Some things about new Yanmars that could REALLY be better designed.

[TnAndy]

About a year or so ago, some Yanmar factory folks came to my local dealership, and he brought them out to my place to get my opinion on the LX410 I'd bought from him. He gave me a day's warning, so I wrote up several pages of things I thought could use some better design. They were kinda wide eyed over it, but I hope they took my suggestions to heart, and went back to their drawing boards.

Well, HERE IS ANOTHER ONE.

Dadgum parking brake handle. Came with a little plastic grip on the end of the metal handle that lasted about 3-4 months before it came off, I put it back on, it came off, I put it back on, and finally it came off, fell to the ground and I left it laying there (somewhere....don't even know where I lost it...who cares...little piece of crap.....).

So for a couple years, been just using the metal end of the handle that sticks out right above the brake pedals.

Now 'maybe' I abuse things...I don't think so....but sometimes when I engage the parking brake, it's because my tractor is in a really sloped position, and I REALLY step on the brakes. To release the brakes, I step on the handle end because the brake is so engaged, it simply won't release by hand....plus the dadgum handle is down below your knees and I had to contort around to get to it by hand.

SO, last evening was one of those REALLY set the brakes deals, and when I stepped on the handle to release it, it not only didn't release but the handle wadded up sideways and disappeared under the plastic cover ! I had lower the bucket on the front loader into the sloped ground I was on, then get off and take a pry bar to lift the brake release lever off the brakes. GRRRRRRRRRR.....

So today, I fixed the BLEEPING cheap thing.

Removed the brake handle assembly. I'd already cut the handle off by the time I decided pics were in order, so that is why the vice grip pliers are holding it in place on the release pawl. Also, this is AFTER I'd put it in a vice and straighten it around to close to normal.

The reason I think it bent all around is the metal used is only 1" x 1/8" (slightly over)

I used a pc of 1 1/4" x 1/4" flat bar.

Cut a rounded place in the end of it to fit good around the welded bushing (for the pivot stud) on the brake pawl, at approximately the same angle the former piece was welded.

Then cut/welded the new metal to about what the old one was, plus added a foot STOMPING pedal (3" long) out of the flat bar on the end instead of a little plastic grip that kept coming off.

So here is the new parking brake lever, in place.

IF you decide to do this:

There is a small, (like 50 cent pc size)round spring behind the pawl, that comes off when you remove the pawl....let me tell ya, a REAL PITA to get back on. Worked on it about an hour with vice grip needlenose, and so on....could NOT get it back in the back hole. No room to work with the pawl trying to slide forward....plus you're almost upside down and looking into everything painted BLACK. Took a silver Sharpie and marked the hole on the back plate so I could SEE the fool thing.

I finally took an old, large screwdriver I'd been using as a pry bar anyway, and cut a "V" notch in the tip, that I assume sorta matches the tool they have at the factory for installing the pawl. You put the spring tit in the pawl, and start it back on the pivot stud, the stick the special tool on the backside of the pawl catch the other spring tit in the V and push it back until it goes in the hole it was in before. With your third hand, you keep pressure inward on the pawl and slip the screwdriver back out, then push the pawl all the way home.

 

[TnAndy]

Another thing....the brake pawl itself.

Is there something about manufacturing that says "take two pieces of 1/8" steel plate and weld them (sandwich) together" rather than use a piece of 1/4" plate to begin with ? I don't get it. Seems like the labor to weld two pieces together would cost more than if they simply used a thicker piece to start with ?

Look at the first pic above. You can see the seam where the two pieces were joined, with a spot weld holding them together. WHAT is that about ?

Ran into the same thing on a 50's model Oliver manure spreader I restored the past winter. There was a plate on either side they mounted the main axle bearing in....about 12" square....the bearings failed (probably because it was near impossible to get at the grease fittings), and seized to the axle, then spun in that plate and wollowed it out.

When I got to looking at what I thought was the ONLY decent piece of metal on the thing, (the bed was thin junk, mostly long rusted out and gone, the "channel" they used under the bed wasn't REAL channel....simply folded, thin sheet metal that looked like channel) I could see they had done the same thing...two pieces of 1/8" plate, edge welded together.

What the heck ? I sandwiched a couple of pieces of 1/4" plate on either side of the old plate, then drilled out for the axle and new flange mount bearings.

So WHAT is this deal of using thin metal and edge welding ? Somebody in manufacturing want to clue me in ?

 

[TnAndy]

OK....while I'm in RANT mode....

Anybody had their back link "tighteners" (for lack of the proper term) bend or break ? The linkage between the lower lift arms and the axle that has multiple holes with a pin you drop in to tighten up the lower arms so your implement on the back doesn't sway left-right.

When I first got the tractor, I broke BOTH of them. Dealer replaced under warranty, though he had a dickens of a time even getting a set.....finally had to call down to Georgia and I think they took a set off the assembly line to send him.

Well, the other day, I bent another one. And by the looks of the metal (seems to be some sort of fairly soft, cast stuff...not forged for sure), if I try to straighten it, it will simply break too. This seems to happen when I've got my skidding winch on....and when I pull a log even slightly sideways, the stress causes the bend (then the break). Pretty sure it's only the winch....but in 14 years of using the same winch on my 1925 New Holland, I NEVER had this issue.

So I'm wondering if the metal they are making these out of is simply CRAP. Seems like a fairly stout hunk of metal, but it sure doesn't hold up.

Guess I'll be redesigning and building a decent set of linkage in the near future as well.....

