Am I legal? Tow weight question (weights listed)

[Slacker]

Farmtrac 360 TLB.

Backhoe: 900lbs
Tractor: 3050lbs
Oversized Filled Tires: 250lbs
FEL: 550 lbs

4750 Total tractor weight

1950 Total trailer weight
2x 3500 lbs axles Brakes on front axle only.
model: Hudson Brothers Trailer Manufacturers, Inc, Indian Trail, NC
Max listed payload of trailer is 7000lbs
Listed GVWR of trailer is: 8,950 lbs.


Trailer is a 16' and isn't quite long enough to place the weight of the tractor in the ideal position. The tounge is a little light when the BH is attached. However, with the box blade or bushhog attached it's not such an issue.

Tow rig: 2001 2500 HD 6.0 gasser 4x4 w/brake controller.
Max towing capacity is listed as 12,000lbs. Hopefully this is correct, I had a hard time finding it on the web.

All input is appriciated. If you have time, please include your calculations, I've love to learn how the numbers are figured out.

 

[VitaBene]

Farmtrac 360 TLB.

Backhoe: 900lbs
Tractor: 3050lbs
Oversized Filled Tires: 250lbs
FEL: 550 lbs

4750 Total tractor weight

1950 Total trailer weight
2x 3500 lbs axles Brakes on front axle only.
model: Hudson Brothers Trailer Manufacturers, Inc, Indian Trail, NC
Max listed payload of trailer is 7000lbs
Listed GVWR of trailer is: 8,950 lbs.


Trailer is a 16' and isn't quite long enough to place the weight of the tractor in the ideal position. The tounge is a little light when the BH is attached. However, with the box blade or bushhog attached it's not such an issue.

Tow rig: 2001 2500 HD 6.0 gasser 4x4 w/brake controller.
Max towing capacity is listed as 12,000lbs. Hopefully this is correct, I had a hard time finding it on the web.

All input is appriciated. If you have time, please include your calculations, I've love to learn how the numbers are figured out.

Hi, I am a little confused by the 8950 GVW vs axle rating (2X3.5K = 7000 LB total capacity).

Other than that, while I prefer brakes on both axles, I think you are OK because you are even under the 7K with the tractor loaded. I had 2 Hudson HSE-16 trailers (I believe that was the #, it has been a while) and they worked well toting my Kubota L2250 and L2850 tractors around behind 3/4 ton Chevy or Ford pickups.

 

[RobertN]

Your trailer weights are off. If you have two 3500lb axles, then you have a 7000lb GVRW trailer. Your payload is 5050lbs if the trailer weighs 1950(subtract trailer weight from GVRW of trailer).

You should do fine with the tractor trailer combination. It is near full capacity, but should be fine.

You will probably need a weight distributing hitch though. Your truck may be specced to haul 12,000lbs, but what is your hitch rated for?

So, the trailer can do it, the truck itself can do it. But can your existing hitch do it.

On my older hitch, it is rated for only 5000lbs, or 10,000lbs with a weight disti receiver insert.

1950 Total trailer weight
2x 3500 lbs axles Brakes on front axle only.
model: Hudson Brothers Trailer Manufacturers, Inc, Indian Trail, NC
Max listed payload of trailer is 7000lbs
Listed GVWR of trailer is: 8,950 lbs.


Trailer is a 16' and isn't quite long enough to place the weight of the tractor in the ideal position. The tounge is a little light when the BH is attached. However, with the box blade or bushhog attached it's not such an issue.

Tow rig: 2001 2500 HD 6.0 gasser 4x4 w/brake controller.
Max towing capacity is listed as 12,000lbs. Hopefully this is correct, I had a hard time finding it on the web.

All input is appriciated. If you have time, please include your calculations, I've love to learn how the numbers are figured out.

 

[Slacker]

Your trailer weights are off. If you have two 3500lb axles, then you have a 7000lb GVRW trailer. Your payload is 5050lbs if the trailer weighs 1950(subtract trailer weight from GVRW of trailer).

