buying ck25 or ck30

tractorguy2 · Jul 10, 2006

I looked at Kioti over the weekend and have been reading specs from website. My question is, what is advantage of ck25 over the 30 when the specs are nearly identical on the tractors? If the 3pt lift, loader and frame are the same (appears that why) why would one choose the 25 over the 30? For a few $$ more and a few pounds, the 30 seems like a logical choice. What am I missing here?

Highbeam · Jul 10, 2006

That's it. A few bucks and possibly a slight bit less fuel consumption. I see no difference in the two machines other than 5 less HP.

VictorW · Jul 10, 2006

You've done your checking and have it right. I chose the CK30hst and am very happy with it. A little extra pto hp allows my 6ft bh to work fine and engine hp helps with pulling 6ft implements. You could use a lower gear range if needed on the CK25 or mow a little slower. Everything else is the same such as hydro pump volume and lift capacity which you already found out.

tractorguy2 · Jul 10, 2006

Thanks for confirming specifications. HighBeam - what do you use to pull your trailer? I plan to "commute" 100 each way maybe onece a month. The CK30 sure is a fine looking machine and every thing I've read indicates that too. (Excepting the bucket issue perhaps.)

bearhawk · Jul 10, 2006

tractorguy2 said:
I plan to "commute" 100 each way

Sounds like an excuse to get a bigger truck also !

Jim

williekioti · Jul 10, 2006

Sounds like you're in the same boat I was once in two months ago. Went in to the dealer looking at the ck25 but ended up going with the 30 for the extra ponies plus I really liked the Woods 1012 FEL w/Quick Attachment setup(the 25 had a KL130). If you're worried about the loader issue see if your dealer carries Woods or Rhino or other quality aftermarket loader. The curved booms of the KL loader are prettier but I did not notice a huge difference in visibility/efficiency between it and the Woods when I operated both on the dealer's lot digging, leveling, etc. Either way you go, you will love the tractor, they really are a great toy, er tool. Get QA on your FEL if you plan to use(or think you may ever want to) things other than a bucket on your loader frame like grapples, forks, etc... Change out is simple and takes less than a minute.

What are your planned uses? That may help you decide as well. If you plan to use HP dependant PTO attachments go with as many ponies you can. If your use is more FEL and ground engagement the 25 may do as well and you can put the extra $ towards attachments, that is if $ are tight.

JMHO from another newbie.

7mmrum · Jul 11, 2006

williekioti is correct. If your use is ground engaging implements or primarly use of the hydraulics (FEL) then the CK25 can save you some money. And with the difference in cost you can make for that in other implements. I have approx 150hrs on mine, with a little over a year of use. I run a 5' bush hog in Low Range 4th gear. Where I could see the difference in the CK30 is the PTO HP; you would probably be able to run in High Range 1st gear bush hogging. I have tried with mine and I'm at dang near WOT (primarily cut pasture only). I move more Dirt and Rock with mine then I spend on hogg'n.

I trailer my CK25 once every 2 months from VA to PA about 80 mile one way trip. First off I'd recommend a Diesel, I have trailered with both and there is a big difference. I have a 97 dodge 3/4 ton Diesel 4x4 auto 8' bed extended cab (190HP - 420ftlbs torque). It pulls my trailer and tractor just fine, I'm not out to break and land records while towing since to me it is expensive cargo. Any newer diesel trucks, will ultimately have more torque for pulling. Keep in mind going up mountains I down shift. On flat stretches of road, no problem. I have a small car trailer, only 14' long, it works, but it was a too good of a deal to pass up. I plan to go bigger in the future. However I have no room for implements.

Good luck with both decisions

Highbeam · Jul 11, 2006

Check out the new trailering section up under oil for lots of people's photos.

You'll need at least a full size half ton to tow the CK30 but you will be better off with a truck with somewhat higher ratings. A lot of this depends on whether you are buying a truck to haul the CK or if you are trying to check to see if what you have is adequate. I already owned my truck and had it set up to tow a travel trailer so I knew what my ratings were and had made a few upgrades. Buying now to tow the tractor regularly I would love a 4 door dodge diesel just for a nice extra margin.

I tow with a 98 chevy 1500 4x4 and 5.7 liter engine. 265 factory HP and 330 TQ. The tractor weighs 4500 with one implement and my trailer weighs 2500. Yep, 7000 lb trailer. I have weighed the actual load and get just under 6500 on the trailer axles and 6500 on the truck axles. I tow just fine and have no trouble keeping up with traffic and under control. 11 mpg towing.

I actually enjoy the tow and it is part of the process of a full day tractoring. I need to bring at least one five gallon jug of diesel to endure that I don't run out of fuel during a full day's work.

tractorguy2 · Jul 12, 2006

I don't want to get involved with new trailers and trucks to haul the tractor. I have (the use of) a chevy 3/4 ton PU (gas). From all that has been said, it seems like it would be wise to consider the lightest weight tractor that will perform the tasks (light brush hogging, firewood, trail making, snow moving). I guess I really want the lightest tractor with the highest rated FEL - and I can add ballast rather than raw tractor weight.

coasterez · Jul 13, 2006

As everyone has said, the only difference is hp. The HP difference really only comes into play at the PTO, for the most part, because the CK25 can't be stopped when pulling or ground engaging. You'll almost always lose traction before you run out of hp. However, mowing or using other high-torque/rpm PTO attachments, like a large tiller, is where the CK30 has the advantage. So, if you are not using the PTO for such tasks to any large extent, the extra $ for the CK30 buys you very little extra capability. I have no plans to mow with my CK and am mainly digging, hauling, or pulling. That is why I opted for the CK25. I spent the money saved on implements. Now, if I ever sell it, the CK25 will have a slightly smaller market to draw from because of its lesser PTO capabilities. But, I have no plans to sell. My kids will have to bear that burden when I die.

