Ballast -- can you overdo it?

ddb123 · Jan 3, 2012

I just got a six foot brush hog for my Kubota L4300. I don't really need a hog this large, but it was cheap so I bought it. I finally hooked it up today and made some passes out in my "field" and I was really pleased with the results.

However, this thing is HEAVY. I could have had a six foot King Kutter for less but I bought this one because it was considerably heavier. Now I'm wondering if I wouldn't have been better off with the lighter one! My tractor picks it up and runs it fine, but I'm sure that front end is pretty light. If I recall, my base tractor weighs about 2800 pounds. The loader, bucket, subframe weigh about 1200 pounds, so that brings the total up to right around 4000 pounds.

So does anyone know how the weight is situated? Obviously a good amount of that is out front with the loader and engine. And these things look like they're beefy in back with that big axle and big tires and wheels. I just got to wondering about it because at one point I was going uphill (probably 30 degree incline) and thought "huh, I wonder if this thing could tip over backwards?" I have no idea how much the brush hog weighs, but I'm sure it's several hundred pounds. I guess the 3pt is rated to lift more like 2500 pounds, so I have nothing to worry about, right?

(the tractor is sitting on uneven ground in the photo, that's why the front wheel looks a little wonky)

Jerry/MT · Jan 3, 2012

ddb123 said:
I just got a six foot brush hog for my Kubota L4300. I don't really need a hog this large, but it was cheap so I bought it. I finally hooked it up today and made some passes out in my "field" and I was really pleased with the results.

However, this thing is HEAVY. I could have had a six foot King Kutter for less but I bought this one because it was considerably heavier. Now I'm wondering if I wouldn't have been better off with the lighter one! My tractor picks it up and runs it fine, but I'm sure that front end is pretty light. If I recall, my base tractor weighs about 2800 pounds. The loader, bucket, subframe weigh about 1200 pounds, so that brings the total up to right around 4000 pounds.

So does anyone know how the weight is situated? Obviously a good amount of that is out front with the loader and engine. And these things look like they're beefy in back with that big axle and big tires and wheels. I just got to wondering about it because at one point I was going uphill (probably 30 degree incline) and thought "huh, I wonder if this thing could tip over backwards?" I have no idea how much the brush hog weighs, but I'm sure it's several hundred pounds. I guess the 3pt is rated to lift more like 2500 pounds, so I have nothing to worry about, right?

(the tractor is sitting on uneven ground in the photo, that's why the front wheel looks a little wonky)

I think your concern is unfounded. I have a 6 ft KingKutter that weighs 725 lbs and I can lift it and drive it around with my little Ferguson TO-30 without problems. Having said that, the steering on that 2400 lb machine is pretty light with the cutter on.

Tractor data .com says your tractor weighs in at 3450lbs so with your 1200 loader it's around 4650 lbs the addition of the loader moves the cg slightly forward. With the mower on, depending on the weight and the cg of the mower, the cg of the system will move back slightly. If we knew the weight and cg logation of the tractor and all the components we could calculate where the system cg was at. The fore and aft cg position is probably not much different from the baseline tractor.
If your lift is rated at 2500 lbs( that's usually rated at 2 ft aft of the links), raising the mower will not even strain it.

Now when the mower is on and you drive up hill remember the top link on the mower will limit the rotation of the mower and barring a failure of the top link system or three point structure, you won't tip over. You also have a ROPS so if you're belted in you'd be safe. Having said that, you really want to mow going down hill in a lower gear at low speed. Avoid climbing steep hills straight up slope. Traverse the slope at an angle across the slope to reduce the effective angle if you have to climp a steep hill. And make sure your ROPS is up and you're belted in.

Code54 · Jan 3, 2012

Something that size will lighten the front a fair amount but should be safe on anything but the extremely steep. One way to help is throw 200-300 lbs in the bucket and keep it low. My old tractor was a bit lighter with the hog on but it really never was a problem. The one place I always noticed it was going up a slope that was muddy or wet because the front end would break loose a fair mount easier. If I had a real steep slope I needed to hog I would just backup the slope and come down slow which worked very well for me.

RoyJackson · Jan 3, 2012

You'll know you have too much ballast when you raise the 3PH and the front wheels come off the ground instead.
(yes, this happened to me with my old 790 when I installed the ballast box before the loader...)

ddb123 · Jan 3, 2012

Jerry/MT said:
I think your concern is unfounded. I have a 6 ft KingKutter that weighs 725 lbs and I can lift it and drive it around with my little Ferguson TO-30 without problems. Having said that, the steering on that 2400 lb machine is pretty light with the cutter on.

Tractor data .com says your tractor weighs in at 3450lbs so with your 1200 loader it's around 4650 lbs the addition of the loader moves the cg slightly forward. With the mower on, depending on the weight and the cg of the mower, the cg of the system will move back slightly. If we knew the weight and cg logation of the tractor and all the components we could calculate where the system cg was at. The fore and aft cg position is probably not much different from the baseline tractor.
If your lift is rated at 2500 lbs( that's usually rated at 2 ft aft of the links), raising the mower will not even strain it.

Now when the mower is on and you drive up hill remember the top link on the mower will limit the rotation of the mower and barring a failure of the top link system or three point structure, you won't tip over. You also have a ROPS so if you're belted in you'd be safe. Having said that, you really want to mow going down hill in a lower gear at low speed. Avoid climbing steep hills straight up slope. Traverse the slope at an angle across the slope to reduce the effective angle if you have to climp a steep hill. And make sure your ROPS is up and you're belted in.

That sounds like good advice from all. I went ahead and pulled out the manuals and it says my tractor with a dry tank of gas weighs 2845 pounds. Pretty light for a 45 horse tractor. The loader with bucket together weigh 1150 lbs. Pretty heavy compared to the tractor, must mean the cg is closer to the middle or front than I thought. That brings its dry weight to 3995 lbs. What gets me is the 3pt lift can pick up 2870 lbs at the lift point. More than the tractor! It seems to me that if I really picked up that much weight then the lift arm would just break, but I guess it's made of sturdier stuff than that. It had better be!

Thanks for the words guys, I guess I was worrying that I had "too much brush hog" for nothing!

MikeInEburg · Jan 4, 2012

Another option used by many is to simply unhook the top link while mowing. This makes the mower a pull-behind - you won't feel quite so rocked and the tractor front wheels will remain firmly on the ground. Only potential peril is that there is nothing preventing the mower from flipping forward should you have a significant debris strike.
Mike

LD1 · Jan 4, 2012

I think you are fine as long as you keep the loader on.

I have a L3400, which is a few hundred lbs lighter.

And I have a Bushhog brand 306, which tipps the scales @ 1100lbs:confused2:

No issues at all as long as the loader is left on. With the loader off though, the tractor will raise the cutter, but I can physically lift the front off the ground with my bare hands. Maybe ~200lbs over the front axle:confused2:

But like I said, loader on, and there is no problems.

Qapla · Jan 4, 2012

Like others have said, it looks like you are good-to-go.

One way to check is, if you have 4WD, make sure the front wheels are "on" (in 4WD mode) and watch the front tires while you mow a bit. If they are "spinning" more then they should you may need additional front ballast. If they don't spin, you are fine.

If you "feel" like you need some additional ballast for the front, just scoop some dirt into the FEL and keep the bucket as low as possible. When you are done mowing, dump the dirt and drop the mower.

cannarella · Feb 3, 2012

Same question here for a Kubota L4310. Just picked up a Landpride RCR1872 6' mower today. I don't have a FEL, but noticed the front was kinda light. Been looking for some home made ballast boxes here but not finding what I want. Need to find something to hang off the front. Thinking 5 gallon buckets with bent rebar and concrete. Don't have many fab skills.

Andy

RoyJackson · Feb 3, 2012

cannarella said:
Same question here for a Kubota L4310. Just picked up a Landpride RCR1872 6' mower today. I don't have a FEL, but noticed the front was kinda light. Been looking for some home made ballast boxes here but not finding what I want. Need to find something to hang off the front. Thinking 5 gallon buckets with bent rebar and concrete. Don't have many fab skills.

Andy

If you don't mind spending the bucks, you can get suitcase weights for the front end.