You should do fine with the tractor trailer combination. It is near full capacity, but should be fine.

You will probably need a weight distributing hitch though. Your truck may be specced to haul 12,000lbs, but what is your hitch rated for?

So, the trailer can do it, the truck itself can do it. But can your existing hitch do it.

On my older hitch, it is rated for only 5000lbs, or 10,000lbs with a weight disti receiver insert.

Thanks for the replys. RobertN, do you think the specs at Hudson are wrong?
Hudson Brothers Trailer Manufacturers, Inc, Indian Trail, NC
They list the GVRW at 8950lbs. I'll check out my hitch. Should it be rated at tounge weight or actual weight?

 

[KeithInSpace]

Thanks for the replys. RobertN, do you think the specs at Hudson are wrong?

In a nutshell, yes. Anybody could have created those statistics and that person doesn't have to know anything about trailer weights.

The fact of the matter is this: The tires are ST205/75D15's that are clearly mounted on 5 lug rims. This means they are Load Range C tires, good for 1,820# per tire. That means the 4 tire combination is good for 7,280# which is consistent with the stated rating of the two 3,500# axles.

If the tires were Load Range D (the next step up), they would be 225's, not 205's, and would be mounted on 6 lug rims. Those are good for 2,540# each. I have a "10k# capacity trailer", but the sticker on the side actually says the GVWR is 10,400#. They're maximizing the weight rating to the tires.

Very generally speaking, the largest single axle trailers are 3,500# capacity (two LR-C tires) and the next step up from there is a dual axle trailer with FOUR LR-C tires...7,000# capacity. Up from there is four LR-D tires yielding a 10,000# capacity trailer. Up yet a bit more is a 14,000# trailer with 8 lug 16" wheels, I believe...dunno what LR those tires are...gets funny up there getting into dual wheels and such.

The stated GVWR is incorrect and should technically be 7,280# (a 7k# capacity class trailer). Then you subtract the weight of the trailer to get a payload capacity of 5,050# or 5,330# depending on how the manufacturer rates the trailer.

As an aside, if I had your rig, I'd get (or would have gotten) at least a 10k# capacity trailer. It is a small difference in price and "girth" and doesn't leave as much potential capacity on the table. As you've already figured out, it is VERY easy to fill a 7,000# trailer.

Your hitch should be rated for the actual weight of the trailer. On my truck, I'm only rated to 6,000# without a WD hitch assemble, but 9,200# with. And be careful as folks just throw a 'standard' 2-5/16 ball at you...those balls are available at 5,000# capacity. I had to dig a bit to find a ball rated at 10,000#.

 

[radioman]

I think you are fine with your load on the trailer. go by the 7k rating. There is something seriously wrong with the manufacter max rating as it doesnt match the match the payload rating. You need to go by the weakest link in the trailer and that is the tires and axels on your trailer. Use the lowest max rating on the weakest link. BUT! there is always a but here. Take a look at your trailer and look for the stickers on the axels if they are still there. It might be painted over or something but there a chance you might have a higher rating so upgrading the tires can increase the payload but not on paper . make sense ?

 

[KeithInSpace]

Hudson Brothers Trailer Manufacturers, Inc, Indian Trail, NC

I'll tell you another reason to doubt the number they provide:

On the stipulated web site, look at the two trailer views to the right of the main picture...one appears to be taken from the right hand side of the trailer, the other from the left.

Look very closely...they took the EXACT same picture and "flopped" it to make it appear that they took a picture from the other side.

Don't get me wrong. It looks like a very nice trailer, honestly. Quite nice, in fact. But there are certain things I see that make me think that whoever put the web site together isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer.

 

[Josh61513]

I've seen trailers with twin 3,500lb. axles rated with a GVWR of 7,700 lbs., legitamitely. They assume that you will properly load the gross trailer weight of 7,700 lbs. with 10% being tongue weight which isn't carried on the axles, but on the tow rig instead.

That said, you can't with a clear conscience assume the user will have 27% tongue weight and rate the trailer for 8,950 lbs...Clearly the manufacturer/website is wrong. As Keith mentioned you likely have a capacity of approx. 5,000 lbs.

