Ballast almost flipped the tractor, really need some help!

[RapidRobert]

I have a B26 Tractor Loader Backhoe. I have just ordered a tiltmeter at Tractorbynet. I need to go up and down some steep hills. The tractor seems to have little inclination to go over frontwards with the FEL, but going uphill makes me nervous because of the weight of the backhoe. Is there a way to safely determine what angle the tractor can go up before the accident happens?

[RaydaKub]

Hey RapidRobert,
Maybe that should be welcome back? You joined a year ago but this is your first post

I got no idea about your question though.

[joshuabardwell]

Is there a way to safely determine what angle the tractor can go up before the accident happens?

Extend the backhoe outwards so it will catch you if you tip. Then drive up steeper and steeper hills until it happens. Then use the backhoe to push you back down.

PS: DO NOT DO THIS. I'm just kidding.

All kidding aside, it seems like there are too may variables to be able to say 100% "yes this is a safe angle, but this isn't." Let's say you parked the tractor on a turntable and slowly tilted it until it tipped over, and you determined that 18 degrees was safe. Well, what if you're in the real world and you hit a gopher hole that dips one wheel and takes you over the edge? What if you've got a bucket of dirt? What if you've got a bucket of compost? What if you've got a bucket of WET dirt?

I'm not an experienced operator, so I just take. it. slow. whenever I'm in a remotely sketchy situation. Rollovers happen very quickly when they happen, but if you are moving slowly, chances are that you will get some warning before everything turns pear shaped. Your front end may start to slide downhill just a bit, requiring you to turn uphill to counteract (WARNING! DANGER!). You may go up on three wheels for a second (WARNING! DANGER!). Your front end may get a little bit bouncier than it usually is going up a hill (WARNING! DANGER!). And so forth. The slower you go, the less likely you are to end up upside down without any warning.

The other mistake that I think inexperienced operators make is ignoring or missing the warnings. If you start to get warning signs, pay attention. Don't just put the pedal down and trust in your guardian angel to make everything all right.

Bottom line: stay within your comfort zone. If something doesn't feel right, stop. Assess the situation. Determine the best course of action, and proceed slowly to the nearest safe position. Determine how you're going to get from point A to point B before you start going, don't just charge in and get surprised. Once you know an area real well, you can tear around it willy nilly if you want to. If you were to see how I get from some points on my property to other points, you might think I was taking the long way around, but what you don't know is that the obvious way has a steep hill, or a bunch of ground-hog holes, or a slippery muddy spot, or whatever. My way may be longer, but it keeps the tractor with all four wheels down, and that's what matters most. No job is worth not going home at the end of the day.

If you get to the point where you are a very experienced operator, you may come to ignore some of these rules, but from your question, you sound inexperienced like me.

[k0ua]

And when you get really experienced like me (20 years 5 tractors) that's when the really bad stuff happens to you. Complacency can get you hurt just as fast as ignorance. Never get comfortable, always think about what might happen.

James K0UA

[swick1]

I can do wheelies on my tractor without the fel but hoe installed. It's fun. I always back up really steep hills (like 45 degrees steep).

[swick1]

Extend the backhoe outwards so it will catch you if you tip. Then drive up steeper and steeper hills until it happens. Then use the backhoe to push you back down.

PS: DO NOT DO THIS. I'm just kidding.

Actually it works great if you are at the base of a non cambered hill :-)

[GILLYS CHILLI FARM AUSTRA]

I would say only to the extent that they want your ROPS to function as designed if you tip over. However, what you do to get yourself to that point is entirely beyond their control.

If you look at the Rimguard web site they show that for a tire size 17.5L-24 (MX5100 rear R4 per tractordata) 75% full will give 588lbs for each tire (1177lbs total). Your loader can lift 2443 lbs. I think someone posted force diagrams earlier in the thread. Look at these with these numbers in mind. On flat ground you are probably OK because you will have the weight of the tractor and tire ballast behind the front axle pivot helping to offset the opposing force from the bucket. A downward slope, a raised bucket can change this. If it were me, I would (and do) have rear tires filled and extra weight on the 3 point hitch for heavy work with the loader and ALWAYS keeping the bucket as low as possible when travelling with a load in it.

Thanks for your input JohninCT,,,,can I assume that at 90% water in tires that i should be able to lift 20% more TO 2932 lbs at FEL? Also advise my rear tires will be set at their widest, so would that improve or reduce capacity?

[joshuabardwell]

Thanks for your input JohninCT,,,,can I assume that at 90% water in tires that i should be able to lift 20% more TO 2932 lbs at FEL? Also advise my rear tires will be set at their widest, so would that improve or reduce capacity?

The difference between ballasted wheels and ballast on the 3ph is that ballast on the 3ph takes weight off the front axle and puts it onto the rear axle, in addition to making you less likely to tip over. You should refer to your tractor or loader's owner's manual for recommendations and specific capacities, or your dealer, but in general, for FEL capacity to be maximized, you want weight on the 3ph more than you want weight in the tires. My tractor's manual recommends both 3ph ballast and filled tires for best performance.

I have also heard it recommended to fill tires no more than 75%, because at least 25% air is needed to maintain proper shock absorption and so forth. To accomplish this, put your valve stem at the 12:00 position and continue to fill until it reaches that level.

[joshuabardwell]

Thanks for your input JohninCT,,,,can I assume that at 90% water in tires that i should be able to lift 20% more TO 2932 lbs at FEL? Also advise my rear tires will be set at their widest, so would that improve or reduce capacity?

The difference between ballasted wheels and ballast on the 3ph is that ballast on the 3ph takes weight off the front axle and puts it onto the rear axle, in addition to making you less likely to tip over. You should refer to your tractor or loader's owner's manual for recommendations and specific capacities, or your dealer, but in general, for FEL capacity to be maximized, you want weight on the 3ph more than you want weight in the tires. My tractor's manual recommends both 3ph ballast and filled tires for best performance.

I have also heard it recommended to fill tires no more than 75%, because at least 25% air is needed to maintain proper shock absorption and so forth. To accomplish this, put your valve stem at the 12:00 position and continue to fill until it reaches that level.

[Jd5203]

Hey guys
First time posting here and I really need some help!
We have quite a steep block of land. Around 5 acres with the steepest part being 40 degrees or so.

I recently purchased a John deere 4105 with a FEL to do some hobby farming / mowing. There were a few delivery delays for the FEL so at first I only had the tractor. She worked like a charm and I managed to mow all the lawn and get started ripping / tilling. FEL arrived and the whole dynamic changed.

It feels like the tractor actually has trouble going up the hill now? A lot more revs required and she seems unstable.

I'd never driven a tractor before but hydrostatic was simple enough. Did a good 30 hours before the FEL. I had no idea about counterweighting on the first day with the FEL and this happened ( photos )

I didn't get hurt but **** was I shaken up. The FEL is large at 6 foot and the path I cut was only 5 so it didn't fit lowered. I raised it and it just tipped forward.

I thought the ripper would be enough counterweight but it wasn't. The tyres arnt filled either as some have suggested.

I don't want to add so much counterweight the tractor has more trouble going up the slopes?
Its a skid steer loader so ive been dropping it when going on the slopes so ive been hesitant to fill the tyres.

What do you guys recommend??
How much weight should i put at the back?

It should say in your manual how much ballast to use. Also I would have your tires filled, it adds a good bit of traction. Also consider getting wheel weights for the back. And put something on your 3 point hitch!!!