Right side, still as it should be:

Left side, with about a 45 degree bend in it:

 

[TnAndy]

And ANOTHER thing: (this was on my list to the factory folks)

I change rear implements a LOT at times. Not unusual for me to change 3 times in a day when it's planting time...sub soiler, plow, disc/tiller, layoff marking plow I built, etc.....

The rear lift raise/lower handle. The one on my New Holland was on the right fender. Rear easy to reach, on or off the tractor.

The Yanmar is located down in beside the seat and to the back of the seat. Not only is it hard to rear while you're IN the seat, but trying to hook up an implement while off the tractor and in the back is near impossible.....I can't reach over the fender (and I'm 6' tall) to get to it to raise/lower the lift a fraction. You have to step up on the step at a minimum (which is WHY I added a step to the right side which Yanmar should have put on from the get-go.....Another in the list I have the factory guys).

I've learned to reach back in under the right fender and jiggle the lever going from the operator handle to the transmission, but even that is kinda awkward, and if the handle slips into the slot at the top, it won't move unless you get back up on the tractor and take it out of the slot.

So, my proposed fix is:

1. Bolt a small pc of flat plate or plastic or something so the handle CAN'T slip back in a slot...ever.

2. Weld a T handle on the lever back under the fender to you have something to grab, rather than have to fumble around under the fender trying to get the lever in hand. (lot of stuff in the way).

That's my next rainy day project....fixing stuff that shouldn't even need fixing.

 

[TnAndy]

I wish guys that design and build stuff would have to work with what they turn out for a while in the REAL WORLD.....they'd go back with a whole new perspective on life.

 

[Katahdin]

I like your parking brake mod, I too use my foot to engage/disengage it and wondered what others were doing. I haven't had any issues with the plastic grip coming off or getting stuck yet but if it does I'll keep this thread in mind.

I also have broken a lift arm stabilizer, at the time I was bush-hogging in reverse and I had the top-and-tilt kit installed. I wondered at the time if using a tilt cylinder in place of the factory lift arm levellers created a situation where the lift arms could flex more and put more stress on the stabilizers. The day I was working I just welded the stabilizer back together. I did purchase a new one stabilizer weeks later and my dealer had the part in stock, at least they are cheap to replace. $20? I agree its made of a weaker metal, and made in India according to the packaging. I think tho I'd rather have the stabilizers break then bust up the casting where they connect to the axle housing, so be careful not to construct a super-string alternative.

As for reaching that three point factory lever, I'm 5'11" and can reach over fender to reach the lever when attaching implements. I think the difference must be that I have narrower Ag tires then your R4s that allow me to do this. I agree the lever would be more comfortable if lengthened.

One other issue you might want to keep an eye on is the bolt under the loader joystick. This bolt holds the pivot point in place inside the loader joystick. Mine worked itself loose after 200 hours an I had to re-tighten it. My dealer was already aware of the issue and suggested using loc-tite on the bolt. I assume tho the joystick is not a factory Yanmar part but sourced from a hydraulic control vendor. FYI...the bolt is 14mm and you can reach it from under the tractor using a long socket extension if anyone wants to check for play or tightness.

In any event, thanks for making us aware of these issues and proposing creative ways to fix them!

 

[TnAndy]

Thanks for the loader joystick tip....I'll watch it. THAT was a weakness in my former NH. They used an aluminum piece at that point, and I managed to break it twice in 14 years. You'd be operating the loader when all of a sudden the stick would just flop over to one side and you had no more control of the loader.

 

[CalG]

Do you apply the brakes at the pedal before trying to force the release lever? That method has never failed me yet.

If the sway links are adgusted to come to play when under TENSION, they are much less vulnerable to failure. Compression loads are much more problematic. Adjust the free play of one link against the other until all the tension is used up on one before the compressed one is bound up.

The loader link?

Now that's is a problem ;-)

 

[Raised on a Deere]

Do you apply the brakes at the pedal before trying to force the release lever? That method has never failed me yet.

If the sway links are adgusted to come to play when under TENSION, they are much less vulnerable to failure. Compression loads are much more problematic. Adjust the free play of one link against the other until all the tension is used up on one before the compressed one is bound up.

The loader link?

Now that's is a problem ;-)

I too broke one but was happy it was not expensive to replace. I realized they are not designed to be in compression and now I make sure one picks up tension before the other is in compression just as you described. Just works out great but not at first intuitive. Just adding my two cents that yea the can be broken but it is no big thing to deal with.

 

[AxleHub]

Saw this thread and I'd like to add my two cents.

1. Why would a manufacturer use two pieces of eighth inch metal and edge welds or spot weld them together? 2 reasons . You can bend or stamp form 1/8 th inch metal together with smaller equipment and more speed than you can 1/4 inch. Everything is easier and cheaper in 1/8th inch . . . You machine quarter inch . . You form 1/8 th inch.

2. Cast metal hook based items break and wear. Of course they do . . Cast metal is easier to add fillers and cheaper alloys. Cast metal is hard (not strong). Cast metal is brittle . . . Not stress absorbing. Cast metal has no "give" . . It is cast or poured into shape. Forged metal is strong and flexible but again its much more expensive in cost and time. (stamping and forging are two completely different things).

The race in manufacturing is to make reliable parts faster and cheaper. The race in cheap manufacturing to use less quality control . . and not only produce and package cheaper but use cheaper material quality too. To accomplish that you form and cast instead of forge and fit. You use smaller equipment in faster speed situations with convenient fastening (like spot welds, clamp fastening, and slip and pressure fits).