I think some of your tractor weight estimates are off. 250lbs. seems way light for filled tires, especially after I googled the FarmTrac 360, looks like good sized tires on that.

Also, the weight of the tractor with loader is listed here: Tractor Specification - The Tractor Guy as 4,418 lbs. You had estimated 3,050 lbs. for the tractor and 550 lbs. for the loader for a total of just 3,600 lbs. Even if your filled tires only added 250 lbs. that would put you at 4,775 lbs, add the backhoe and you are significantly overweight.

I'd second the suggestion for the 10,000 lb. equipment trailer. And second the suggestion to look at and probably replace your trailer hitch, I had a 2002 GMC Sierra with the duramax diesel that had a bent trailer hitch. Tweaked hitches are common for those trucks. The factory hitch is very un-impressive. I replaced it with a Putnam brand which must have weighed at least double the factory hitch.

I would suggest measuring your tongue weight with backhoe attache too. Less than 10% tongue weight is very dangerous; often leading to trailer sway. Weight distribution should be used on a 10,000 lb. trailer as well to maintain weight on the steering axle.

 

[Diamondpilot]

These guys are all right. Its a 7K trailer which means if you pull it across a scale there can be no more than 7K on the tandem axles. The trucks hitch can carry weight. With a 7k trailer the 2500 factory hitch will be fine but the GM hitches leave a lot to be desired. I would not put more than a 10K trailer on the factory hitch. Not bashing GM because I bent my F-250 hitch also.

As for the weights of your machine I would check again. I have a smaller tractor and my tires hold 380# filled. Your weights seem low to me on the tractor and loader.

At the end of the day the guy making the site screwed up the math. Its a 7K trailer that weighs about 2K leaving 5K for payload.

Chris

 

[Slacker]

I've seen trailers with twin 3,500lb. axles rated with a GVWR of 7,700 lbs., legitamitely. They assume that you will properly load the gross trailer weight of 7,700 lbs. with 10% being tongue weight which isn't carried on the axles, but on the tow rig instead.

That said, you can't with a clear conscience assume the user will have 27% tongue weight and rate the trailer for 8,950 lbs...Clearly the manufacturer/website is wrong. As Keith mentioned you likely have a capacity of approx. 5,000 lbs.

I think some of your tractor weight estimates are off. 250lbs. seems way light for filled tires, especially after I googled the FarmTrac 360, looks like good sized tires on that.

Also, the weight of the tractor with loader is listed here: Tractor Specification - The Tractor Guy as 4,418 lbs. You had estimated 3,050 lbs. for the tractor and 550 lbs. for the loader for a total of just 3,600 lbs. Even if your filled tires only added 250 lbs. that would put you at 4,775 lbs, add the backhoe and you are significantly overweight.

I'd second the suggestion for the 10,000 lb. equipment trailer. And second the suggestion to look at and probably replace your trailer hitch, I had a 2002 GMC Sierra with the duramax diesel that had a bent trailer hitch. Tweaked hitches are common for those trucks. The factory hitch is very un-impressive. I replaced it with a Putnam brand which must have weighed at least double the factory hitch.

I would suggest measuring your tongue weight with backhoe attache too. Less than 10% tongue weight is very dangerous; often leading to trailer sway. Weight distribution should be used on a 10,000 lb. trailer as well to maintain weight on the steering axle.

Great catch on the weight. I took the weight number for the tractor without FEL from the factory owners manual (3050lbs). The FEL owners manual does not state a weight so I guessed around 500lbs. The 4008 Backhoe owners manual states 900 lbs.
I have oversized filled rear tires and they do weigh a lot.
End result is I need a larger trailer to legally carry the tractor with backhoe, but can carry the tractor, FEL and a small implement and stay legal.
I've always hated how short my Hudson trailer was and this is the perfect excuse to get a 10,000 lb 20 foot trailer. I'll probably put mine up for sale soon. Hopefully I can get what I paid for it. Thanks for all the input guys.