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  1. #41
    Super Member mjncad's Avatar
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    A couple

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by buickanddeere View Post
    Westcliff has raised a major point . The EPA personal want employment security and power. They will always invent another crisis to monitor .
    No different than government welfare departs . If poverty was solved these welfare department employees would be out of work.
    The worst special interest influencing the Gummint is the Gummint itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by dodge man View Post
    Another thing to keep in mind, many of the people on this forum live in areas where air pollution isn't a big issue. There are parts of the country where its a real problem. When someone talked about "burn bans" where on certain days they can't burn wood for heat it kind of opened my eyes.
    We've had "burn bans" in the metro Denver area for many years now when the air quality is crappy. The exception is for people who heat their homes solely with wood. When I was a kid, every back yard in my typical suburban neighborhood had a small concrete incinerator for burning trash. The Gummint put a stop to that in the late 60's or early 70's as I recall.

    Quote Originally Posted by aczlan View Post
    Always made me wonder why it is better for the environment to burn twice as much fuel to meet the new emissions standards...

    Aaron Z
    Don't you just love the pretzel-logic of the Gummint?
    Paraphrasing Douglas Adams - So long and thanks for all the bacon.

  2. #42
    Super Member
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    Shingle Springs California
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    New Holland TC40D

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Yes. I grew up in the great Sacramento Calif area. I remember clear summer days as a kid in the 70's.

    Not any more. Even with all the smog on cars/trucks, we get some icky air in the summer. And during the winter, in the valley, they have burn ban on fire places/woodstoves, because air quality gets bad.

    As much as I dislike what the smog equipment has done to price and power of vehicles, this and many other area's with similar topology and population would have horrid air quality.

    Quote Originally Posted by dodge man View Post
    Another thing to keep in mind, many of the people on this forum live in areas where air pollution isn't a big issue. There are parts of the country where its a real problem. When someone talked about "burn bans" where on certain days they can't burn wood for heat it kind of opened my eyes.
    RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

  3. #43
    Super Member
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    New Holland TC40D

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    How as voters would you change that though? I think we need some of the emission control, but also think the EPA is out of control and should be reigned in to more reasonable expectations. They are an agency, they are not elected. ???

    Quote Originally Posted by buickanddeere View Post
    Westcliff has raised a major point . The EPA personal want employment security and power. They will always invent another crisis to monitor .
    No different than government welfare departs . If poverty was solved these welfare department employees would be out of work.
    RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

  4. #44
    Veteran Member JESSE1's Avatar
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    Kilgore, Texas
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    JD 6400

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    I have owned diesel pickups since '82, starting with an '82 GMC 2500 with a 6.2 diesel that had about 130hp and 250 lb/ft torque. I've had Fords with the 6.9, 7.3, 7.3 Turbo, 7.3 Powerstroke, 6.0 and 6.4. I currently have a '12 F-450 pickup with a 6.7 Powerstroke that has 400 hp and 800 lb/ft torque. Even with the complex emissions equipment on the '12, there's no way I'd trade it for any of my earlier diesel trucks. This engine is smooth, quiet and powerful and with the 6 speed trans and 4.30 axle ratio is a towing monster. Non-towing mileage can be as high as 17 while towing drops down to 10. Adding the DEF is a non-issue and the regenerations occur without even noticing them.
    6400 John Deere w/ cab, JD 535 Baler, 997 ZTR Diesel, 72" 7 Iron deck, Kubota RTV-X1100C

  5. #45
    Elite Member Bob77064's Avatar
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    KY @ TN line
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    2011 LS R3039

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    When the catalytic converters first came out on the gas engines in the early 70's. There were all kinds of problems, they got plugged up and the engines would hardly run, they got so hot they started fires etc. It took several years to get it right.

  6. #46
    Veteran Member
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    Kubota B3200, Ford NAA, IH 454D, Case 1845C

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by crazyal View Post
    What about a welder who owns his/ her own business and needs a diesel to haul their welder and steel to jobs? Diesel trucks are not bought just by rich folks who want to feel like a trucker.
    Quote Originally Posted by cockeyedMFer View Post
    To each his own, but if I was in that spot I couldn't justify spending $50,000 when a $5,000 or $10,000 truck, paid for with cash, would accomplish the task. Its not like the truck is going to improve the weld quality.
    I agree completely, if you are having trouble feeding your family you have too much money in equipment (toys.)

    As for the emission stuff, I too wonder how burning almost twice the fuel makes for a cleaner environment. Not only are you burning it, but it takes lots of energy/pollution to make it. It's not just the diesels either, look at today's so called 'economy cars'. They get worse mileage than their predecessors of twenty years prior.
    Kubota B3200
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  7. #47
    Elite Member
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    Ford 3930

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Verticaltrx View Post
    I agree completely, if you are having trouble feeding your family you have too much money in equipment (toys.)

    As for the emission stuff, I too wonder how burning almost twice the fuel makes for a cleaner environment. Not only are you burning it, but it takes lots of energy/pollution to make it. It's not just the diesels either, look at today's so called 'economy cars'. They get worse mileage than their predecessors of twenty years prior.
    A buddy of mine had a '78 VW Rabbit. Gas. 40mpg. Bosch mechanical fuel injection.

    Progress ?

    I've driven the Ford 6.7 diesel. Crazy power, even stock. Like that. Didn't drive it far enough to have to put fuel in it, so can't comment on mileage.

    I don't have a great sense of smell. Even, so, I only tried standing beside a 6.7 once in Regen. To quote my departed Dad "Woulda knocked a buzzard off a gut wagon". Won't do that again, and I can't imagine it is healthy to be within 500 feet of a Regen.

    Progress ? Cough, Cough.......

    Rgds, D.

  8. #48
    Elite Member
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    Ontario, Canada
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    Ford 3930

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Remains to be seen if the Extra Profit Overlords will allow this DuroTorq into USA/Canada.

    New Ford Transit and Transit Connect Debut - PickupTrucks.com News

    That era of diesel has had great field tests (non Ford performed) in Asia.

    Would be really nice to have a diesel van choice here, instead of just Mercedes.

    Rgds, D.

  9. #49
    Elite Member
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    John Deere 1070

    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Verticaltrx View Post
    I agree completely, if you are having trouble feeding your family you have too much money in equipment (toys.)

    As for the emission stuff, I too wonder how burning almost twice the fuel makes for a cleaner environment. Not only are you burning it, but it takes lots of energy/pollution to make it. It's not just the diesels either, look at today's so called 'economy cars'. They get worse mileage than their predecessors of twenty years prior.
    This reminds me of a study that someone did on some small "eco" car- I believe the prius. The carbon footprint from the manufacturing of this car... i.e. the copper being strip mined etc... was so large that you would have to have it the road for something like 50 years to actually break even with driving another gas car. I can't remember who did the study as it was a few years ago, so I can't comment on the credibility. I imagine it may be somewhat exaggerated, but there's probably some truth to it.

  10. #50
    Super Member crazyal's Avatar
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    Default Re: New diesels and emissions. A bad thing?

    Quote Originally Posted by cockeyedMFer View Post
    To each his own, but if I was in that spot I couldn't justify spending $50,000 when a $5,000 or $10,000 truck, paid for with cash, would accomplish the task. Its not like the truck is going to improve the weld quality.
    Would it? I can tell you for a fact that for $10k you are not going to find a reliable truck you can use for a business. If it was just simply buying a truck that can haul your tools and supplies then life would be easy. But when you're truck is your lifeblood to your business you can't afford to spend $10k on 15 year old truck and have it not start in the morning. Also when you drive up to a job for the first time the shape of your vehicle is the first impression people make on how trustworthy you are.

    Some friends of mine do cement work. All they do is finish floors. Several cement contractors subcontract out the basement floors to them. After pouring the footing and the walls they call these brothers in to do the floor. They drive a 1 ton box truck that they have to have the rear springs beefed up to hold all of their equipment. Every two years they replace it, usually they've put more than 100k on it. Because they often haul a trailer load of rebar they always get a diesel. They have been doing this for decades. Through experience they found out that one lost day quickly cascades into major problems. First if a schedule others are also following looses a day because you didn't show up then they just lost a day too. Nothing turns your business's name into mud that failing to show up. Second if you have to go to a job a day late because a contractor is screaming at you for impacting their job you now have to figure out how you are going to do yesterday's work and today's work in one day. It's not a big deal as long as you were planning on being at the same job both days but if you have another job lined up that's a real problem.

    It's real easy to say that 1 tons diesel are bought by rich white guys and the hardest they will ever get worked is to pick up a loaf of bread but the fact is there are lots of people who buy them because they are just as important as any other tool they own.
    Kubota L4240,Case 580K backhoe, Case 450 Dozer

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