Hydraulic maintaince questions

[ponytug]

Dear Experts,

In trying to figure out how my 1445 dumped 2+ quarts in under a minute without visible leaks, I am going through and looking for loose fittings. (Any suggestions would be most welcome.)

I have a couple of neophyte hydraulic questions;

1) What are your favorite wrenches for working on the hoses?

I seem to have little or no room for a bunch of the hoses, and it seems as if I need some thin wrenches to keep the hoses from twisting, and some thicker ones to actually tighten the hoses.
​

2) How tight is tight enough?

3) Shouldn't hoses lie flat without torsion in them?

4) Anybody concerned about hoses rubbing on the floor of the tub?
If so, what do you do about it?
If not, why not?

Thanks, as always, for the help,

Peter

 

[J_J]

Dear Experts,

In trying to figure out how my 1445 dumped 2+ quarts in under a minute without visible leaks, I am going through and looking for loose fittings. (Any suggestions would be most welcome.)

I have a couple of neophyte hydraulic questions;

1) What are your favorite wrenches for working on the hoses?

I seem to have little or no room for a bunch of the hoses, and it seems as if I need some thin wrenches to keep the hoses from twisting, and some thicker ones to actually tighten the hoses.
​

2) How tight is tight enough?

3) Shouldn't hoses lie flat without torsion in them?

4) Anybody concerned about hoses rubbing on the floor of the tub?
If so, what do you do about it?
If not, why not?

Thanks, as always, for the help,

Peter

Very thin wrenches if you can find them.

I would put a rubber pad under the hose on the bottom of the tub. The vibration will eventually rub the rubber off, and start to wear through the metal braid.

Hydraulic hose is rolled up when made and will tend to have a bend . It is hard to get a hose to lie straight. Actually, when constructing a hydraulic system, a bend is usually required for this reason. If you straighten a hydraulic hose and secure the ends, the pulsations from the hydraulics will eventually destroy a part of the line, because the hose stretches and retracts. You can see this in action, and feel it also. The hose may have 1 or 2 or 3 wire braids in them which makes them rather stiff.

Just tight enough not to leak. Some people use a pipe sealant.

That leak detector dye can be found at stores like NAPA. The instructions are on the bottle. Then you will need a black light, and a mirror to look at the bottom of the hose.

 

[Barryh]

Very thin wrenches if you can find them.

I would put a rubber pad under the hose on the bottom of the tub. The vibration will eventually rub the rubber off, and start to wear through the metal braid.

No hydraulic hose should be flat. I don't think you will ever see one. They may have 1 or 2 or 3 wire braids in them which makes them rather stiff.

Just tight enough not to leak. Some people use a pipe sealant.

That leak detector dye can be found at stores like NAPA. The instructions are on the bottle. Then you will need a black light, and a mirror to look at the bottom of the hose.

J.J. how long (ball park) do these PT hose's hold up, if out of the elements and garage kept. Are the stock one's 2 or 3 wire? Are all the stock PT hose's a certain number say as in number 3 wire, or different ones for different areas on the PT? If you know what I am trying to say.

My PT is a 2005 it only has about 100 hours on it so far. When would you say I should start thinking about replacement of hoses, hour wise under normal use.

 

[J_J]

J.J. how long (ball park) do these PT hose's hold up, if out of the elements and garage kept. Are the stock one's 2 or 3 wire? Are all the stock PT hose's a certain number say as in number 3 wire, or different ones for different areas on the PT? If you know what I am trying to say.

My PT is a 2005 it only has about 100 hours on it so far. When would you say I should start thinking about replacement of hoses, hour wise under normal use.

It is hard to say for a fact, that a hose will last for what ever hours. It depends on a lot of things. Ozone is one of the worst factors, and the UV rays do a job on them also. Some hoses last many years, and some burst open or the end adapters crack. Hose layout is important so as not to develop any wear points. I had a front wheel motor hose on my 1445 that rubbed on the lift cylinder, and burst open, and I had no control. I also had a turn cylinder rub through one of the hose. If hoses go through a hole, there should be something to protect the hose.

If the hose is not leaking, and does not have a lot of cracks in the hose, there may not be a time limit. The problem with hose cracking, is that water will get to the wire braid and rust and eventually fail. I think 2 wire is the standard, now days.

If I remember right, oil has acids, which will cause the rubber to harden and cause cracking.

 

[Barryh]

It is hard to say for a fact, that a hose will last for what ever hours. It depends on a lot of things. Ozone is one of the worst factors, and the UV rays do a job on them also. Some hoses last many years, and some burst open or the end adapters crack. Hose layout is important so as not to developer any wear points. I had a front wheel motor hose up front on my 1445 that rubbed on the lift cylinder, and burst open, and I had no control. I also had a turn cylinder rub through one of the hose. If hoses go through a hole, there should be something to protect the hose.

If the hose is not leaking, and don't have a lot of cracks in the hose, there may not be a time limit. The problem with hose cracking, is that water will get to the wire braid and rust and eventually fail. I think 2 wire is the standard, now days.

