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  1. #161
    Elite Member Redneck in training's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
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    4,098
    Location
    South Central Iowa
    Tractor
    TYM 330 HST with FEL

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    I learned the weight distribution right after I bought my first tractor. The tractor had seeping sight glass on the transmission. The dealer gave new improved one and told me to park the tractor nose down on a slope so there will not be oil visible in the sight poke it out press new one in.
    So I unhitched my box blade to get better access to it and drove to the near slope. Once the rear wheels reached the edge of the slope the tractor gained speed and I was on the bottom of the slope in big hurry, made a half doughnut, balanced on two wheels for a second and fortunately settled on all four.
    The rear wheels had no traction and were just sliding down and I had front wheel drive disengaged. Now I made it a rule when the FEL is on BB is on too and front wheel drive engaged. I will add more weight to the BB in near future to make it engage ground more agressively and put more weight on rear wheel to lessen stress on the front drive.

  2. #162
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    1,147
    Location
    Mass, Northshore, Merrimack Valley
    Tractor
    B6100DT

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by rd_macgregor View Post


    I wonder if DU would be cheaper than tungsten, since it (DU) is almost 99% the density of tungsten? Plus, you'd be helping the nuclear power industry get rid of bothersome waste (and, if you got the really fresh stuff, you wouldn't need backup lights on your tractor!).


    BOB

    You would think so, but no (at least not to civilions). I'd checked into that too some years back when researching tungsten for weights (as an alternative to lead).


    .
    Dan C.
    B6100DT, FEL, BH

  3. #163
    Epic Contributor RoyJackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    21,737
    Location
    Bethel, Vermont
    Tractor
    John Deere 4520 MFWD, Deere 855D UTV, Z920A Zero Turn Mower and assorted implements

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by Redneck in training View Post
    When you lift the rear wheels off the ground the tractor will turn sideways only to the stop restricting front axle motion.
    Not necessarily, especially if you're on uneven ground or a slight slope. Better safe (rear ballast) then sorry...
    Roy Jackson

    "There ain't no such thing as a free lunch..."

  4. #164
    Veteran Member The Haymaker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
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    1,297
    Location
    Benton, Maine
    Tractor
    2008 T2220

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by RoyJackson View Post
    Not necessarily, especially if you're on uneven ground or a slight slope. Better safe (rear ballast) then sorry...
    Actually did this tonight. Wouldn't intend on doing it often but was moving an old C-band satellite dish, post, and concrete base I had just ripped from the ground. Wasn't super heavy, but the full length of the dish at the end of the mast was straight out from the front of the tractor. I placed the forks slightly less than the diameter of the base apart and forced them around it, then rocked and pulled. Once out I just kept driving forward to its final resting place.

    Anyway, one part of the route involved a slight downslope which finally moved the CG far enough forward to lift the rear up and over, canting the tractor against the axle stop. Once on flat ground again everything leveled out again.

    Again, not a normal practice and my hand definitely never left the joystick.

    What surprised me is my reflexes were fast enough to out pace the F-22 jet fighter characteristics that overloaded tractors have. Maybe I should enlist with the Air Force?

    Did I ever mention how much I love my forks?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails How to kill yourself without knowing-1125101556a-jpg  
    "Freedom is never more than one generation from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free."

  5. #165
    New Member
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    Mar 2013
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    20
    Location
    Ten Mile, TN
    Tractor
    none

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by rekees4300 View Post
    My friend you are preaching to the choir. I've posted many times about the dangers of FEL/slopes but many here just scoff. As they say "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink".
    I always thought it was: Horticulture, You can lead a whore to culture, but you can't make her think.

    As I said earlier I am a devote chicken. So I come to those who know and ask questions. My mom once told me my first words were "why and how" mama and dada came next.

  6. #166
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    2,502
    Location
    Middle TN
    Tractor
    Kubota L4330HST

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Welcome to TBN!

    Ten Mile? Really? I used to live there (on the lake). Is the Mr. Twister still there?

  7. #167
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    3,461
    Location
    Oklahoma
    Tractor
    JD cut

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    I see the problem as cushioned/spring seats which let you get beyond the power curve before you know it. The danger signal is obscured by the suspension (and old age in some circumstances).

