Joystick Circuit Selector Button

It may be a while before I get pictures, so I'll post too many words.
After the testing and demonstration that Bubenberg and I did on Sunday, I can declare the modification of the hydraulic controls on my PT1845 to be a success. With the button on the joystick, I can control the mounting plate lift and tilt as before, then push the button and control the open & close of the 4 n 1 or the curl of the hoe or the angle of the snowplow without my hand leaving the joystick.
Now, when I mount the hoe or 4 n 1, I don't attach them to the aux PTO. Instead, I hook their hydraulic lines to the new ones from the diverter valve. Then, when I move the lever to the side, it tilts the attach plate, as before. When I push the button and move the lever to the side, the tilt stays the same and the 4 n 1 opens or closes, or the hoe curls, etc. And, if I have another function, the aux pto is still available, still on the right knee lever.
Caveat: It was expensive. I have about $420 in the modification. I think it can be done for a little over half that by careful selection of components. I bought the valve and handle with button from W.R. Long for $204.75 and $56.95 respectively, plus shipping. I then bought hoses, fittings and adapters from our local Parker shop, which is expensive, but top grade stuff. Those cost $145. It took a few hours of fiddling to decide what fittings to buy, and where the valve could be mounted. I've seen valves as cheap as $125 if bought in lots of 30, and I assume there are some around in that range. At lease $75 can be saved in the hose and fitting budget by careful selection and location of the valve to minimize angle fittings and adapters.
To assemble a kit, you will need a momentary contact button, or a sleeve for the joystick with electrical top button or trigger. You need a solenoid operated diverter valve, four hoses, and the fittings to assemble everything. The steps are:
1. Figure where the valve can mount so that six hoses get to it without interference.
2. Disconnect the hoses from the joystick valves which go to the mounting plate tilt cylinder.
3. Install new hoses from the joystick valve to the p1 and p2 ports of the diverter valve.
4. Connect the original tilt cylinder hoses to the c1 and c4 ports of the diverter valve.
5. Connect two new hoses to the c2 and c3 ports of the diverter, with male quick disconnect fittings on the other end of the hoses of the same type as the aux pto.
6. Run one wire from the auxiliary pole in the console to the button, and the other wire from the button to the solenoid on the valve. Run a ground wire from the other solenoid valve to good ground.
Sounds easy, right? To make it challenging, do it in hot weather, as I did, and make sure you spill at least a quart of oil on the floor and an equal amount on your clothes. Preliminary testing with a couple of loose fittings does that well.
The type of valve which I installed is well described at <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.autoguide.co.uk/sodad.htm>valve link</A>.
To select a valve from a hydraulic supplier, the best thing to do is to determine exactly what size fittings are on your PT system (are they SAE 4?). That way, a sodad can be selected which does not need adapters for hose sizes and fitting types. I used 6 $16 elbow fittings, plus a couple of similarly priced adapters from SAE6 to SAE4 (I think.)
A difficult decision is location of the new valve. I was able to squeeze it into the "firewall", but have noticed some minor interference with a lift cylinder when completely extended which might be a problem over time. Some imaginative location work may be needed on the PT425. A valve could be mounted outside the body, or on the boom, or even inside in the footwell with holes for a few hoses to go through.
The WR Long system I bought is oversize for PTs, but was assembled and tested by Long. I heard about it, and their 4 n 1 bucket which I bought, on TBN, and they have treated me well. Their kit is a proven way to go, and I think their price is not unreasonable, although money can be saved by assembling your own kit. Of course. if you realy get carried away, there are kits available with more buttons than on the average fighter plane, and the capability to add five or six new hydraulic circuits. Just think, a robotic grapple that tilts and swivels, that you can use to pick up your can of diet coke and pour it into your Chalkley cup, all while scratching behind your shoulderblade with a hydraulic backscratcher. (Don't press the wrong button.)

Charlie,
Great reading, this is a thread I will be saving.
PJ

Charlie, Thanks for the report. Are you able to move the arm of the hoe and curl the bucket at the same time?

It sounds like you and Hans had quite a day. Thanks for the research. I wish I could have been there.

Eric

<font color=red>Charlie, Thanks for the report. Are you able to move the arm of the hoe and curl the bucket at the same time? </font color=red>

Eric: The way I plumbed mine, I can curl the bucket while raising and lowering the whole assembly by moving the joystick to the side with the button pushed, and also moving it front to back. I can't move the dipper of the hoe by tilting the attach plate while simultaneously curling the bucket, since the valve switches the whole circuit to one or the other of those. I can get almost the same effect by pressing and releasing the button, since the change from one circuit to the other is immediate. I must confess, however, that even though all functions are now on one joystick, I tend to do one at a time, and generally fairly slowly due to lack of experience. Hans caught on fast enough to pick up big bites of branches and fence from the trash pile on his first try, which would have been much harder with the right knee lever.

Charlie, i spoke to Randy Lackender. He was reading your e-mail but said that he was very tired. We went over my order and the smaller mounting plate, thumb, 8" bucket and two teeth. Because of the smaller engine on the pt425 he is going to give me a smaller piston, i think he said a 2" one!?!?!?!

Randy said that it will take him a few days to get back to you but thinks that he can come up with a better, less expensive solution, alike his most expensive backhoe.

How are the caterpillars doing?

<font color=red>Because of the smaller engine on the pt425 he is going to give me a smaller piston, i think he said a 2" one!?!?!?!</font color=red>

Hans: I don't know the piston diameter of the cylinder on my hoe, but I think 2 1/2 inches is a reasonable guess. Mine is quite slow, but powerful. With the smaller cylinder, yours will move faster, assuming similar available flow in the control circuit that you attach to, but will only have about 2/3 the available force. Since I think you indicated you would be getting an 8 inch bucket, the force per inch of cut should be the same as my 12" bucket, assuming the same hydraulic pressure. I think the 2" cylinder should work fine, and should keep the function from being too slow for your usual impatient approach to things.

If the upload works, the attached photo will show the diverter valve about in the middle, with six hoses attached.

are we ever going to clean that dirt and grass of that machine ... or do you want to lock like us grasshoppers?

how are the caterpillar doing, by the way?

on Tuesday i have conference call with pt and terry specifically about what they intent to do about helping us (purchase and engineering power) about the supper button on your joystick, Wednesday i will follow up with randy lackender on the same subject.

Charlie, <font color=red>If the upload works, the attached photo will show the diverter valve about in the middle, with six hoses attached.</font color=red> Nice clean installation. Now when are you going to show us your button? Any idea whether Power Trac will offer us a mini hoe too, to say nothing of a dump trailer? And contrary to what bubenberg says I must compliment you on keeping your machine so clean.

<font color=red>are we ever going to clean that dirt and grass of that machine ... or do you want to lock like us grasshoppers?</font color=red>

I knew when I went down with the camera that someone would comment on a few grass clippings from the two fields I mowed Sunday. If I'd thought a bit more, I would have predicted who would point out that I don't clean after every use. My excuse is that my PT works for me, not the other way around. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif