spray insulation

[EddieWalker]

Check with the manufacturer of the building before using foam. The ones that I know of will void their warrantee if you use open cell because it traps and holds moisture, which results in accelerated rusting of the metal. Closed cell is usually good because it does not allow moisture into it. Which is also why closed cell is used for dock floats. Cost for closed cell is a lot more the open cell, and it's harder to apply, so you have to be careful of insulation companies that try to push open cell over closed cell. You also get a higher R value with closed cell for the same thickness as open cell.

For a lot less money, I've considered installing metal siding on the ceiling of my shop because my trusses are four feet apart. The metal will easily span that and not sag over time. Then blowing in 2 feet of Attic Cat insulation up there, and then using fiberglass bats in the walls. I did this with my parents garage and the results have been significant. No source of heat or cooling in there, and three garage doors that are also insulated, and in the worse heat of the day, it's still nice in there.

 

[Dadnatron]

Where does the high cost come from? Is it that difficult of a molecule to synthesize so the actual chemical the company purchases is expensive to him? Or is is just a basic industry standard price? Its not the 'new thing' anymore, so I would have thought costs/prices would have come down substantially. Is it just that it has become the 'gold standard' and therefore is priced out as a premium product?

I'm not trying to 'take away' anyone's income, but I do want to know where the price is coming from prior to decisions.

 

[gsganzer]

Where does the high cost come from? Is it that difficult of a molecule to synthesize so the actual chemical the company purchases is expensive to him? Or is is just a basic industry standard price? Its not the 'new thing' anymore, so I would have thought costs/prices would have come down substantially. Is it just that it has become the 'gold standard' and therefore is priced out as a premium product?

I'm not trying to 'take away' anyone's income, but I do want to know where the price is coming from prior to decisions.

I think the cost comes from the need for some pretty specialized equipment. Heated lines, pumps etc. I'll watch them do mine later today (if the storms don't make us reschedule) and tell you more after I've watched the process.

 

[ovrszd]

I think the cost comes from the need for some pretty specialized equipment. Heated lines, pumps etc. I'll watch them do mine later today (if the storms don't make us reschedule) and tell you more after I've watched the process.

I would greatly appreciate your opinions after watching the process.

I don't think there's any debate about the efficiency of this type.

I also appreciate comments in regards to R-value. Otherwise it's pretty hard to put logical thought to cost comparisons.

 

[gsganzer]

I've also been told that UV light will break down the foam. So in walls, crawl spaces etc, you're fine, for areas that might get some light (inside of a shop or other areas where it's left exposed), they recommend painting it with a cheap latex paint.

Bottom line, the time to insulate a metal shop is when you put it up, using reinforced vinyl faced fiberglass insulation. If there's concern that it'll get damaged (critters, birds, wind) or the seams could come loose and drape, add a layer of chicken wire.

 

[ovrszd]

I've also been told that UV light will break down the foam. So in walls, crawl spaces etc, you're fine, for areas that might get some light (inside of a shop or other areas where it's left exposed), they recommend painting it with a cheap latex paint.

Bottom line, the time to insulate a metal shop is when you put it up, using reinforced vinyl faced fiberglass insulation. If there's concern that it'll get damaged (critters, birds, wind) or the seams could come loose and drape, add a layer of chicken wire.

I've heard of using a thin layer when building, then spray insulation to get the R-value you desire. Idea being it reduces the chances of rusty metal and makes it very easy to replace a panel if it gets damaged.

 

[gsganzer]

For a lot less money, I've considered installing metal siding on the ceiling of my shop because my trusses are four feet apart. The metal will easily span that and not sag over time. Then blowing in 2 feet of Attic Cat insulation up there, and then using fiberglass bats in the walls. I did this with my parents garage and the results have been significant. No source of heat or cooling in there, and three garage doors that are also insulated, and in the worse heat of the day, it's still nice in there.

Eddie,
I did my in-law apartment that way. I used the old corrugated roof metal that was originally on my shop roof as the flat ceiling to the apartment. I then used 6" (or maybe it was 9") vinyl faced rolls that came 6' wide to insulate the ceiling. I only did a single layer, because the shop sloped roof is also insulated. I put purlins every 2' to support the metal ceiling, but I could have gotten away with purlins every 4'. Actually, when I put the ceiling up, I was running low on screws and only fastened to every-other purlin, figuring I'd screw the others in at a later date. It's been up for over 6 years now and I only noticed the other week that I never went back and added the other fasteners!

On my install, I needed a good way to make a seal between the ceiling and wall. What I did was use roof flashing and then sprayed foam on the top side where the flashing and ceiling meet to seal the edges.

I've attached a photo.

 

[gsganzer]

Well, They had to postpone my spray foam to next week. We're having huge rains and between tracking mud throughout my house and the humidity, we decided to do it another time. Foam application is really particular to the temp and humidity.

While I was talking to the guy, I asked whey it's so expensive. He said it's driven by the cost of the specialty equipment, the cost of the product itself (the binary agents) and the short shelf-life of the binary agents. When they buy a 55 gallon drum, it's only good for 3 months.

 

[ovrszd]

Well, They had to postpone my spray foam to next week. We're having huge rains and between tracking mud throughout my house and the humidity, we decided to do it another time. Foam application is really particular to the temp and humidity.

While I was talking to the guy, I asked whey it's so expensive. He said it's driven by the cost of the specialty equipment, the cost of the product itself (the binary agents) and the short shelf-life of the binary agents. When they buy a 55 gallon drum, it's only good for 3 months.

Thanks for the explanation. Makes perfect sense to me.

 

[Wood_Butcher_Dav]

I paid $5k for the spray foam in my garage, Closed cell 4 inches in ceiling and 1 inch on walls. I have 6 inch walls, so added fiberglass bats over the foam to fill wall cavity.

The garage is 28X40

Dave