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  1. #1
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    1,288
    Location
    S.E Texas
    Tractor
    Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020

    Default Buyers Remorse

    It would seem that the situation concerning new tractor owners, having purchased imports from S.E. Asia has prompted many (very many) emails & PM's, and frankly I am at a loss for some of their questions.

    Most often I refer them to the parts suppliers who are well established-and do this by their area in relation to the customrs location. The most recent question was: "Am I supossed to have four in line fuses attached (and taped) to the bottom of my fuse block?" "The dealer said they often do that to insure electrical safety" Wow. After initial shock I asked if there were any accessories, lights, winch, anything like that? "Yes, I got a rototiller with it".

    For me, it's difficult to just blow them off. I did verify that it was not private party and it is a tractor not imported from Japan. Recognized the dealers name almost immediately.

    Difficult to help, as now they are intimedated and many will not post-ask for help openly. I try and always respond with: I am not an expert but.....

    For fear of beating a dead horse, I do wish there was one descriptive, well though out answer that states (warns) of what may happen. Maybe something that signals the potential owner with "BEFORE YOU BUY".... Personally, I am trying to help, not bash, and as of yet never said I told you so.

    Regards, Mark

  2. #2
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    2,086
    Location
    SW Ohio
    Tractor
    yanmar

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    Mark et al,
    Ditto and ditto. WHY oh WHY do people keep buying from sources that offer no follow up? </font><font color="blue" class="small">( I did verify that it was not private party and it is a tractor not imported from Japan. Recognized the dealers name almost immediately.
    )</font> Whether wholesale or retail, your supplier/dealer should be of help to you.
    </font><font color="blue" class="small">( For me, it's difficult to just blow them off. )</font> I understand the feeling, however.....try a minimum of 3-4 calls/week with an average closer to 10/week for several years, plus the emails....and perhaps it becomes understandable why we don't deal with those calls. They are almost always "library calls"--How does this work, what does this do?--and the vast majority won't even spring the few $$ for a manual.

    I KNOW there are other dealers like us, who supply follow up. Yes, we are higher priced than the scrap tractors. Our customers get: a packet we assemble with general maintenance info, general safety info (and links to lots more), filter crosses, fluid specs, and a parts layout. They also get our undivided attention when they call/email with a question. And we make it clear we expect questions. In the rare instance we haven't had the answer to a service question, we get the answer...we don't send the customer off surfing the web. Maybe that's why so few of our customers ever show up on bulletin boards.

    99% of the people who shop us ask "where do I get parts/service" in their first visit. Are others not asking? Are the sellers lying? Why would you buy somewhere knowing they cannot/will not support your purchase?

  3. #3
    Super Member Inspector507's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    5,817
    Location
    Central Ohio

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    Because they're probably being told "It's the same as a John Deere, all parts are available there"

    I was told that on more than one occasion, and did not look back on my way down the road [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

  4. #4
    Elite Member Tractors4u's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    2,542
    Location
    Athens Alabama
    Tractor
    Deere 4310, Kubota L355, John Deere SST18 Spin Steer, 2006 Polaris Ranger

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    Sometimes people buy from the guy that tells them what they want to hear. A while back I had a guy looking at a YM1700 I had. He asked if it had live PTO and I told him no. He then told me that the guy out on the highway had a 1700 and his had a live PTO. I told him that it didn't. He said yes it did and that he would rather have the one with live PTO. Before he left I told him to make the seller demonstrate the live PTO. These S.E. Asia tractors look real pretty and they are cheap, that is all an uninformed buyer needs to see.

  5. #5
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    1,288
    Location
    S.E Texas
    Tractor
    Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    EXACTLY.

    I wonder if the highway 1700 had the optional inline fuse safety enhancements?

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    885
    Location
    S Illinois
    Tractor
    Iseki TA 207

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    The first couple of years I sold tractors, I made a third of my income from it. The last year I made almost nothing. I now repair and service the other guy's tractors. I at least get to tinker with tractors. I really enjoy them. The market has changed so much in the last few years it has taken the fun out of it. That is the way retail goes. If it isn't WalMart it is someone else cutting into your profit. You just have to adapt. One guy can't change it back to how it was. If the changes make it as unprofitable for you as it did me, adapt or find a new business before it makes you crazy.

