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  1. #91
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    East Coast of Lake Huron
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    Deere, several

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Now after the EPA and CAFE have regulated the diesel nearly into extinction The cost of the diesel option.along with the price of diesel vs gasoline. How do the numbers justify the operation of a diesel pickup vs. gasoline? Look at the short term and long term service too. Even a wider spread when GM introduces the 2013 direct injection gas engine. It's 2012 not 1986 or earlier when a turbo diesel with a manual trans was superior to a carbureted gasser with a three speed auto. Unless you want to burn cheaper off road fuel, re- program the truck for more power or look/sound cool with a diesel. There are no valid reasons for 99.9% of the light diesel truck purchases. Don't try the durability story either . Fuel injected gasses on unleaded fuel go an easy 300,000 miles. How much service will the diesel's two alternators, two batteries, turbo, waste gate, egr valve, egr cooler, particulate filter, cat converter, urea injection system and 30,000psi injection system going to require.

  2. #92
    Silver Member
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    Dec 2010
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    Love, VA
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    Kubota B7100 HST 4WD

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by buickanddeere View Post
    Now after the EPA and CAFE have regulated the diesel nearly into extinction The cost of the diesel option.along with the price of diesel vs gasoline. How do the numbers justify the operation of a diesel pickup vs. gasoline? Look at the short term and long term service too. Even a wider spread when GM introduces the 2013 direct injection gas engine. It's 2012 not 1986 or earlier when a turbo diesel with a manual trans was superior to a carbureted gasser with a three speed auto. Unless you want to burn cheaper off road fuel, re- program the truck for more power or look/sound cool with a diesel. There are no valid reasons for 99.9% of the light diesel truck purchases. Don't try the durability story either . Fuel injected gasses on unleaded fuel go an easy 300,000 miles. How much service will the diesel's two alternators, two batteries, turbo, waste gate, egr valve, egr cooler, particulate filter, cat converter, urea injection system and 30,000psi injection system going to require.
    You are absolutely right. Really, the same holds true for hybrids- they simply don't pay off in 7 or 8 years, much less save money. Today, a gas engine suffecient to perform your expected duties is a smarter purchase than a diesel engine. Unless you are hotshotting and driving hundreds of thousands of miles a year, a diesel just doesn't make economical sense. I love my diesel, and always will. I just have to be honest and say that its a want, not a justified need.
    "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ..." Romans 1:16
    Kubota B7100 HST 4WD
    94 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD

  3. #93
    Platinum Member Superduper's Avatar
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    Jul 2006
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    midwest
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    John Deere 3120

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Anyone that has ever towed anything significant with both a gas and a diesel knows that for towing, there simply is nothing better than the torque/fuel economy combination that diesels provide.

    I used to tow cars for a living. My own business, actually. We had gas motors, we had diesels. As a professional operator, after trying both, there is no way that I would go back. Are new gas motors durable? Absolutely. But make it tow 10k day/in, day/out and suddenly it's not as durable anymore.

    For me, this isn't a commercial tow vehicle, it's for personal enjoyment and not my only vehicle, although for my occassional towing needs, it will now do all of those chores since I don't like feeling like I'm overloaded with my other vehicles. I love the excess braking capacity, the tremendous power, the fuel mileage, and the transmission is the icing on the cake. For some reason, a toasted tranny worries me more than anything else on a vehicle, perhaps from bad experiences. These tranny failures along with their big $$ cost usually manifest at the worse time. For me, the allison option has been what I've been waiting for forever, and great for peace of mind. I fix most everything else on my own. I don't touch tranny's though.

    Maybe in the end, I saved a few penny's, and then again, maybe I end up a few pennies short by going with a diesel. I'm not going to worry about it, I bought it, and I'm going to have to live with it for at least 6 years, terms of my zero % financing.

    As for EPA, CARB, and all that. I know this much: 2 decades ago, I inhaled diesel fumes all day, every day. You got near the tow truck and diesel was all you smelled. The trucks had great torque right off idle and it was the price we paid for those benefits. Fuel mileage was good too. Not great -- averaged 12-13 mpg. But much better than the 7-10 we got with the gas motors. FF 20 years later and the power on these diesels have now doubled. Hopefully, Ford has solved their death wobble issue by now. Also, fuel economy is better than ever. In addtion to all these, is the ability to drive these new diesels without so much as a hint of diesel smell or smoke. That is a terrific advancement and one that I think is better for everyone. Sure, removing all the smog equipment might make for better power and fuel economy, but the improvement is a price I'm personally willing to make. I'm too old to even consider going the delete route and always looking over my shoulders, or worry about putting everything back if I need warranty service. I like my conscience clear and I like sleeping good at night. If it costs a few bucks/month to have that, I'll take it.
    -----------------------------------------------
    There 's no such thing as idiot-proof; idiots are far too ingenuous.
    JD3120 eHydro, R4's, 300cx FEL, frontier 2060bb, Vrismo S100 Flail mower, AL1240f forks, wheel weights

  4. #94
    Silver Member
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    Dec 2010
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    Love, VA
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    Kubota B7100 HST 4WD

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by Superduper View Post
    Anyone that has ever towed anything significant with both a gas and a diesel knows that for towing, there simply is nothing better than the torque/fuel economy combination that diesels provide.

    I used to tow cars for a living. My own business, actually. We had gas motors, we had diesels. As a professional operator, after trying both, there is no way that I would go back. Are new gas motors durable? Absolutely. But make it tow 10k day/in, day/out and suddenly it's not as durable anymore.

    For me, this isn't a commercial tow vehicle, it's for personal enjoyment and not my only vehicle, although for my occassional towing needs, it will now do all of those chores since I don't like feeling like I'm overloaded with my other vehicles. I love the excess braking capacity, the tremendous power, the fuel mileage, and the transmission is the icing on the cake. For some reason, a toasted tranny worries me more than anything else on a vehicle, perhaps from bad experiences. These tranny failures along with their big $$ cost usually manifest at the worse time. For me, the allison option has been what I've been waiting for forever, and great for peace of mind. I fix most everything else on my own. I don't touch tranny's though.

    Maybe in the end, I saved a few penny's, and then again, maybe I end up a few pennies short by going with a diesel. I'm not going to worry about it, I bought it, and I'm going to have to live with it for at least 6 years, terms of my zero % financing.

    As for EPA, CARB, and all that. I know this much: 2 decades ago, I inhaled diesel fumes all day, every day. You got near the tow truck and diesel was all you smelled. The trucks had great torque right off idle and it was the price we paid for those benefits. Fuel mileage was good too. Not great -- averaged 12-13 mpg. But much better than the 7-10 we got with the gas motors. FF 20 years later and the power on these diesels have now doubled. Hopefully, Ford has solved their death wobble issue by now. Also, fuel economy is better than ever. In addtion to all these, is the ability to drive these new diesels without so much as a hint of diesel smell or smoke. That is a terrific advancement and one that I think is better for everyone. Sure, removing all the smog equipment might make for better power and fuel economy, but the improvement is a price I'm personally willing to make. I'm too old to even consider going the delete route and always looking over my shoulders, or worry about putting everything back if I need warranty service. I like my conscience clear and I like sleeping good at night. If it costs a few bucks/month to have that, I'll take it.
    All good points, but I don't get where you state that fuel economy is better than ever. There isn't a new diesel out there that will get what my 12 valve does. I know that the new Ford is rated at 24, but I also know an owner who is getting 16 in the real world- my 12 valve (unless towing heavy) doesn't get that on the worse day. Fact is, EPA mandates has hurt fuel mileage on all diesels, and the manufactures are struggling to get them back up to what they used to be, whether they are Cummins, Isuzu, or Ford.
    "For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ..." Romans 1:16
    Kubota B7100 HST 4WD
    94 Dodge Ram 2500 CTD

  5. #95
    Platinum Member Superduper's Avatar
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    midwest
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    John Deere 3120

    Default

    I'm saying my new diesel is getting better economy than my ford 6.9 and 7.3's of 20 years ago did.
    -----------------------------------------------
    There 's no such thing as idiot-proof; idiots are far too ingenuous.
    JD3120 eHydro, R4's, 300cx FEL, frontier 2060bb, Vrismo S100 Flail mower, AL1240f forks, wheel weights

  6. #96
    Gold Member Bigkrank's Avatar
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    Jan 2009
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    NW Ohio

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    I sure didn't buy my diesel for economy, resale or anything else other than pulling trailers. I've had every big three gas pickup made and still own two for driving around everyday and errands. I'll not go back anytime soon to use a current technology gas one for real work.
    Several garden tractor pullers
    Kubota B2630
    Kubota ZD28
    Ford 655D backhoe
    Bobcat T190, various attachments
    Numerous Farmalls

  7. #97
    Gold Member
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    Nov 2011
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    385
    Location
    Louisville, KY burbs

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    I would consider a gas truck with a good turbo. I think the EcoBoost is a great idea and perhaps they will make a bigger one for the bigger trucks. As much as it pains me to say it, if Ford put their 3.5TT into the Expedition EL, and I was updating my SUV today, I would definitely test drive one and compare against the Suburban, and I really like my Suburban.

    There's probably nothing stopping them from using the same technology in a bigger gas engine if they decide they want to offer an alternative to their diesel.

  8. #98
    Super Member timswi's Avatar
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    Nov 2008
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    Beaver County Pa
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    Kubota BX23 TLB, Kubota RTV1100, Kubota Z724 & Polaris Sportsman 570 Touring

    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffsw6 View Post
    I would consider a gas truck with a good turbo. I think the EcoBoost is a great idea and perhaps they will make a bigger one for the bigger trucks. As much as it pains me to say it, if Ford put their 3.5TT into the Expedition EL, and I was updating my SUV today, I would definitely test drive one and compare against the Suburban, and I really like my Suburban.

    There's probably nothing stopping them from using the same technology in a bigger gas engine if they decide they want to offer an alternative to their diesel.
    Personally, I like normally asperated V8's in the trucks I buy...Nothing like a V8..My 6.2 GMC averages 16mpg in mixed driving and 20 on the highway..No fuel management either. I'm perfectly happy with it driving at least 70 miles round trip to work....I looked at a DMAX when I bought this one, just couldn't justify the 10K premium..I only tow on weekends anyway and the 6.2 does just fine for that.
    BX23TLB with 54" MMM
    RTV1100 with 72" Power Angle Plow
    Z724 ZTR
    Polaris Sportsman 570 Touring

  9. #99
    Veteran Member Deere Dude's Avatar
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    Hohenwald, TN
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    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by Dmace View Post
    Taking your problems out on Dodge is dumb in this case. You got a bad truck, it happens and unfortunately you had a bad dealer on top of that.

    Back to the question of Duramax mpgs...
    Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, I'm a dumb *****. If I got reamed like that I'd never get another one either. Maybe it's shortsighted, but I have dumped manufacturers or dealers or contractors or restaurants for a lot less than that and will never go back. Unless the price is right

  10. #100
    Veteran Member Deere Dude's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Real World" diesel fuel mileage on Duramax

    Quote Originally Posted by Diamondpilot View Post
    Yep, external tranny filter must be changed at 500 miles to keep the warranty valid on the Allison.

    Chris
    Does anyone drop the pan on the Allison and change the internal filter? I have 91000 on mine and the dealer said I should but that seems like a lot of work to me. I thought the reason for the external filter is so that doesn't have to be done.

    2002 GMC Diesel dually. Babying it pulling 17,000 camper from Florida driving 65-67, generally got 11 mph. If I really push it generally get around 10 or so. A couple tanks I got 12.25 and I was tickled. Maybe I got some good fuel for a change. Just running around empty maybe about 16-17. The best stretch for a couple tanks was a hair over 21.

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