If I remember right, oil has acids, which will cause the rubber to harden and cause cracking.

I’m a big believer in preventive maintenance, guess I'll go over all of mine to make sure there are no rub points. Thanks

 

[ponytug]

Dear Barry,

There is quite a bit of advice on how to prevent rubs in the archives, but old hose can be made into some useful parts. You can slice it lengthwise and use it to make grommets for the pass through holes, and it can go lengthwise over hoses to keep edges from digging into the hydraulic hose, such as on the arms.(Use a cable tie or five to keep it on.)​

I'm a big fan of spiral wrap, but for some openings, such as the one below the control panel, a grommet makes more sense.

All the best,

Peter

I知 a big believer in preventive maintenance, guess I'll go over all of mine to make sure there are no rub points. Thanks

 

[woodlandfarms]

I just went through this whole hose issue and am continuing to struggle with leaks in my tunnel (I think I have the culprit, and as it is only a drip I am letting it slide).

I have identified a number of hoses that are weather checked, cracked on the outside covering, but are not leaking but will be replaced of the winter.

You asked about wrenches. I spent over $200 on two sets of wrenches that have worked out pretty good for me....

The first set is something like this

Northern Industrial 14-Pc. Angle Wrench Set | Angle + Box Wrenches | Northern Tool + Equipment

The second are Crows Feet - THIS IS NOT THE SET I WOULD RECOMMEND - TOO LARGE BUT IS AN EXAMPLE - (edit)

Grip 14-Pc. 1/2in. Drive Jumbo Crowfoot Set | Crows Feet | Northern Tool + Equipment

You need to bring a helping load of grumbling, cursing, and patience. Unless you want to do a big teardown, getting to the hoses is trying, but doable.

Finally a regular set of wrenches is needed. Also Shorties if you can find them. The biggest I think PT has is 1 - 1/4" on our PT's but yours might have up to 1.5"

As for dumping 2 quarts, that is worrying. An air bubble I guess could be possible, but... It should be quite clear the general area you are dumping in if indeed you are dumping anything...

Carl

 

[ponytug]

Thanks. I have a few shorties, but not enough, and I can certainly use the 90 degree wrenches. A couple of hoses seem to have ~ 15degrees of work room, so the crow's feet look useful.

I think the biggest hose is the suction hose into the hydraulic filter, which is 1.25".

Still working on finding the leak. I think it is at the wheel motor. It seems to be weeping out of the side of the casing, about two and half inches outboard of the hose connections. Ideas?

All the best,

Peter

I just went through this whole hose issue and am continuing to struggle with leaks in my tunnel (I think I have the culprit, and as it is only a drip I am letting it slide).

I have identified a number of hoses that are weather checked, cracked on the outside covering, but are not leaking but will be replaced of the winter.

You asked about wrenches. I spent over $200 on two sets of wrenches that have worked out pretty good for me....

The first set is something like this

Northern Industrial 14-Pc. Angle Wrench Set | Angle + Box Wrenches | Northern Tool + Equipment

The second are Crows Feet

Grip 14-Pc. 1/2in. Drive Jumbo Crowfoot Set | Crows Feet | Northern Tool + Equipment

You need to bring a helping load of grumbling, cursing, and patience. Unless you want to do a big teardown, getting to the hoses is trying, but doable.

Finally a regular set of wrenches is needed. Also Shorties if you can find them. The biggest I think PT has is 1 - 1/4" on our PT's but yours might have up to 1.5"

As for dumping 2 quarts, that is worrying. An air bubble I guess could be possible, but... It should be quite clear the general area you are dumping in if indeed you are dumping anything...

Carl

 

[Barryh]

Dear Barry,

There is quite a bit of advice on how to prevent rubs in the archives, but old hose can be made into some useful parts. You can slice it lengthwise and use it to make grommets for the pass through holes, and it can go lengthwise over hoses to keep edges from digging into the hydraulic hose, such as on the arms.(Use a cable tie or five to keep it on.)​

I'm a big fan of spiral wrap, but for some openings, such as the one below the control panel, a grommet makes more sense.

All the best,

Peter

Good advice Peter, on the split hose protection your right. I've lined the front cutout hole where I found hydraulic hose's rubbing. I noticed notches or wear on two of them. Picture below of the fix. That was last year so far it has worked great. Guess I should be checking the ones down in the engine compartment also. Never thought of vibration doing any damage.

 

[ponytug]

Just FYI:
In 4.5 hours of tractor use, two of the drive hoses had rubbed down to bare metal on the bottom of the tub.

On my 1445, one of the brake hoses in the tub has about 11 other hoses resting on it. Yes, Virginia, it will probably need some spiral wrapping. All the brake hoses cross rather sharp edges just as they enter the motor housings, and two of mine had minor nicks in them already.

Good advice Peter, on the split hose protection your right. I've lined the front cutout hole where I found hydraulic hose's rubbing. I noticed notches or wear on two of them. Picture below of the fix. That was last year so far it has worked great. Guess I should be checking the ones down in the engine compartment also. Never thought of vibration doing any damage.