplace sealer.

If I understand this correctly, there is no flue to speak of. Just the chimney with a damper which we leave open. The fireplace wood burning insert has a circular opening on its top, with a raised thick lip which I think is about 1-2" high and perhaps 6-8 inches in diameter. I have not really seen that for a very long time. The last time it was pulled out was when we had the chimney sweep clean the chimney. He pulled it out, cleaned the chimney, vacuumed everything out and then pushed it back in and resealed it. So, now, smoke from the insert just goes out the opening on top and up and out of the chimney.

 

[kcflhrc]

I want to do this also. The problem I see too is removing the damper since it sits at the front of the fireplace basically. How to you make that turn without completely removing the damper?

 

[beowulf]

You have identified the major problem - connected the liner with the insert. Talk to a good HVAC business or a one selling stoves. They will have the expertise. I had mine relined. Yes it is expensive but not a real bank breaker.

Thanks turnkey. I will check with an HVAC business. We live up in the foothills, and from time to time, I am surprised to find that there are people up here that do all sorts of things. I will ask the guys at the local hardware store/lumber mill - they may know of someone local - if not I will see what I can find. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[fishheadbob]

I think you need a better idea of what is currently in your chimney. If it is already lined, like maybe a clay tile, you're already good. If no pictures, especially from on top it's hard to tell what's in there. If it's only one layer of brick you should go with an appropriate chimney. I live in a 180 year old house; the oldest chimney isn't lined. When our woodburner was on that chimney I cleaned it every 2 cords or so as I was terrified of a chimney fire, but looking at beams and joists there had never been any fire.
I'd follow up on your idea about finding a country guy who knows about that sort of stuff. I'm also thinking that if you get the wrong HVAC person he's going to scare the poop out of you to sell and install an expensive pipe system whether you need it or not. That's after he drops a camera down to tell you everything you have is shot; who knows, if you have anything, maybe it's shot, maybe it's great. Maybe another chimney sweep can give you a good answer on what you have after cleaning and inspecting.
Cleaning a 20 foot chimney is pretty easy. 3 eight foot rods and the right size brush should allow for some change from $100.

 

[Gunny]

I installed a single wall stainless liner in my two story chimney, piece of cake (But I didn't have a damper to contend with, it had already been removed). I pulled the liner up the chimney with the wife helping guide it downstairs. After I got it up to the top, I used a couple of half hitches in the rope to keep the liner from falling back down, then I attached the liner to the chimney cap with stainless sheet metal screws and some kind of high heat cement. Glued the chimney cap down to the chimney and carried my tools off the roof, everything else was done inside the house. I'd bet I wasn't on top of the house for more than 30 minutes after I dropped the rope down the chimney and started the process.
It did get a bit messy inside the house where the liner knocked a lot of soot, creosote and stuff from the bricks during the pulling process. Got all my stuff online