Is there any science behind pucker factor?

   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #111  
patrick_g said:
MossRoad, I do know, THAT FEELING. I recall my first ride in a private plane. I was 5 and got to take the controls for a while. Controlling the plane was "nice" but looking down at the little miniature model railroad size steam engine puffing and pulling its train of cars and the little model houses and roads and cars and ...

Well, I don't have to tell you, you have been there and done that.

I like to sightsee and have flown low over the Grand Canyon before it was made illegal, I have chased wild pigs into the surf at an unspecified off shore California island, and released balloons so my buddy and I could compete to see who could find and break the most with the prop. I have dropped water balloons and found getting close to a target without a bomb sight is extremely difficult.

Pat

That sounds fun. :)
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #112  
MossRoad said:
That sounds fun. :)

It was fun but let me swerve over in the direction of PUCKER FACTOR.

The bombing and balloon breaking companion was the pres of Volar Inc, DBA Golden State Aviation and he was the chief instrument pilot at their FBO/FFA flight school. Once while flying on an IFR (Instrument Flight Rules) flight plan from Long Beach to San Diego we were in the clouds with near 0-0 visibility at about 8500 feet. We took turns flying the plane and when straight, level, on altitude and course the other guy would switch off all instrument and other lighting except the external nav lights (red, green, and white) and would use a stop watch to see how long the pilot in command could keep from losing it. No matter how good you are you have to have a reference because your inner ear and stomach lie to you about what is happening. You may think you are climbing to the right and be diving to the left.

We listened for the tell tale signs of trouble like the RPM running up (because you are in a dive) or the slipstream noise getting quieter and the controls getting soft as your speed dies away in a climb (as you approach a stall.) We then stop the timer, turn on the instrument lights and recover from whatever unusual attitude we had gotten into. Flying truly blind has some serious Pucker factor with a capitol P. Of course you always carry flashlights when night flying for just in case you lose instrument lighting so we were not in real danger as we were both good on instruments. Still, there is considerable pucker factor playing that game.

We had forgotten that our altitude encoding transponder would rat us out and it wasn't long before ATC (Air Traffic Control) called us on the VHF radio and told us they had PIREPS (Pilot Reports) indicating clear on top above 9000 and offered to amend our flight plan. Apparently they noticed our wild altitude swings and assumed we were incompetent and might fare better above the clouds, in the clear. We declined, and literally straightened up and flyed right. Well, actually we turned on the landing lights and tried a few more instrument light off episodes. They helped a bit but not much and then we straightened up and flew right.

Another pucker factor inducing exercise is to put on the hood (like a hat with a big bill that prevents you from seeing outside the aircraft so you can fly solely by reference to the instruments) and then have your safety pilot talk you down to a landing, simulating a GCA (Ground Controlled Approach.) I could never get my buddy within 50 ft of the ground without him ripping off the hood so he could see. Another Pucker with a capitol P exercise.

Pat
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #113  
patrick_g said:
... Apparently they noticed our wild altitude swings and assumed we were incompetent ...

Ha! At least they were paying attention to you. :) I've been in the back seat while guys were instrument training with hoods before. It is an eye opener, for sure. You have no references other than your instruments... you have to believe them or you die, and even then, if they are off or the signal they are referencing is off, you still die.

I worked with a pilot that died along with his copilot following their instruments right into the side of a mountain in Pennsylvania. Apparently, the electronic signal from something that was guiding them in to land was off and they followed that signal right into the dirt. Very sad, but at least his reputation was in tact when the invesigation was over. One of the few times it wasn't chalked up to pilot error.:(

