How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans?

   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #231  
Some folks are challenged to drive a geared tractor. Obviously there are some gear heads that don’t know how to drive a HST either.

Nut behind the wheel is the biggest variable which works best.

Don’t have a transmission choice of the TLB models using now. Both HST.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #232  
All this back & forth about which is better cracks me up. If they only offered ONE variation of transmission, y’alld be whining that there’s no choices. :ROFLMAO:

Just pick the one you like. They all work fine. I have powershifts, hydro and CVT and they all have their advantages & disadvantages.

Be happy there’s choice & stop already.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #233  
I grew up with geared tractors. There weren't any other kind. Not only that, but the gears were not synchronized. So to change speed or direction meant the tractor had to come to a complete stop, muscle the shift lever to slide some large gears into new positions along a shaft, and off you go. It made loader work exhausting.
There was a reason those old shift levers were so heavily built. A shift lever was essentially a pry bar.

When the power shift/glide shift/shuttle shifts all came along it seemed like heaven had arrived. Fingertip control over what used to be a wrestling match.

Then twenty years later - about 2000 - HST became reliable enough to become popular. HST had been around a while, but at first they weren't reliable, just convenient. No mechanic I knew ever believed HST would hold up over time. But it sure has. Now we even hear some newbys saying HST is more reliable than a clutch & gears! Well, maybe so. We sure don't hear about many modern HST failures.

So what is next? In the short haul, it's surprising that modern HST trannys still have non-syncronized range shifters. That's archaic & maybe it will change.
Kubota's partly-synchronized HST Plus transmission is half a step towards being a solution now.

Or maybe we will do away with ranges entirely and go completely to a mechanical variable speed transmission. That would be as efficient as gears and even simpler.
There have always been a few tractors with completely variable speed mechanical transmissions. Now we are starting to see more of them. Some big European Ag tractors offer infinitely variable drive. So does Yanmar.

rScotty
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #234  
All this back & forth about which is better cracks me up. If they only offered ONE variation of transmission, y’alld be whining that there’s no choices. :ROFLMAO:

Just pick the one you like. They all work fine. I have powershifts, hydro and CVT and they all have their advantages & disadvantages.

Be happy there’s choice & stop already.
party pooper !!
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #235  
There's a reason they sell both gear & HST tractors. It's a personal choice. Get the one you like and best suits your needs.

By all means, lets hear why you like your choice but there is no reason to knock the other guy for his.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #236  
For one, I'm not racing. Second, I could've easily went much faster, I could even do it all in medium range but then again, not a race. Before scooping, I'm changing from medium range to low range, which I would do anyway if I had an HST. And then change back to medium to move the dirt. Range gears are there to be used and being that I used them a lot, those just slide right in every time with tip of the finger, just like the shuttle lever or the main 1-4 shifter.

Doesn't take much work at all, again using a clutch is second nature over here, just like breathing, you don't even notice you're doing it.

I'm sure HST has its place, in fact, I have no problems admitting that it would most likely be a great choice for me if I were to use the tractor only at the home propriety but the constant BS and myths thrown towards the geared transmission is just ridiculous and have no logic or sense at all. As if the HST was the holy grail and people couldn't do anything before the HST.

I can count with all the 6 fingers on my left hand the amount of HST tractors on this country. Fun fact, most are actually owned by expats. One has actually been sitting for sale since I bought mine in 2017. Then again, different uses for the tractors other than just mowing the lawn or pushing some snow.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #237  
Like I said everybody has a preference. The main question was HST vs Gear drive. The Kubota dealer did tell me that the gear drive has slightly more power. Seen it on videos also to back that statement also. And the Shuttle Shift is fast. For my use I prefer a gear drive doing mostly ground work. Plus I’m retired and 76 years old and not.racing anybody or worried about time. Been shifting gears since I was 12 years old. Not bad mouthing any transmission or make. All will do the job
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #238  
Just think if the internet was around in the 40’s and 50’s

All the IH/ Farmall people would be “Foot clutches are superior” and all the John Deere people would be “Hand clutches are superior! I want something firm to pull, just like a horses reins! What’s all this hub-bub about having to hold onto the steering wheel and throwing your foot at a pedal. Why, you’ll push yourself off the back of the seat!”

The came the 60’s and 70’s and International/Farmall was like: “What? John Deere tractors have a hand AND a foot throttle? A real farmer doesn’t need a foot throttle!”

No internet to argue back then, Instead we just got drunk at tractor pulls and fought it out.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #239  
Anything can fail but a dry clutch is a wear item that will fail. And the labor to change it is fairly expensive.
Once again, in my case (hydraulic shuttle), there is NO dry clutch at all. The ONLY thing in my bell housings is a spring loaded damper plate the takes the shock load off the end of the crankshaft during abrupt directional changes and the wet travelling clutch (inside the gearbox and immersed in fluid) is externally adjustable for lock up pressure (clamping force) though I've never had to adjust either and the one unit has a tad over 6000 hours on it, all hay harvest related and loader work.

I would never consider any tractor with a dry clutch just because of the eventual replacement cost.
 
   / How does an HST compare in pulling power with the same tractor and a gear trans? #240  
Rotary mowing, which is a mainstay of compact tractors, is better done with a hydrostat drive. The engine horsepower can be fully utilized by easily controlling ground speed to match the various cutting conditions. The drawbar horsepower is minimal pulling a rotary mower so very little difference in horsepower requirement between hydro and gear.
That is one use where my Old Ford 3000 with the 10 speed Select O Speed Powershift excelled, just click it up or down to vary speed. No wasted power in hydro heat and a fully independent PTO helped as well
I would think Kubota's Glide shift and Yanmar's powershift units would also give a hydrostat tractor of comparable Net HP a run for the money and as a bonus they don't whine.

The Hydrostat would still have an advantage with forward to backward movements while mowing, since the engine RPM can be kept at PTO speed the whole time without ever slowing the mowers blade speed.
On geared tractors imo It really does make a BIG difference whether the transmission is fully synchronized versus a sliding gear style "crash box". Stopping fully to change gears or on the move, double clutching while "grind me a pound while you are at it..."

Now that I have a backhoe with a partially syncroed range box coupled to a torque converter clutchless shuttle shift
Liking it as well- the torque converter makes it nice with over 2 times the torque multiplication no clutch leg work to deal with either. If I buy another tractor it will likely be a Cabbed unit to make winter duties more enjoyable, That means a hydrostat since it is much like mowing where it would be advantageous to stay at PTO RPM while infinitely tailoring speed to the snow blowing conditions.
Variety is the Spice of Life and any running Tractor is better than none.
 
 
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