In general, today's machines have way more hp than they need. Far too much emphasis is given to it. This is driven by competition between manufacturer's that use it in marketing hype to sell the consumer. In many cases, it's far easier (read cheaper) to add a fuel injector or the like to boost hp than it is to put a heavier duty frame, axle, or tranny in a machine. Further, the tranny/frame upgrade is harder to quantify in terms that the consumer can relate to. For many tasks weight, gearing, frame strength, and hydraulic capabilities are more important.

So, if you really need the hp, then get it. If not, buy other things that you need with the money instead, be it an implement or a pretty neglace for your better half.

Tom

Limecuda · Jul 13, 2006

I have not really checked into the Kioti, but since they seem to essentially be the same tractor what is the price difference in the two models?

thx

albmn10 · Jul 13, 2006

The cost difference between the ck25 and the ck30 was around 1200- 1500 dollars when i was buying last year. As far as the difference between the two machines, 5hp is still a pretty significant difference in performance . Youll be able to run implements a foot larger across the board. Id rather have the extra horsepower myself, the price difference is not that significant,and youll never have to question the hp issue if you go with the 30, buts thats just my opinion.

coasterez · Jul 14, 2006

Album,

You are right, 5 hp is significantly more (20%). But, I don't buy that you gain significant advantage with ground engaging equipment, at least not for the same size and weight tractor. The hp is only applied up to the point of stalling (HP limit) or loss of traction. In most cases, traction will limit you first and the extra hp will go unused. Although the CK30 has a few (very few) extra pounds gained from the engine differences, I don't think the CK30 will pull any more or any bigger unpowered implements than the CK25 in most situations. Maybe you could run in a higher gear, thereby allowing you to work a little faster. But, I absolutely cannot stall my CK25 in low range. She'll spin all fours first, every time. Maybe the situation is different for the HST's. Don't know. However, if you put that 30 hp in a much heavier tractor, and then I'd be telling a different story. I just don't see where the hp give you an advantage when not using the PTO. Of course, if I had the extra money to burn for hp I don't need, why not. You never know when you might want to put something hungry on that rear PTO. Shoot, one could argue I don't really need a tractor at all.

Tom

Steverino · Jul 14, 2006

coasterez said:
So, if you really need the hp, then get it. If not, buy other things that you need with the money instead, be it an implement or a pretty neglace for your better half.

In my very humble opinion coasterez pretty much nailed it. I have the CK30-HST and find the engine more than powerful enough for my usage. I do not have any powered 3-point attachments, but I do have a backhoe and a landscape rake and have way more power than I need to operate both. I do wish the kl-130 loader had more power though. At times it seems a little feeble and then there is the cracking issue. (See other posts). So if you got the “dough to blow” then the extra ponies certainly wouldn't hurt but more toys would be fun too. Good Lucky with your choice. -Steve

DirtHauler · Jul 15, 2006

I haul CK30 on 16' 7000 lb. pulled with my '95 Dodge 1500 5.9 w/auto trans short bed w/ factory heavy duty tow package. I don't have any problems doing freeway speed or pulling long hills although I do see a new diesel in my future (the wife doesn't know yet!). Attached is a pix of the CK w/ box scraper and the flail mower on the trailer.(I don't have a load equalizer hitch)

Highbeam · Jul 16, 2006

DirtHauler said:
I haul CK30 on 16' 7000 lb. pulled with my '95 Dodge 1500 5.9 w/auto trans short bed w/ factory heavy duty tow package. I don't have any problems doing freeway speed or pulling long hills although I do see a new diesel in my future (the wife doesn't know yet!). Attached is a pix of the CK w/ box scraper and the flail mower on the trailer.(I don't have a load equalizer hitch)

How are you chained to the front there DH? That's a good load for the trailer and a big weight on that truck without a WD hitch. I think you will be very happy once you try the fancy hitch. You realize that the tractor and those implements combined likely weigh more than your pickup, right? I sure wish I had a flail mower for those mowing jobs near houses and roads. The brush hog is pretty dangerous.

Limecuda · Jul 26, 2006

Don't mean to hi jack but I have been looking at both as well. Will the ck25 pull a 6' rear finishing mower fine? The dealer was pushing me towards it.

Highbeam · Jul 27, 2006

The 25 and 30 both have the same 1764 lbs of 3pt hitch lift capacity. The manual lists a 60 inch mid mount mower as the max for both tractors but on rotary cutters, aka brush hog, the 25 is limited to a 60 while the 30 can run a 72. On tillers, the 25 is limited to 55 and the 30 limited to 59. Those are all the PTO attachments the manual lists.

Can it run a wider mower? Sure, you might need to take partial cuts with it or slow down in heavy grass though.

DirtHauler · Jul 30, 2006

Highbeam said:
How are you chained to the front there DH? That's a good load for the trailer and a big weight on that truck without a WD hitch. I think you will be very happy once you try the fancy hitch. You realize that the tractor and those implements combined likely weigh more than your pickup, right? I sure wish I had a flail mower for those mowing jobs near houses and roads. The brush hog is pretty dangerous.

Chained? The front of the tractor to the trailer? My trailer has 4 heavy duty "D" rings, one on each corner factory installed. As far as weight, well I went to the local rock quarry one day and weighed truck, trailer and tractor with just the mower..........ummmmmm should've taken my lunch box out!

Highbeam · Jul 31, 2006

I wasn't very clear, I meant how do you attach your tie down chains to the nose of the tractor? I run through the front box of the frame but there are these two big holes on the frame siderails just begging for some sort of tractor mounted d-ring and I thought maybe you had that.