59 Ford 841 died, won't start

[Soundguy]

i'm saying that i bet if you cut that new coil open you will not find 2 coils of wire and a resistor.. you will find 2 coils of wire.. and they will be of the correct length and gauge to be the correct resistance

if the primar is truly 3.6 ohms.. you do NOT need an external resistor.

as for the dizzy cap.

where does your oiler spout point.

it's possible someone removed the dizzy and installed it at a different clock facing than original.. but that is not a big issue as long as the wires are also re-oriented so that #1` is 1 etc.

 

[sailj32]

i'm saying that i bet if you cut that new coil open you will not find 2 coils of wire and a resistor.. you will find 2 coils of wire.. and they will be of the correct length and gauge to be the correct resistance

if the primar is truly 3.6 ohms.. you do NOT need an external resistor.

as for the dizzy cap.

where does your oiler spout point.

it's possible someone removed the dizzy and installed it at a different clock facing than original.. but that is not a big issue as long as the wires are also re-oriented so that #1` is 1 etc.

Ah, I see. Not an internal resistor, but an internal resistance. Makes sense. So I could use it if I bypassed the resistor - but I also know that when starting this engine the external resistor is bypassed to provide full current to the coil, and then when the starter switch is released, the resistor goes back into play. I could not do this if the resistance is internal to the coil.

My oil spout points outward and toward the front, at about 50 degrees from the fore-aft centerline of the tractor. In other words in a top view if the front-center of the tractor is 12:00, the oil spout points to about 2:00. If the dizzy had been rotated 180 degrees, the oil spout would be crammed between the engine block and coil.

The old dust cap I replaced was also marked for orientation to the oil spout, and the distributor cap was oriented correctly with that dust cap. The new one fits perfectly however, and the engine runs now, put a couple hours on it yesterday.

Thanks for the info and advice
Don

 

[Soundguy]

the original ignition system on a 541 would NOT have used a resitor / bypass start system.

it used a 6v battery and coil and NO resistor.

it wasn't untill the 65+ 3 cyl machines came out with 12v electrical systems that they went to using a resistor wire and 6v coil, resistor wire bypassed at start, and inline when running.

IMHO.. if you are on a 12v system.. get a 12v coil. no reason a offset should need a resistor bypass system.

also means the oem safety starter interlock is likely not working and has been defeated if you are using a bypass solenoid.

not reccomended.

 

[sailj32]

Soundguy - I assume your comment also applies to an 841? The rewire to 12V was done long before my ownership, and it does have a 12V coil, and also an external resistor. The only reason I'm considering changing the coil is that the spark is a little weak, although adequate. I bought a replacement coil, but have not put it on yet because until now I didn't understand the internal/external resistor situation.

You are correct, the floor starter switch is not in use - there is a key switch with ACC - OFF - RUN - START positions. This switch must do the resistor bypass in START position because my most recent problem (now solved) was that the engine would only run when in START. The problem was a wire pulled off the resistor, so in RUN there was no coil voltage.

I'm thinking I'll put in the new 12V coil, remove the resistor, and restore the foot starter, assuming it works. Then I can replace the key switch with a simple on-off toggle, and if I ever re-wire the headlights, another switch for them.

By the way, is there a better "Shop Manual" than the I&T manual FO-20? There's a good deal of mechanical information in it, but the sections on ignition and gas carburetor are very skimpy. Plenty of info on the LP carburetor and diesel fuel system however.

 

[Soundguy]

the f0-20 is more than sufficient for anything up to full overhaul, but yeah.. there is a shop manual .. it's more $$ but more extensive too.

the info I quoted would easilly cover all the 00/01 series from 55-64

the reason your spark is weak is because you say you have a resistor AND a 12v coil.

if you have a key/turn to start setup, your solenoid has been changed too. to go back to the trans top button, you will need the correct solenoid.. not a car/auto type like you have now.

you can test the thumb switch with a test lamp. clip to bat hot, probe to screw terminal.. press when in neutral. if lamp comes on, switch is good.