    When the old metal seat bolted to the case started to move, your butt told you immediately that things were going badly.

  8. #168
    Bronze Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    58
    Location
    abbotsford,bc
    Tractor
    mahendra 3616

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by MMagis View Post
    There is data, but it won't support his numbers. He's making them up I suspect. The typically accepted number is right around 1/2 second. That's how they set the timing for drag racing lights.
    When you are waiting for it you are focused of course you react quicker. When you are driving equipment you are not anticipating a disaster so 5 seconds is a good time to analize and react. We are all experts when it comes down to it. If you are waiting on a green light at a race track and they forgo the yellow your brain would have to think hey i was waiting for the yellow now its green, I better take off. That would take you longer to process than if it went thru the entire tree.

    Sent from my SGH-I337M using TractorByNet mobile app

  9. #169
    Bronze Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
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    58
    Location
    abbotsford,bc
    Tractor
    mahendra 3616

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Quote Originally Posted by nebraskasparks View Post
    I used to buy into the legal departments argument that due to too many factors that the manufacturers can't do this or that. We studied those back in our basic Mech Ag classes in the 70's and we were also punching cards for computers. That was true up to about the 1990's but that isn't true today.

    What a computer can calculate today with sensors on the front and back of hydraulic lifts is a lot. Tilt angles and weight loads and implement heights are simply fed into a CHEAP computer and Calculations that are simply burned into memory make split calculations and results come in milliseconds...faster than you or I can make a decision. An input to a kill switch would save lots of Dads and Sons.These computers are cheap today...very cheap. This is being done on all sorts of equipment today. Only the audience can demand that it be changed.

    Turning uphill or downhill on a slope is bad news for any kind of equipment and that's what all your movies on tractor safety show. Very basic.

    Moving a FEL or three point with a heavy load on a slope is also an invitation for Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein to sit in your bucket and lecture you about moving heavy loads with your FEL. For example...

    If you parked your tractor pointed downhill and stepped back and imagined a stick hanging from your fingers running through the center of your tractor that was plumb/exactly perpendicular with level ground...this will give you the angle that the *** end of your tractor would be OFF THE GROUND if it was on level ground. Visualize how many FEET this off the ground if it were on level ground...then move your FEL or three point. You will find that you only have to move your FEL a few inches or less than a foot without any kind of load to move the FEL where it's max weight on the chart is. Put a load on it and you become a physics major within milliseconds. The kubota I just bought has these charts with the FEL.
    If you're so inclined to be extremely stupid and work your tractor sideways or parallel to the hill while moving your attachments...step back, park your tractor...imagine this stick hanging from your fingers running through the center of your tractor and see how many inches or feet the upwheel tires would be off the ground if you were on level ground. It only takes a few moments to do and will save your keyster and pride.

    Everyone is very cautious when they have a load in the FEL and they start putting any kind of height on it but according to the charts provided on various pieces of equipment...the moment arm or force really shoots up when you first lift or lower your fel when your bucket is within the first few feet of the ground. The weight that is exerted onto the arms moves closer to the tractor body and center of gravity the higher it goes so long as it is on level ground. Moving or changing the angle or slope of the ground just a few degrees off moves the moment arm away from the tractor a huge amount depending on the weight in your FEL or three point and that's where I saw the pearly gates for a millisecond operating an old ford. I thought I was moving the bucket slowly but I have never seen a machine want to leap off the ground so fast in my life.

    It takes the average human being 5 seconds to see, process (think) and then react. I saw this time and time again as an accident investigator. We are terribly human and very few human beings can process information faster than this. Moral of the story...it's over before you can react.

    I saw an old farmer take his framing square and eyeball a hill once. He then showed me in the manual where they had highly recommended the max slope the machine should be operated on.

    I will continue to dig for the information that we can put into some common English but even moving the FEL or three point hitch at what we think is a slow rate means absolutely nothing when the weight/moment arm exceeds the weight of your tractor and they snap faster than you can say...ahhh...
    I totally agree with this.

    Sent from my SGH-I337M using TractorByNet mobile app

  10. #170
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    1,409
    Tractor
    Massey

    Default Re: How to kill yourself without knowing

    Looks like generalized science to me. We had a more scientific debate of this roll center topic some years ago.

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