I knew another couple guys that flew out of Miegs (sp?) in Chicago coming back this direction. They didn't want to file an instument plan on an overcast night and attempted to "scud run" under the low clouds over Lake Michigan. They kept going lower and lower trying to get under the clouds and for some reason didn't notice the lake. They crashed. It took them a few days to find the plane on the bottom of the lake. The sad thing is, when they found the plane, the door was open and the flotation devices were missing. Apparently they had survived the crash, but died of exposure. They found the bodies over the next few months when they washed up on shore.:(
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #114  
Moss, The last flying club I was in was a part of Golden State Aviation (yeah the guy who did crazy stunts with me.) When I joined they had had no major accidents nor any fatalities. One Thanksgiving we flew out to Bull Head City, AZ and the weather went sour faster than forecast for our return so I sat the plane down at Borrego Springs County A/P and called in for an instrument rated pilot and full panel aircraft. The plane we were in was not certified for instrument flight. My wife just couldn't understand why I did that. Why couldn't we just go on home since we were so close? There was no shortage of volunteers to come get us since it meant free instrument hours for someone so my buddy picked a competent IFR rated pilot and sent him out over the mountains to pick us up. By the time we broke out at our field to land, never having seen any of the mountains we flew over, my wife had changed her tune and thought I was one smart cookie. That same day a low time non-IFR pilot just recently licensed caught a case of get-home-itis and thought since he was very familiar with the mountain passes he'd try to sneak back under the clouds. They found the wreckage DFing his EPIRB (Emergency Position Indicating Radio Beacon) which has a G-shock switch on it to turn it on if you crash (or make a hard landing.)

The first major accident/fatality for Golden State. Sometimes you need experience to develop a feel for pucker factor.

Pucker factor kept me from pressing on. Could I have made it? Most likely BUT... if I just happened to lose a vital instrument with no backup then things would deteriorate quite quickly from no sweat to oh ****. The last thing that might have have passed through my mind would have been the tail of the aircraft as I collided with some of those clouds known as cumulus granite.

The only airline flight I was ever on which aborted accelerated down the runway, lifted the nose to take off, lowered the nose, chopped power, got on the brakes and taxied back to get a replacement HSI (Horizontal Situation Indicator.) One of the co-pilot's jobs is to monitor the gyros at rotation as you can't tell if they are working until you change the attitude of the plane. There was a bit of puckeer factor there too but noting I could do about it.

Pat
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #115  
I also remember one misty evening a Cherokee 140 ( I think) came in and I parked him. There was a man, woman and two kids inside. The wife comes out crying with the kids crying and asks for the restroom. I point her to the office. The guy gets out white as a ghost and asks us to call him a cab and tie down the plane for the night. I get them the cab and get his information and they leave. I go back out to tie the plane down and as I walk around the nose to the left wing, I see pine branches sticking out of the leading edge. I called the FAA and they came out and chained the prop.

A few days later they come back and tell me the guy tried to sneak under the low clouds to an aiport about 25 miles south of us that had no instrument landing systems. "You know those big pines at the end of 27 down there?" the FAA guy asks me. YIKES!!! :eek:
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #116  
MossRoad said:
"You know those big pines at the end of 27 down there?" the FAA guy asks me. YIKES!!! :eek:

Reminds me of a time when I had 6 persons on board, fuel to the tabs plus luggage, and we are at Grand Canyon Intl (a high altitude field.) I did the calcs and did them again and since it was a mid morning takeoff I expected at least better than average performance calculated, a little extra safety margin. The Cherokee Six had the requisite performance and got off nicely (it was a real truck.) I hung there in ground effect on purpose to let speed build before establishing a positive rate of climb. At that time the overrun at Grand Canyon was a swath cut through a pine forest with the stumps intact. Interesting view, zipping along way lower than the tree tops in a narrow cut looking at the big stumps.

I established a climb but was unimpressed with the rate and fiddled with the manifold pressure and RPM to optimize the rate of climb. An hour later I was still optimizing. We made a safe altitude but as the ambient temp rose at times the best rate of climb was negative for a brief period. Fuel burn lightened the load and helped compensate for rising temps.

I personally prefer a dawn takeoff in these conditions for smooth air before the heavier turbulence starts and enhanced performance with lower temps but my SIL had husband prospect #2 along and he didn't like the inconvenience of getting up early.

I didn't alarm anyone but my Pucker Meter got into the yellow zone a couple times, not into the red but high enough to demand attention.

Pat
 
   / Is there any science behind pucker factor? #118  
Paul, That was precious, especially the surprise ending.

What a great location for a DIY coin op crane!

Pat
 
 
Top