  7. #7
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    1,288
    Location
    S.E Texas
    Tractor
    Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    Guys.....I will not go quietly into the night. No insults intended.

    Correct me if I am wrong, but if I read between the lines; Your business suffered from the import of tractors from S.E.Asia and the price increase of imports directly from Japan.

    We are all suffering to various degrees. I think that's how the discussion started - and adapting is what I, and others, are trying to do, Make the transition.

    I am small by comparison and the bigger your operation the more you have at stake.

    Stop complaining? Get over it? Do something else? Well, that's one way of looking at it.


  8. #8
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    3,512

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    Seems to me you guys are confusing "used tractor lots" with "dealerships". I don't believe I would expect anything from a "used tractor lot" except a tractor, little or no warranty, no parts, no service, maybe a " have a nice day".

  9. #9
    Super Member California's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    5,750
    Location
    Sonoma County
    Tractor
    Yanmar YM240, YM186D, and another YM186D

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    I've been thinking about this.

    It seems to me that the established dealers who are hostile, or derogatory, to innocent newbies aren't helping the situation.

    As Mark notes it's a new market now with a flood of cheap rebuilds arriving. American reconditioners can't compete with Vietnamese wages, minimum wage there is $45 per month and I'll bet most of that reconditioning work is done at minimum wage.

    And these reconditioned tractors have a month of labor in them as I figure it - Vina's website says their VN reconditioning facility has 300 employees and reconditions 4000 tractors per year. That's an output of 1.1 tractor per employee per month. Those employees aren't just sitting around, they are working desperately hard if those shops are anything like the Nike factories that made the news a couple of years ago.

    With this cost differential the reconditioning is inevitably going to shift offshore.

    So... I think these new buyers, the ones that Mark says are fearful to ask questions after they decide they have been ripped off, should be welcomed into the family of Yanmar owners. The first time they call an established dealer they should be told what 'everyone' knows, that a complete tractor includes a manual with operating instructions and safety info as well as a parts manual. I suppose you can add 'don't call back until you have read the manual' if you want.

    That customer will soon learn there are several mail-order dealers on the internet who can supply nearly anything. It's not in your interest to turn him away the first time he calls.

    By the time that buyer calls, it's too late to warn them about different rebuild qualities and unsupported models. Ridiculing them at this point isn't going to strengthen the Yanmar image overall since they will just complain somewhere else.

    Perhaps that model specification page that many dealers have on their website should identify the unsupportable models to guide the newbies away from buying them and dry up demand for them. In another thread someone noted that YM1600, YM1900, and YM2200 have poor parts availability. I've seen another (former) poster say he would never knowingly import a Hinomoto because parts are no longer made. This sort of information has to be out there while the newbie is researching a potential purchase - no use telling him after he has one.


    And on a lighter note - someone needs to offer an improved fuse panel. Mine was original but the cover was in the toolbox because it wouldn't stay attached. The headlight and turn signal fuses were gone and I couldn't find replacements locally. Those tiny screws fall on the shop floor the first time you unscrew them since they are shorter than expected- I can't imagine changing a fuse out in the middle of a rice paddy. Overall, a bad design.

    I put ring terminals on inline fuse holders so I could attach them to those original screws, and that's as close to authentic as I thought it deserved.

    Here's an opportunity for someone to market a new replacement part: a fuse panel with modern blade fuses.


    Norm: just saw your post as I was about to post this. Yes, that's the essence of the issue - there are dealers selling and supporting good used Japanese tractors who have an opportunity to provide support to the orphan rebuilds that are sold on Ebay and from roadside lots. In my opinion it doesn't make any sense to shun the orphans.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Buyers Remorse

    A general purpose blade type fuse box is available at many auto parts stores. Put one in my YM2200 and was even able to use the mounting holes from the old box. Love my 2200 despite the effort required to locate parts, and it was probably a Vietnam rebuild. The price was right and they fixed most of the problems. I would probably have a different reaction if I was not a shade tree mechanic though. Many thanks to all the folks on these forums who support the grey market Yanmars.

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